Religion and spirituality

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I know exactly what you mean, religions are actually a lot of fun to study because you find so many similiarities between them all

There are definitely similarities. Right now, though, I'm more interested in the differences.

No. I'm an atheist and a materialist.


My dad's an atheist, and my mum sometimes says she believes in God but I think she's an atheist too (she likes the community aspects of religion, and seems to 'believe in belief', as Dennett might say). There was very little religion in the household. At my primary school, I was exposed to religion a lot more, especially Christianity: they brought in religious speakers, we had to sing religious songs, religious stories were occasionally taught as fact (only the Christian stories, though), etc. I never took any of that stuff seriously, though. I've never been remotely tempted to accept any religious ideas.

In retrospect, it struck me as odd that the school wasn't more secular - I'm only 19, and I live in a fairly liberal, areligious area. However, I found out a few weeks ago that there's a small group of fairly hardcore Christians around here, and apparently some of them are involved in the school.


Christianity just seemed utterly ridiculous to me. As a child, I often read books and watched tv programs about evolution, space, ancient history, etc... I didn't see Christianity as compatible with what I learnt from that stuff. The answers given by Christianity, the way it approaches problems, the kinds of requirements it makes, etc, just didn't gel with my worldview. These points generalize to all religions.

Maybe the final nail in the coffin - although it was probably already long buried by this point - came when I was about 11. I bet my mum £100 that I'd read the whole Bible. I did, and what I read was more absurd (and more boring) than anything I'd ever imagined. (Once I finished it, I told her not to pay me the £100 and use the money for a holiday instead.)

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Last edited by you_are_what_you_is on 08 Jun 2011, 7:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Do you consider yourself religious, spiritual, or other?

Well, I do take pleasure in open-minded, religious debates and discussions. But, it really is just a bunch of silliness. So, I can be just as silly as they can be.

Do you follow the same path you were raised in?

I no longer attend any church.

If not, what made you choose a different path?

1. Church, like everything else, is about putting up with people, and I really can't put up with people.

2. After putting up with people all week in a "work" setting, the last thing I wanted to do was put up with another set of people on Sunday morning.

3. Going to church is a dumb activity.

4. I'm not interested in parting with my money too foolishly, especially after what I had to put up with to "earn" it.

No chuch, my black and white friend, that I have ever visited forces you to hand over money.

Of course there is gas.

And on the social side I know precisely what you mean.

Yeah, I've been to many churches over the years and I don't recall any of them forcing money from their patrons.

Do you consider yourself religious, spiritual, or other?

I'm spiritual, but not religious. I dislike things like dogma, ritual, and so forth. There are exceptions, but especially in the western world that holds true.

Do you follow the same path you were raised in?

I definitely don't. I was raised Christian, but I never bought it. I made gestures towards it to appease family, but they were hollow.

If not, what made you choose a different path?

Well, it just never seemed true. I didn't feel like pretending forever, although at various points I tried. I tried to act like I believed, hoping that true belief would soon follow... It never did.

I still felt the need to address that aspect of my being, and I went on to clarify my thinking on the matters.

Is there a particular path you follow now, or are you forging your own?

If the latter, what category best describes your spiritual beliefs?

I'm a pantheist. Probably really close to Buddhism or Taoism. But not quite identical to either... There are aspects of both that make me uneasy.

Some of them are more subtle than others, but churches generally don't exist without tithes and offerings. They are businesses, after all.

I would love it if you could explain this.

Ah, but they don't force you to give them money. They can make you feel obligated, but that's not quite the same thing.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wgm8VW-__ow&playnext=1&list=PLDB543B382AB089BD[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciI_VOyRTis&feature=related[/youtube]

Reincarnation is the biggest in the case of Buddhism. But that's just the most central. There are other beliefs that I just find too weird to buy into. Some unique to particular strains, but they don't fly with me.

Take this for example (text from Wikipedia (link)):

Buddhism has always recognized more than one Buddha. In the Pāli Canon twenty-eight previous Buddhas are mentioned, and Gautama Buddha, the historical Buddha, is simply the Buddha who has appeared in our world age. Even before the Buddha's Parinirvāṇa the term Dharmakāya was current. Dharmakāya literally means Truth body, or Reality body. However all of these Buddha are unified in two ways: firstly they share similar special characteristics. All Buddhas have the 32 major marks, and the 80 minor marks of a superior being. These marks are not necessarily physical, but are talked about as bodily features. They include the 'ushnisha' or a bump on the top of the head; hair tightly curled; a white tuft of hair between the eyes, long arms that reach to their knees, long fingers and toes that are webbed; his penis is completely covered by his foreskin; images of an eight-spoked wheel on the soles of their feet etc.

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Now, that's not essential Buddhism, and it's not something that every branch of Buddhism follows... but, that's the example of the kind of thing that I can't buy into.

There are parts of Taoism which deal with alchemy, energy flows and stuff like that... I don't find them very relevant either. There are polytheistic elements in some forms, and so forth. Taoism is pretty broad, so it's hard to pin down exactly what it is... But there are a lot of elements within it that really do speak to me.

pandabear, I know all about manipulation.

What, exactly, is it about reincarnation that you don't really like?



Huh... I always kind of liked that bit of Taoism. Could you elaborate on why you do not like alchemy or energy flows?