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Lene
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26 Jun 2011, 7:28 pm

Much as I love them, I don't believe service dogs should be allowed in schools. Nevermind allergies or the fact that some kids are scared of dogs, what happens if one bites a child? I know they're incredibly well trained, but all it takes is one freak incident and it would be a nightmare.

I think if you require a service dog, mainstream schools are probably not the way to go.

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If he was blind would they tell him he couldn't use his guide dog?


http://www.servicedogcentral.org/content/node/412

Just doing a quick google, it seems rare that children under 16 get guide dogs.



rabidmonkey4262
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26 Jun 2011, 9:07 pm

Lene wrote:
Much as I love them, I don't believe service dogs should be allowed in schools. Nevermind allergies or the fact that some kids are scared of dogs, what happens if one bites a child? I know they're incredibly well trained, but all it takes is one freak incident and it would be a nightmare.

I think if you require a service dog, mainstream schools are probably not the way to go.

Quote:
If he was blind would they tell him he couldn't use his guide dog?


http://www.servicedogcentral.org/content/node/412

Just doing a quick google, it seems rare that children under 16 get guide dogs.
I'm not sure you understand what "well trained" means. That means that they don't bite kids. Quite frankly, it's really rare that a dog bites a kid. In all the biting incidents, it's usually because the dog was poorly socialized, abused, and/or the kid was really annoying the dog-like pulling his ear or poking him. If a kid is allergic to dogs, then he can be assigned to a different classroom. Simple solution.


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Lene
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27 Jun 2011, 7:41 am

rabidmonkey4262 wrote:
I'm not sure you understand what "well trained" means. That means that they don't bite kids. Quite frankly, it's really rare that a dog bites a kid. In all the biting incidents, it's usually because the dog was poorly socialized, abused, and/or the kid was really annoying the dog-like pulling his ear or poking him. If a kid is allergic to dogs, then he can be assigned to a different classroom. Simple solution.


Thanks rabidmonkey, but I am familiar with the English language. Note, I was careful not to write 'when the dog inevitably turns rabid and mauls preschoolers'. :)

Since this issue is being dealt with in court, and the thread here is academic, let's not stoop to making assumptions about each other's literacy simply because we have different views on the matter :) .

Guide dogs are superbly trained and I have no doubt that this boy's is too, but as he is seven, I presume that his classmates are of a similar age. He may treat his dog with respect, but there is no guarantee that a class room of 7 year olds will do the same. The teacher can only do so much.

Usually dogs that bite have been abused, but not always. I don't think it would be much consolation to the family of a child that is bitten to be told how unlikely it was. For the dog's sake too, all it takes is one growl (or something mistaken for one) and it could have serious consequences.

I'm also not sure I agree with your simple solution to uproot a kid from his classmates and friends simply because he has the misfortune to be allergic to dogs. Why should one pupil's disability trump another's?

As I said, academic discussion. The courts have decided for the moment that the school must allow the dog, but I am interested in how they get around the issues that will now arise from its decision.



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27 Jun 2011, 11:04 am

Reading this actually made me angry :evil:
Who the **** do they think they ****** are those *************


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21 Jul 2011, 2:00 am

Lene wrote:
rabidmonkey4262 wrote:
I'm not sure you understand what "well trained" means. That means that they don't bite kids. Quite frankly, it's really rare that a dog bites a kid. In all the biting incidents, it's usually because the dog was poorly socialized, abused, and/or the kid was really annoying the dog-like pulling his ear or poking him. If a kid is allergic to dogs, then he can be assigned to a different classroom. Simple solution.


Thanks rabidmonkey, but I am familiar with the English language. Note, I was careful not to write 'when the dog inevitably turns rabid and mauls preschoolers'. :)

Since this issue is being dealt with in court, and the thread here is academic, let's not stoop to making assumptions about each other's literacy simply because we have different views on the matter :) .

Guide dogs are superbly trained and I have no doubt that this boy's is too, but as he is seven, I presume that his classmates are of a similar age. He may treat his dog with respect, but there is no guarantee that a class room of 7 year olds will do the same. The teacher can only do so much.

Usually dogs that bite have been abused, but not always. I don't think it would be much consolation to the family of a child that is bitten to be told how unlikely it was. For the dog's sake too, all it takes is one growl (or something mistaken for one) and it could have serious consequences.

I'm also not sure I agree with your simple solution to uproot a kid from his classmates and friends simply because he has the misfortune to be allergic to dogs. Why should one pupil's disability trump another's?

As I said, academic discussion. The courts have decided for the moment that the school must allow the dog, but I am interested in how they get around the issues that will now arise from its decision.


First of all, no, you don't have to be afraid of a guide dog biting a child. Pretty much the number one thing they're trained in is focusing on their human and not any other distractions. Even if they weren't, most guide dogs are picked for qualities that prevent this sort of thing — mostly, being gentle and tolerant of children.

Second, most schools have multiple classrooms per grade. If that wasn't the case and there was an allergy issue, the switching classrooms might be relevant, but I suspect it's not. In most cases the allergy would probably be quickly apparent, and either child could be switched in a day or two — which is something that happens in classes without any service dogs present. In all honesty it'd probably be much less of an adjustment for the allergic classmate to change rooms... but, again, it would probably happen after a few days. It wouldn't be a big uprooting. If the autistic boy came into the class mid-year, I would hope the school would be diligent enough to try and discover such problems before placing him in any particular class.

Third, guide dogs are a reality all over the country, and not just for autism and blindness. They've been in schools before without trouble and they will be again. If a child is scared, they'll need to learn to adjust. It probably won't be as hard for them as it is for most ASD kids. They're going to see other people with guide dogs in their life, and complaining that they're scared and that the dog should be removed isn't going to be an option in any other case. Besides, a guide dog is a silly thing to be scared of — like a scar, or any device that helps someone walk. Yes, children may initially be frightened of those things (there was a controvery not long ago about a disabled person being fired from a children's show because the kids who watched were scared of her, and just because she was missing a part of her arm and had since birth). That doesn't mean you should nuture the fear and punish the one they're afraid of. If anything, it could be considered an opportunity to teach classmates about guide dogs, about why the child needs his (maybe — although that should be discussed with parents first and made sure that it won't upset him), and about how some people need some help getting around and doing things they take for granted.

I'd be hard-pressed to believe the school's initial decision was based on valid concerns. If he didn't have the dog, they could easily have made up something about the student's behavior being "distracting." A dog would probably be less distracting; after a day or two most kids would be used to it. They're better at adjusting in those situations than a lot of adults give them credit for.