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The unbearable lightness of atheism

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14 Sep 2011, 11:54 am

Interesting article, even if it is a bit cynical.

http://www.abc.net.au/religion/articles ... 316962.htm


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blauSamstag
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14 Sep 2011, 3:56 pm

It strikes me as an article written by a man who has never known an atheist.

Spoken to some, certainly, but never called one friend and broke bread with them.



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14 Sep 2011, 3:59 pm

I tried to read the article but half way through lost the will to live.


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14 Sep 2011, 4:37 pm

Quote:
Our real problem today is the impoverishment of the modern mind, our inability to think properly about such elevated things as the Good, Beauty, Truth, Law, Love, Life, Death, Humanity, the End or Purpose of things, even Sex itself, without such ideas being debased by an incurious and all-pervasive nihilism.


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14 Sep 2011, 4:50 pm

Wow, he certainly knows a lot of adjectives to describe things he doesn't like. He should start a blog. It would be as meaningful as this article.



ruveyn
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14 Sep 2011, 4:58 pm

GoonSquad wrote:
Quote:
Our real problem today is the impoverishment of the modern mind, our inability to think properly about such elevated things as the Good, Beauty, Truth, Law, Love, Life, Death, Humanity, the End or Purpose of things, even Sex itself, without such ideas being debased by an incurious and all-pervasive nihilism.


What if these things do not make much sense?

Good? That is a matter of opinion. Beauty? A matter of taste. Truth can be rooted in fact. Law is arbitrary regulation. Love is a feeling. Life, well that is real until one is dead. And Death, that is the true reality. It awaits all of us.

ruveyn



blauSamstag
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14 Sep 2011, 5:02 pm

There are fundamental misunderstandings.

Quote:
And here we confront a desperate contradiction at the heart of so much atheistic hyperbole (accurately identified by Bernard Williams and others). The New Atheists rely heavily on the thesis that religion is the enemy of progress and human flourishing, and that once the last vestiges of religion are done away with, humanity will be far better off.


Atheists do not rely on a thesis that religion is bad.

Atheists rely on a thesis that religion is demonstrably incorrect.

It's only when the ethics of atheists are called into question that they (we) haul out the litany of evils that have been wrought by organized religion, by way of refutation of the attempt by religious bigots to claim the moral high ground.



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14 Sep 2011, 7:02 pm

Life was better when I believed in God. I didn't feel any sense of responsibility for anything, I didn't feel any kind of obligation to do anything for anyone. All the problems the world had, not my concern. It was all taken care of by the big man. Of course, life was also better when I believed in Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy. But then we all have to grow up sometime.



ruveyn
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14 Sep 2011, 7:04 pm

blauSamstag wrote:

Atheists do not rely on a thesis that religion is bad.

Atheists rely on a thesis that religion is demonstrably incorrect.



Or that religion is NOT demonstrably correct. Most religions are empirically unsupportable.

ruveyn



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14 Sep 2011, 7:06 pm

ruveyn wrote:
blauSamstag wrote:

Atheists do not rely on a thesis that religion is bad.

Atheists rely on a thesis that religion is demonstrably incorrect.



Or that religion is NOT demonstrably correct. Most religions are empirically unsupportable.

ruveyn


If you wanted to be technical about it, wouldn't atheism argue that religion is demonstrably incorrect, and agnosticism that it's not demonstrably correct?



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14 Sep 2011, 8:39 pm

Obres wrote:
ruveyn wrote:
blauSamstag wrote:

Atheists do not rely on a thesis that religion is bad.

Atheists rely on a thesis that religion is demonstrably incorrect.



Or that religion is NOT demonstrably correct. Most religions are empirically unsupportable.

ruveyn


If you wanted to be technical about it, wouldn't atheism argue that religion is demonstrably incorrect, and agnosticism that it's not demonstrably correct?


Some religions are just plain wrong, for example the Abrahamic religions and some are simply devoid of empirical content.

ruveyn



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14 Sep 2011, 9:19 pm

Obres wrote:
If you wanted to be technical about it, wouldn't atheism argue that religion is demonstrably incorrect, and agnosticism that it's not demonstrably correct?

Not necessarily. Some would argue that the absence of evidence is reason is sufficient reason for disbelief.



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14 Sep 2011, 9:32 pm

This writing should be banned from the internet. :P It's pretty devoid of meaningful content to engage.



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14 Sep 2011, 9:57 pm

Awesomelyglorious wrote:
This writing should be banned from the internet. :P It's pretty devoid of meaningful content to engage.


Someone out there will appreciate it despite its clear status as glib mental masturbation


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blauSamstag
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14 Sep 2011, 10:45 pm

Perhaps i should have been more clear, "incorrect" was the first thing i came up with after deciding that "wrong" was too vague. My excuse was that i was distracted by paying work.

But really, the linked article is just an opinion piece written for the consumption of people who already agree with it. Very heavy on popular accusation, very lean on reality.



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14 Sep 2011, 11:07 pm

blauSamstag wrote:
There are fundamental misunderstandings.

Quote:
And here we confront a desperate contradiction at the heart of so much atheistic hyperbole (accurately identified by Bernard Williams and others). The New Atheists rely heavily on the thesis that religion is the enemy of progress and human flourishing, and that once the last vestiges of religion are done away with, humanity will be far better off.


Atheists do not rely on a thesis that religion is bad.

Atheists rely on a thesis that religion is demonstrably incorrect.

It's only when the ethics of atheists are called into question that they (we) haul out the litany of evils that have been wrought by organized religion, by way of refutation of the attempt by religious bigots to claim the moral high ground.


Yeah well, in a lot of important ways, atheist ethics are lacking.

As an example, irresponsible human reproduction is a plague on western society. Any number of studies will reveal that the products (children) of single parent families are subject to neglect, and poverty, and generally make poor editions to society.

No Atheist ethical system I know of has an answer to this problem… But religion, on the other hand, is a great, informal regulator of irresponsible sexual activity!

When religious ethics prevailed, shame and other social sanctions kept welfare motherhood to a minimum.

What does atheist ethic have to offer?

We need something to help regulate irresponsible sexual activity and superstition aside, I’d rather it was shame than some overbearing law fueled by right wing resentment...

Bottom line, we need informal social regulation and Atheist ethics are far too candy-ass to do the job.

Quote:
Men are qualified for civil liberty in exact proportion to their disposition to put moral chains upon their own appetites.

~Edmund Burke


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