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Dione
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14 Oct 2011, 10:32 pm

My husband and I are talking about going to Japan next year, and are researching as much as we can about Japanese culture in order to not offend anybody. Both of us are likely Aspergians with no formal diagnosis, but several confirmations of possibly having it from friends who are diagnosed and one from a friend who is a psychologist.
We are very nervous about going without knowing how we will get along with the Japanese people. Neither of us likes social situations and both of us have little understanding of personal space. Is there anybody who has gone to Japan who can give us some insight on how we would be received?



Todesking
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14 Oct 2011, 10:47 pm

Don't the Japanese have a saying that says "The Nail that sticks out should be hammered down" But the good news is the Japanese see Westerners as foriegn and weird so they might not even notice your autism. I am sure if you smile a lot and try to use a lot of Japanese words or at least make an attempt to communicate with them they be nice towards you and your spouce. :wink:


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Angel_ryan
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14 Oct 2011, 11:29 pm

I'm going to Japan in the summer to visit an old transfer student friend who was interested in dating. He's Japanese and he likes me because I'm different from the NTs here. I understand a lot about Japanese socialization it's more tailored to the Aspie way of thinking in some regards. I also disclosed to him and he didn't seem to care. When I go down there I'm not going to advertize it. I do know that in Tokyo there are a lot of young aspie minded Japanese so there's no need to, while the older generations in the country side are not open minded to our ways of thinking. I feel I might do better in Japan.



Dione
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14 Oct 2011, 11:36 pm

Angel_ryan wrote:
I'm going to Japan in the summer to visit an old transfer student friend who was interested in dating. He's Japanese and he likes me because I'm different from the NTs here. I understand a lot about Japanese socialization it's more tailored to the Aspie way of thinking in some regards. I also disclosed to him and he didn't seem to care. When I go down there I'm not going to advertize it. I do know that in Tokyo there are a lot of young aspie minded Japanese so there's no need to, while the older generations in the country side are not open minded to our ways of thinking. I feel I might do better in Japan.


Thanks so much for the insight. In what ways are Japanese socialization tailored to the Aspie way of thinking? I know a little bit about the way the Japanese think about from a bit of research, but I'm afraid I know precious little about the culture. I know something of the cuisine and a little language and history, but outside of that, I'm mostly clueless.



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15 Oct 2011, 1:01 am

They dislike a lot of eye contact, they do a lot of bowing instead like when they thank someone or are receiving something. Get used to bowing if you go LOL. They like independence and working hard. A lot of them try to specialize in their own personal talents. They dislike change in their culture. Like you can't put sugar in green tea because sugar was never used in green tea ages ago LOL. They have a culture structured to routines particularity in speaking the language. They have a lot of phrases that are used everyday like ganbatte kudasai which means do you best. You'd say that to you're co-workers entering work. There are a lot of pro Asipe things about japan. I suggest doing more research or buying a book on the culture you'll notice a lot of pro Aspie things. My japanese friend actually likes NT things he loves Canada but hates Japan. So we're going to take turns visiting each other.



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15 Oct 2011, 1:04 am

Yeah, I always thought the Japanese culture was very easy to get along with.
Also, the religion they study (namely Buddhism or Shintoism) I think is a little geared towards the aspie way-of-thinking in some sense. As in, it abstracts things from personal interactions and instead focuses on reasons and results. It's not that everyone studies religion there, but religion is a part of their culture nonetheless.

There's just one thing, which I've read about Japanese culture a lot, which is that they expect people to be able to feel the mood. Basically, without even talking, you should be able to get an understanding of what people are feeling to some extent or something like that.
I'm sure it's not that complicated, and I'm over-analyzing it way too much.
And, as others have said, they already think foreigners are really weird anyways, so they likely won't think anything of it.



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15 Oct 2011, 1:36 am

I lived in Japan (Hikone, Shiga) for about ten months recently. Since I was there as a student I spent most of my time in my room and didn't get out too much but I did make some observations.

One of the things I noticed was the popularity of walls around private residences. Attaining a measure of privacy and solace from the outer world is very important. (You see this same attitude displayed in the tea ceremony and the aesthetic of wabi-sabi) This was something I certainly sympathized with.

Japanese will often greet you without looking at you; though you are still expected to respond to them. It takes a little getting used to.

I also got the impression that Japanese tend to be more reserved around strangers. In other words, they say one thing but might mean another for the sake of being polite. If you give someone a compliment they will probably respond by negating it in order to avoid seeming arrogant. It doesn't mean that they don't appreciate it however. (Sometimes Westerners feel offended when their compliments are refused.) This also means that you should be careful to avoid speaking well of yourself/your accomplishments/your family etc in order to avoid appearing arrogant yourself. It makes more sense when you study the language, the honorifics and humble expressions that you use when speaking about your own "in group" with outsiders. I would say that this concern with the in/out group is a defining characteristic of Japanese social interaction.

Public displays of affection between couples are generally frowned upon. Crying in public seemed to be more acceptable though.

If you visit any temples, be sure not to step on the elevated beam running along the frame of doorways. You're supposed to step over them, not on them.

Certain buildings require you to remove your shoes and wear inside slippers instead. You're also supposed to remove your shoes when entering fitting rooms at a clothing store.

The advice I was given as a student in Japan was to just be sincere and direct. I didn't have any negative experiences myself; my natural inclination to be quiet and reserved probably helped. But in the end you have to realize that as a foreigner you'll be stared at and treated as an oddity regardless of your actions. Honestly, it was kind of a relief since I knew I'd be a weirdo no matter what I did. I found Japanese people to be easier to interact with since they tended to be more predictable in their responses to strangers. It seemed like the rules of social interactions were more firmly established, ritualized even, so that (with a bit of study) you could know how you were supposed to act. Anyway, I hope some of this helps.



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15 Oct 2011, 2:08 am

Todesking wrote:
Don't the Japanese have a saying that says "The Nail that sticks out should be hammered down" But the good news is the Japanese see Westerners as foriegn and weird so they might not even notice your autism. I am sure if you smile a lot and try to use a lot of Japanese words or at least make an attempt to communicate with them they be nice towards you and your spouce. :wink:

The saying you are thinking of is this.
出る杭は打たれる。

* Deru kui wa utareru.
* Literally: The stake that sticks up gets hammered down.
* Meaning: If you stand out, you will be subject to criticism.
Anything that doesn't fit in is wrong and needs to be pushed down till it is is the Japanese way of thinking. Also if you are bad with crowds or lots of people at once be ready for those things in parts of Japan.



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15 Oct 2011, 7:09 am

My brother has lived in Asia for almost 20 years. He has many AS traits and says his differences are usually assumed to be just Western wackiness by the people he knows. I think the Eastern culture has a great emphasis on politeness so there's a good chance any inadvertent gaffe wouldn't be directly commented upon.


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ialdabaoth
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15 Oct 2011, 11:44 am

The Japanese term is "hikikomori". I would heartily recommend avoid using it in public, however; it's considered shameful.



Dione
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15 Oct 2011, 12:25 pm

As my husband and I were reading everyone's posts, we both were realizing that we will mostly get along with Japanese society. For one, I often don't look at people when speaking, but instead point an ear toward the person speaking to me. I find it too intense to look someone in the face, like I'm trying to assert dominance; plus it is easier to see if there is something dangerous when in a big city.
For another, my husband and I both do not like to be complimented. I hate it when people ask what I do for a living and when I respond that I'm a cook, they ask if I mean chef. No, I mean cook because I am very young, am fresh out of school, and have not yet earned that job title.
We could get used to bowing; that's no different than smiling when showing gratitude.
My husband jokes he's going to really stick out, since he's six feet two inches tall while I'm five foot four inches tall.
We researched the hikkimori while attempting research, and most scientists have no idea what disorder they might have because these people exhibit signs and symptoms comparable to severe AS, PTSD, and schizophrenia. We do, however, know that it is seen as shameful because the Japanese tend to think of themselves as being part of a whole and isolating oneself would be the antithesis (sp?) of this.



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15 Oct 2011, 3:37 pm

that's cool you get to go. it might take me a while to get there myself.

and after reading the posts and that the culture is geared toward aspie-ishness, it's no wonder i dig the culture, language and lifestyle so much.


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Dione
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15 Oct 2011, 4:52 pm

Simmian7 wrote:
that's cool you get to go. it might take me a while to get there myself.

and after reading the posts and that the culture is geared toward aspie-ishness, it's no wonder i dig the culture, language and lifestyle so much.

It's still in the consideration stages. We are discussing entering that thing through the Japanese Department of Tourism to get our air fare free, but we wanted to scope out the culture first before thinking of entering. We were intending on learning a little bit of the language as well, and my husband has something of a head start on me because of his obsession with how languages work.
Even if we don't get the free air fare, we are still probably going to go; it just means it won't be next year.



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15 Oct 2011, 5:07 pm

Dione wrote:
As my husband and I were reading everyone's posts, we both were realizing that we will mostly get along with Japanese society. For one, I often don't look at people when speaking, but instead point an ear toward the person speaking to me. I find it too intense to look someone in the face, like I'm trying to assert dominance; plus it is easier to see if there is something dangerous when in a big city.
For another, my husband and I both do not like to be complimented. I hate it when people ask what I do for a living and when I respond that I'm a cook, they ask if I mean chef. No, I mean cook because I am very young, am fresh out of school, and have not yet earned that job title.
We could get used to bowing; that's no different than smiling when showing gratitude.
My husband jokes he's going to really stick out, since he's six feet two inches tall while I'm five foot four inches tall.
We researched the hikkimori while attempting research, and most scientists have no idea what disorder they might have because these people exhibit signs and symptoms comparable to severe AS, PTSD, and schizophrenia. We do, however, know that it is seen as shameful because the Japanese tend to think of themselves as being part of a whole and isolating oneself would be the antithesis (sp?) of this.



I think that you'll like japan. Smiling is harder than bowing for me because I have difficultly using facial expression. Now "The Nail that sticks out should be hammered down" is becoming slightly more rejected by the younger generation. People in the art industry are being praised more for generating revenue and jobs for the country. The government is promoting creativity now in an effort to invent new things that will contribute to the country's economic future. Hikikomori are people who do often have autism, mental illness and most of the time both. It is very difficult for them in japan but I find that it is also difficult in our own culture in similar ways it's just less talked about there because the Japanese find it embarrassing and for people with those conditions it's easier to lock themselves in a room than face being in public. I have a lot of faith that in the future this problem is going to slowly resolve through better support resources. I myself am border line Hikikomori I can easily understand why they do it. The alternative for many people in those states is often suicide an so I'd prefer locking myself in a room.
YOU CAN FIND MORE INFORMATION HERE http://hello.iampingpong.com/?p=1728



Simmian7
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15 Oct 2011, 9:08 pm

Dione wrote:
Simmian7 wrote:
that's cool you get to go. it might take me a while to get there myself.

and after reading the posts and that the culture is geared toward aspie-ishness, it's no wonder i dig the culture, language and lifestyle so much.

It's still in the consideration stages. We are discussing entering that thing through the Japanese Department of Tourism to get our air fare free, but we wanted to scope out the culture first before thinking of entering. We were intending on learning a little bit of the language as well, and my husband has something of a head start on me because of his obsession with how languages work.
Even if we don't get the free air fare, we are still probably going to go; it just means it won't be next year.



i learned a bit, self taught.... i can speak some and read some romanji.... and it all started when i was 12 and began watching anime with subs...once i was older, i started watching movies with subs. i know of a web site that you can watch all sorts of anime and movies for free.


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*Christina*

It's like someone's calling out to me. Writing it all down...it's like I'm calling back to them.
(quote from August Rush; but used as a reference to my writing)
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My ASD AQ score is 42
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
#DemandCartoonDiversity


Kiseki
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16 Oct 2011, 8:25 pm

I live in Japan and I feel happy here, but of course I have the same problems connecting with others as back home. Here is even worse because of the language/cultural barriers. But Japanese people don't care what foreigners do, as long as they aren't committing crimes. Foreigners get a free pass and are automatically considered different, even if they aren't.

I wouldn't wanna be a Japanese person on the autistic spectrum though. This country sucks for mental health care. I have taught a few students with ASD. Their parents never even told me they had it, even though that could have helped me immensely to know off the bat (not like I couldn't tell anyway). I feel like such problems- and especially mental disorders- are really ignored here.


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