nice guys?

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I've heard guys complaining about "nice" guys having no chance or just getting used etc. I've heard this for years and tonight I am thinking about it so... I thought I would ask girls here what their experience has been with nice guys.

I've known loads of genuinely kind guys who have no trouble finding a date. I recently(literally fifteen minutes ago) had an awful experience with a slightly tipsy "nice" guy who I have known(been aquainted with, at least) since the 5th grade. I hadn't seen him in a few months but I guess he heard about my breakup in March, and I didn't realize it but he was flirting with me off and on all night. My girlfriend said he was but I never think people are flirting unless they are really direct. When I went out to the car to wait for my girlfriend he followed me out to our car, which was weird enough when he didn't seem to have anything to say, but then he blatantly says "I know you are single now..." and I cut him off and say "I'm not..." so he proceeds to call me a liar and talk about how nice he's been to me and how he's always getting rejected because he's too nice... and he was becoming visibly angry, which was scaring me because my girlfriend parked so far away from the place and there was really no one else around. I went against my own better judgement and said "Niceness is really only attractive when it seems genuine, and not done in effort to gain approval, because that's either insecurity or a cover for jerkiness." And he screamed "F*** YOU" and got in the way of me closing the car door. I was about to throw up I was so terrified when I heard my girlfriend yell "You alright babe?!" And this "nice" guy says "Oh, you're a dyke now?" And he just laughed hysterically and staggered back to the bar/club.

He's not just "one of those club goers" we were all there to support the music career of a mutual friend. When we left I stopped feeling sick and I sobbed for a few minutes because I honestly was thinking something like "great, my corpse is going to be a sex doll" and I've always found something to be really off putting about this guy, along with a lot of "perfectly nice" people I've known... I realized it's exactly what I said to him. Forced niceness strikes me as either stemming from low self esteem or as a cover for jerkiness. When a person is overly nice I assume they're just seeking approval, which doesn't mean they are a bad person but it doesn't show that they're genuinely kind... and kindness is rather attractive. So I was thinking that yeah, it makes sense that horrible people are attracted to overly nice guys who they can walk all over. I know loads of people who are kind but can set healthy boundaries... and I've also known lots of "nice" guys who seem to think of women in ways that lead me to think they'll be prone to being abusive when it turns out women aren't the helpless childlike creatures in need of a keeper of some sort that they're expecting.

I've just never heard a woman not being attracted to a guy because he hasn't called her enough nasty names or shoved her down a flight of stairs. I've been in only two serious relationships with guys and one turned out to be a psycho but he wasn't at all in the beginning. In the beginning I thought he was the sweetest person in the world but once he started using drugs he became a different person. The second guy was someone I was attracted to because he was so kind and intelligent etc. He became really insecure about not being able to find work and not being able to support himself and I think it was related to that, but he hit me a few times and ultimately he was the one to leave me. Even when women date jerks I hardly think that's the initial reason they are attracted to those guys.

Yet I've often heard that women only like jerks and we are experts at crushing hearts(as if we get some secret manual to love and how to break hearts) and it sounds like these people consider all women to be the same.

So ladies... what have you got to say for your jerk-loving, heart-smashing selves?

As if! If anyone has a secret manual on breaking hearts, it's them, not me!



I totally agree. Niceness-- as in sincere kindness, not some kind of act-- is pretty much my defining requirement. My second relationship had a lot in common with yours; it was his niceness that made me fall for him but he stopped seeming so nice pretty quickly when he got controlling and physically abusive. It was I who left him, precisely because I don't love jerks, but I wouldn't exactly say I did it for the fun of crushing his heart or something.

I don't have a clue what the "nice guys finish last" thing is all about, but maybe I'm just naive. I've heard other women talk about the appeal of "bad boys" and I just don't get it.

BTW I'm sorry about the incident you related. That sounds terrible. Drinking seems to bring a lot of unpleasant things to the surface for a lot of people. I have a completely un-scientifically-grounded idea that if you can talk to someone when they're drunk and they still seem nice, they probably really are, because the alcohol removes too many inhibitions to allow them to keep up some kind of facade.

I'm pondering this myself at the moment... I'm up so late (2:30 AM) because I couldn't get back to sleep, and started getting some messages that I thought were somewhat creepy from a guy I've been talking to who normally seems fine. I felt very uncomfortable but managed to put him off chatting on the basis that I needed to go back to bed (all lies, I just ran to safety at WP! muaha) but now I'm still worried about the tone he was using and whether I really want to meet with him now, and I'm disappointed because I was fairly interested before. Perhaps I'm just being paranoid because given my track record and inability to read people, I consider myself kind of a vulnerable person and I can just see myself being lured in by some kind of psycho. I've never forgotten what everyone says about how nice and charming Ted Bundy seemed

Yes! Ted Bundy! On that, my girlfriend, in the midst of my crying, said "I bet Cass chokes when he f***s, if they're still alive." Which was so vulgar and she delivered the line with a straight face, it cracked me up and I stopped crying.

But that's because it touched on an uncomfortable truth that anything could've come of that situation if she hadn't come out to leave when she did. I haven't the self control to cower and plead with someone not to hurt me.

As for your theory, I've never met a nice drunk who didn't seem nice all of the time, and I've seen most of my friends thoroughly sloshed.

The guy with the creepy tone in his messages... I think if your first instinct is that something is amiss, don't doubt yourself. He may not be some psychopath but if something puts you off about his tone there is probably a good reason for that even if it's not immediately obvious to you why it's so creepy. And maybe it is obvious to you, but in either case I just hope you put your own well being first.

Most females do not feel attracted by "nice" guys. end story.
I'm not going to say things in details but I think this is obvious.

Some people are disgusting, I'm sorry that happened to you. Clearly the unappealing thing about him was his niceness

In my experience (which is predominately with with 18-25yr olds)
people who are genuinely nice and kind spirited draw people in
whereas people who insist they are nice tend to be more off putting, because any "act" sets off alarm bells like crazy (always listen to your intuition if something feels off btw)

The warm friendly guy at a party is going to get a lot more play then the stranger trying to neg me at a bar.

One of my top 5 favorite things about my guy? How nice he is to my mom!


Guys with this complaint, in my experience, have a difficult time getting attention and so they think the guys who do get attention are jerks because they are jealous of them. Because they already don't really like or respect women all that much,they redirect those bad feeling and blame women for "only dating bad guys" which to me always sounds tinged with "you don't know what's best for you like I do" icky paternalism.

Genuine, thoughtful, kind men are the original star wars movies.
"Nice Guys" are the prequels. They try to market themselves at like the originals but they have no understanding of what makes the originals appealing and they're terrible.

thanks for the insight bro, it's not like op is specifically soliciting female opinions or anything...

Hmm...

I've never been in a relationship with a jerk. Back in my days of going out and having a bit of fun, I'm sure I briefly dated or mucked around with a few jerks, but I wouldn't know, because I didn't hang out with them for long enough to find out. If I am attracted to a guy in the "I want to get to know this guy and maybe fall in love with him one day" kind of way, then it is highly unlikely he will turn out to be a jerk. I've been in two long-term relationships and a few that lasted a few months. I don't really have many bad things to say about any of them, and one is still my closest friend.

So, I guess, I can be "attracted" to jerks just like any other woman can, when I've had a few drinks and can't judge properly. But most of the time, it's the opposite. I think I have a bit of a jerk-dar (lol) and those kind of guys don't do it for me. Yes, even the ones who other women will say seem really nice. I hear alarm bells when I come across people who are "too nice", and insincerity is repelling.

I like genuine nice guys. I really do.

I feel it's important to differentiate between a "nice guy" and a decent man.

One (the latter) is a man, while the "nice guy" is a immature little boy complete with the entitlement attitude (which is the most off putting thing) and child's expectations of the way the world should work, hiding in a grown man's body.

Decent good men are genuinely kind and authentic people. They know that there is a time and a place to be a good or bad boy. They are strong enough to be nice without being weak and they are strong enough to be bad when it's required - essentially they have a backbone. They know how to say no. Most importantly, they know how the world works and they know that it doesn't owe them anything.

I love decent men - they make my world go around, whenever I get my head out of my interests.

To me, the sterotypical "nice guy" described by the OP is no better than the sterotypical "bad boy", I have no interest, and no time for either of those.

Last edited by Kjas on 14 Jul 2012, 6:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

Thank you Kjas, I'm glad I have that effect on you .

You insult yourself, you compliment yourself (^), is there anything that you *don't* do to yourself?

Otherwise the rest of us will have nothing left to do!

Well, he certainly seems to have overcome his niceness in an awful hurry.

I guess the ladies must be fighting to the death over who gets him, huh? (sarcasm)

I really wonder - does a fellow like that actually like women? Sure doesn't seem like it. Gets me thinking about the "dyke" comment.

This. This. This!

So many people who think they're nice guys are just using their "niceness" as a weapon to get sex, the same way a jerk uses whatever jerky assets he has.

Perhaps it's a little vulgar, but I once heard that the "nice guy," as opposed to a genuinely good guy, is basically a jerk without b****. It's proven fairly accurate in my estimation, if only because, well... my father is a "nice guy." I've seen that up close and personally. In fact, I felt an emotional moment of epiphany when I first read an article on it.

This guy... well, he doesn't seem to have been a genuinely good guy, to say the least, and I'm very sorry that happened to you.

Oh believe me, there is something you can do, it involves a pitch and a spanked bottom, yours, of course.

Nice guys? Like this topic hasn't been addressed on this site somewhere between 20000-1000000 times.

Let's simplify this. Truly nice guys don't exist. Your mom made them up to scare you into eating your vegetables. You'd better eat your vegetables or the nice guy will get you.

<-------- Thinks Wolfheart and Kjas need to get a room.
Also to add to the topic, there are also "nice" girls who are immature jerks. What comes around, goes around.

I have to agree. But what gets me is many of the girls that I was interested in have said that they like nice guys. But then they date anyone but nice guys. I get it, you really don't like nice guys, its ok. But at least be truthful about it.

*ruffles his hair*

Hey - I keep everything in here PG. It's not my fault that Wolf doesn't venture into AAI and instead takes his frustration out here.

Those "nice girls" do my gender a diservice just as much as "nice guys" do yours a diservice. Furthermore, I end up picking up the pieces when they do that to my guy friends, so I am well aware of what they do and how they operate - and I don't have any time for that kind of girl either.

Last edited by Kjas on 14 Jul 2012, 7:03 am, edited 2 times in total.