question about meltdowns

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When my daughter has a meltdown she will repeatedly scream and shriek that she doesn't love me, she hates me, and that I am stupid. Obviously this doesn't give me a warm fuzzy. She always apologizes afterwards and says she does love me. I feel like an abused spouse or something though. Is this something she can help at all or is it really beyond her control? It's not something I'm going to punish her for saying because she's entitled to feel however she wants I suppose, but I guess I'd like to think she is just screaming the worst things in her head because she's having a meltdown and has gone beyond reason.

Also any ideas on how to end meltdowns, nothing much seems to help. I put a blanket around her but if shes REALLY mid meltdown she thrashes it odd, yells to go away, leave her alone, etc... which I try to do, but if we are in public... I have no idea what to do. She had an epic meltdown at the YMCA the other day and I was more or less just stuck till it was over because I had both kids with me.

I do not believe my kids can control what they say and do during meltdowns. Though my son never speaks and my daughter is only able to repeat phrases or words.

I have not found anything to shorten them. Just keep them safe until they are over. The best I think we can do is to try to prevent them from happening.

I'm surprised someone at the Y didn't offer you a room to go to...

I know when I have a meltdown I have absolutely no control over anything I say or do. If I'm not totally non-verbal I will scream things I don't mean like "I hate you!" and am ashamed afterwards.
I don't hardly have meltdowns anymore now that I'm an adult. I have learned they are much easier to prevent by reducing sensory overload and learning to identify emotional triggers than to stop once pushed over the edge.

Don't worry, I was that kind of daughter too and I loved my mother. I never meant it when I screamed bad things at her.
I also recommend introducing your daughter to earplugs as they help tremendously and do not discourage her from stimming (hand flapping, rocking etc.). I have had less anxiety since i started allowing myself to hand flap more often.
Here is a very good article on preventing meltdowns.
http://www.thinkingautismguide.com/2010 ... rting.html

I wish you the best!
-krazykat

Meltdown and all, it does sound like verbal abuse. My Aspie daughter is 12 and she has NEVER said anything like that. My Aspie husband had a time during which he started calling me names when he was pretty angry at me. It ended when I calmly told him if he ever did that again I was going to leave him. I meant it. He knew it. He never called me names again, no matter how angry he is. So I think he could control it when faced with something very serious. I think you should ask your daughter calmly not to call you names, at least. Calling you stupid should not be tolerated. I am sorry, but I do not think you can do anything to help your daughter calm down. But she can control herself. I do not know how old she is, but she should be able to control herself in public (unless she is less than 8, in which case she should start learning). A lot of Aspies learn how to control themselves. It is difficult, but not impossible. She needs to learn methods to handle stress, like to breath, to count, to stress and release. My daughter is doing great with techniques. If she disrespects you at home, just leave her alone. You should not stay there while she insults you. It is not healthy for neither of you.

InThisTogether- I think the Y was short staffed with it being a holiday weekend. She generally does repeat one or two phrases when melting down, usually it has something to do with why she melted down like "MY FACE IS WET!! !" This time She repeated over and over that she hated me and I should go away. Generally she yells the "I hate you" or "you are stupid" if she is having a meltdown related to a punishment (aka time out) or loss of something like when we were at the YMCA she initially started to flip out when she got her face wet, I tried to get her out of the pool area before she completely popped, so she could cool down, but she misunderstood my intentions (thought we were going home) and she exploded. So we did then go home once she eventually calmed down, at the very least we aren't going to reward the meltdown I guess. I'm always torn on that. I don't want to punish per se because she can't control it, but on the other hand moving forward like absolutely nothing happened kind of reqards her for not trying to get a grip or trying any of the calming techniques we practiced. I dunno, I always find this part really hard. At least in this instance once she got herself calmed she went willingly home and even said "I know we have to go home now, I lost it. Sorry mommy."

KrazyKat- She clearly feels bad afterwards, apologizes a bunch, and usually just wants to lie on the couch and vegetate after a meltdown. For ear plugs, are the foam ones ok for a kid or do they sell special "kid sized" ear plugs? I keep meaning to try this because I think it would help when we go someplace like the YMCA. I don't discourage any stimming unless it's gross or dangerous (she had one for awhile where she would spit and smear it around, yuck). Now I give her fidget toys and those seem to work pretty well.

Ilka- She is 5, but I made it absolutely clear that she was hurting my feelings and that calling people names and telling them they hated them wasn't a good way to handle her feelings. I have been practicing counting to 10 and breathing with her, but so far in the heat of a meltdown I haven't gotten her to actually DO it yet. If I can get a blanket or something on her before she completely blows her top, it helps tons, but we can't always get there in time.

My NT daughter always screamed those words in her angry fits.

Here is what I focused my brain on, even though I knew my daughter (being angry and not in a meltdown) theoretically had control of the words (based on how I'd seen a friend of mine handle something similar):

Young children have a limited vocabulary and they lack the tools needed to release their anger in a proper way. I would simply rephrase for her (unlike an AS child in a meltdown, my daughter was looking for my reaction) along the lines of, "I know you are very angry with me right now and it doesn't feel like you love me in this moment, but you'll say you love me again in an hour." And I'd smile. Not act in the slightest bit upset by or believing of the news.

When she was old enough and had more tools, then I started to tell her that these were hurtful statements and I needed her to stop making them. That love is something we give to others in a constant manner, and that doesn't go away just because we don't like someone in the one exact moment. We've also now had conversations about how some things said in anger can amount to verbal abuse and be damaging to the people she cares about, and that is why she needs to work hard on expressing her anger in appropriate ways.

There is a subtext, here, too, in that I think kids are sometimes looking to understand that you still love them through your anger, so that is important to talk about, as well.

Of course, the only thing I know without a doubt is that my daughter did outgrow it, by age 7 or 8 or 9 I think, although with an AS child the developmental timeline might be different, and some of the specifics in how to handle it might be different. Funny, my AS son never pulled that one, just my NT daughter.

I used to do this to my dad -minus the telling him I loved him after part -because I didn't understand the situation. He alwasy just seemed to get mad at me and started yelling and I didn't know that what I had said or done was wrong...so it just looked like he was out to get me all the time. I'd go upstairs and scream that I hated him.


Maybe your daughter isn't getting the full picture...or maybe she's just venting. I know I hurt my dad and I feel badly about it now -though a part of me still feels a little scared of him. Have you talked to her? Tell her how you feel, and perhaps relate your feelings to hers -I know when my mom tries to relate how she feels to feelings that I've experienced I understand better ('The way I feel right now is just like the time you were really upset' or 'you know how you feel when you need your space, that is how I feel right now.')

Good luck.

I never said anything like that, but I think that is because by the time I would have been able to articulate that, I knew not to say it.

When I thought it, here is what I meant:

I hate you=I hate that you have power over me and I think you are overreacting/being unfair etc. She might just mean she is angry, though, too, and does not know how to do anything other than lash out at you.

You are stupid=How can you not understand that I am right, or how manipulative my sibling is, or something similar. This again, could just be general, anger/frustration etc with you as the unfortunate target.

If she is melting down and saying that, I would at least look at it like she is being verbal as opposed to lashing out physically, so the animal brain is not completely in control. That is a good thing.

Saying it outside of a meltdown, would of course be a different thing, because she would have more self control.

I agree with others that as you talk to her about it, afterwards, enough, and she has better facility in emotional language she will probably alter what she says. She already regrets saying it, afterward,so you are a good deal there,already, I think.

She sounds sweet.

Just to offer another perspective, have you considered your own culpability in the situation which resulted in the meltdown? For example, were you aware that getting her face wet would be upsetting for her? Did you consider trying to just address that issue without trying to rush her off to another location? Is it possible that your initial reaction to her behavior made the situation worse? Looking back at some of the most difficult moments in public with my son, I realized that I was not paying close enough attention to his needs and the signs that he was unable to handle a situation.

Do not take the content of her verbalizations personally. Stay calm and do your best to find compassion for her in those difficult moments. If you want her to use calming techniques, talk about them before you go into a situation you know will be stressful for her and give her lots of support to successfully use them.

a lot of people have suggested ear plugs, but has anyone tried an mp3 player with head phones? My daughter is sometimes good at finding her own solutions. For her birthday she got a Tag reader (you know the little pen thing that you use with the special books and it basically reads the book to you or tells you facts depending on what you point to with the pen). The Tag reader happens to have the function of just reciting any of the books stored on it with out the book. The second she figured this out she started taking it everywhere with her, holding it up next to her head so she could hear it really well, even if it was noisy. We got tired of hearing it, so I bought her headphones for it. She basically listens to it non stop, even when we go out. I noticed she is a heck of a lot calmer. Yeah we have to get her attention to talk to her, but she seemed WAY more even. Is it because it's blocking out other noise? What is it? Should we try getting her a cheap MP3 player (so she can listen to music instead I guess?)?

I would give it a try, for sure. Especially since you can get "child safe" earphones to make sure she does not damage her hearing. Plus, as she gets older, it will be an "acceptable" thing to carry around with her, ykwim?

There have been many times in the past where I've felt like a "battered/abused parent" (if there were such a thing). Some days I've felt like I spent all my time in a warzone. As has already been said-the way to prevent this is to prevent the meltdowns to begin with. It's not always possible but you get better at it over time!!

Whether they control what they say or not??? Well that's tricky. Technically I think they could, but imagine accidentally hitting your thumb with a hammer-you could keep from yelling some choice 4 letter words-but do you? I think of a meltdown like a firestorm in the brain. They are pretty much just reactionary at that point because the "storm" is just too intense/painful for them.

My adult Aspie son never seems to get angry at anybody but himself. He has always had brief, but loud, outbursts, and usually says something like, "Why am I such an IDIOT?!?" or "Why can't I do anything right?!?" It makes me so sad that his anger is turned in on himself. These are the only times I hear any evidence of lack of self-esteem (although I read repeatedly that most Aspie's do suffer from low self-esteem, because of spending their lives trying to "fit in," and never feeling "normal").

Have any of you had experience (or heard of anyone having experience) with psycho-therapy by an expert in AS helping an Aspie to change his/her behavior with regard to having melt-downs? My son now has a child, and of course we worry about the danger of having an impressionable child subjected to the melt-downs. I would appreciate hearing anyone's experience with therapy helping to modify the behavior.

I can't talk during meltdowns, but if I could, nothing I'd say should be taken as badly as it would sound.