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bigbadbeast2007
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25 Sep 2012, 11:30 pm

It drives me insane I actually have to leave the room



redrobin62
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25 Sep 2012, 11:41 pm

The commercial for Subway's avocado sandwich drove me nuts because the actors in it chapped their food while they spoke in those chipmunk voices. Arrgghh!!



auntblabby
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25 Sep 2012, 11:53 pm

i hate having to walk on eggshells around some people. :roll:



one-A-N
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26 Sep 2012, 12:24 am

auntblabby wrote:
i hate having to walk on eggshells around some people. :roll:


They are not doing it deliberately. I have misophonia, which is what the OP is describing (intense distress at sounds such as eating and drinking). You cannot help it - it is probably hard-wired into the brain and it may well be hereditary. Many people who have it do not believe it is a preference or even psychological, but neurological. Many people with misophonia have tried CBT, drugs, all kinds of things, to cure this condition, and almost none of them work. Alcohol provides some short term relief, although it is not a good form self-medication. Some people are trying neurofeedback, although that is fairly expensive, and some audiologists have developed a treatment plan which is supposed to reduce (not cure) the distress of misophonia. It is a serious condition - the people who have it did not choose it.

I have both AS and misophonia, and I would say they are about equal in their impact on my life. You cannot just "get over" misophonia - you cannot get used to the sounds. Attempts to try desensitization, in fact, have tended to worsen the condition. It feels to me like an electrode is stuck straight into the anger center of the brain and given a shock whenever a "trigger sound" is made.

One prominent neurological researcher is looking at the possibility that it works a bit like synesthesia. Just as people with synesthesia will see particular sounds as colors, so too people with misophonia will experience particular sounds as intense stimulation of the fight-or-flight center of the brain. Many people with misophonia also have other forms of sensory processing irregularities, e.g. I find moving crowds unpleasant - "scratchy" - when I look at them. The point of the comparison with synesthesia is that the brain sometimes has extra neural connections between regions that are not normally connected (like hearing and vision) - hence the unusual experiences of sounds as colors. If the abnormal connections lie between hearing and the amygdala, say, then particular sounds might be experienced as intense threats (distress, anger) without any intervening thought processes (i.e. this is not a cognitive problem, the result of faulty thinking, but a neurological problem, the result of faulty wiring in the brain).

And I could well imagine an NT saying "i hate having to put up with people who have AS" - but that is not helpful. The same thing applies to comments about misophonia.



EstherJ
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26 Sep 2012, 12:38 am

I have accommodations because of this.

I will hear someone chewing (swallowing is worse), and start pouring sweat...adrenaline will rush through me...I have to start tapping to regulate the sound...I get intensely angry and sad and despairing at the same time...I can't describe it...something switches off in my mind and my emotions, especially anger, rockets out of control.
I usually start crying and have to rock....sometimes I can't help but curse....

Thank G-d my school lets me take tests in quiet rooms....

Classes are harder...You just can't walk out.



EstherJ
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26 Sep 2012, 1:59 am

one-A-N wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
i hate having to walk on eggshells around some people. :roll:


They are not doing it deliberately. I have misophonia, which is what the OP is describing (intense distress at sounds such as eating and drinking). You cannot help it - it is probably hard-wired into the brain and it may well be hereditary. Many people who have it do not believe it is a preference or even psychological, but neurological. Many people with misophonia have tried CBT, drugs, all kinds of things, to cure this condition, and almost none of them work. Alcohol provides some short term relief, although it is not a good form self-medication. Some people are trying neurofeedback, although that is fairly expensive, and some audiologists have developed a treatment plan which is supposed to reduce (not cure) the distress of misophonia. It is a serious condition - the people who have it did not choose it.

I have both AS and misophonia, and I would say they are about equal in their impact on my life. You cannot just "get over" misophonia - you cannot get used to the sounds. Attempts to try desensitization, in fact, have tended to worsen the condition. It feels to me like an electrode is stuck straight into the anger center of the brain and given a shock whenever a "trigger sound" is made.

One prominent neurological researcher is looking at the possibility that it works a bit like synesthesia. Just as people with synesthesia will see particular sounds as colors, so too people with misophonia will experience particular sounds as intense stimulation of the fight-or-flight center of the brain. Many people with misophonia also have other forms of sensory processing irregularities, e.g. I find moving crowds unpleasant - "scratchy" - when I look at them. The point of the comparison with synesthesia is that the brain sometimes has extra neural connections between regions that are not normally connected (like hearing and vision) - hence the unusual experiences of sounds as colors. If the abnormal connections lie between hearing and the amygdala, say, then particular sounds might be experienced as intense threats (distress, anger) without any intervening thought processes (i.e. this is not a cognitive problem, the result of faulty thinking, but a neurological problem, the result of faulty wiring in the brain).

And I could well imagine an NT saying "i hate having to put up with people who have AS" - but that is not helpful. The same thing applies to comments about misophonia.


Ok, I have NEVER heard that before!
I have three different types of synesthesia - ticker tape, motion > sound, and calendar/number.
But your comment on crowds made me wonder.
My senses are really strong (except for smell - maybe my brain got less "wiring" in that area), and it all has this weird extra dimension. For example, I was looking at my skirt pattern today, and it had flowers on it. I saw the pattern and I felt the flower, heard the rustle of the petals, perceived its "movement" (not hallucinating, it was all in my head, just like my synesthesia is). But my mind focuses in on little details and makes a whole sensory experience out of them.
Take swallowing, for example. I hear someone swallow and its like a river running down my spine; a trickle of water that drives one mad...
Chewing and popping gum is like little electrical sparks - like those popper firecrackers...

Ok, I'm rambling. But I don't know what these experiences would be. They happen all the time. I promise, I don't take any kind of drug.



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26 Sep 2012, 8:08 am

I am not bothered by it. It's actually comforting sometimes.


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26 Sep 2012, 9:39 am

We play music at dinner quite a bit because of this.



auntblabby
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26 Sep 2012, 11:26 pm

one-A-N wrote:
And I could well imagine an NT saying "i hate having to put up with people who have AS" - but that is not helpful. The same thing applies to comments about misophonia.

thank you for the lucid and concise explanation :idea: it belongs in the dictionary under misophonia :thumleft: but just the same, i feel like a skunk around such people, they hate me for something that comes naturally to me, iow when i chew food even with my mouth closed noises will still unavoidably be emitted.



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27 Sep 2012, 12:28 am

I also hate chewing noises or loud breathing noises, sniffing noises and swallowing/gathering up saliva to swallow noises especially when everything is really quiet and all you hear them. I often make noise to try to drown these noises out.......which caused a lot of problems when my sister still lived at home and would try to study quietly.....(I could hear her noises from my room.....our walls are paper thin)...........



one-A-N
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27 Sep 2012, 11:06 pm

auntblabby wrote:
one-A-N wrote:
And I could well imagine an NT saying "i hate having to put up with people who have AS" - but that is not helpful. The same thing applies to comments about misophonia.

thank you for the lucid and concise explanation :idea: it belongs in the dictionary under misophonia :thumleft: but just the same, i feel like a skunk around such people, they hate me for something that comes naturally to me, iow when i chew food even with my mouth closed noises will still unavoidably be emitted.


It is not hatred of you, it is hatred of the sound. My wife is probably my biggest "trigger" person, because I cannot get away from the sounds as easily.. But I don't hate her at all. I don't fantasise about harming people who make the sounds. I just want them to stop. I know the sounds are natural. That knowledge just doesn't stop them from being excruciating.

I do understand too that it is very unpleasant being on the other end of this sound-hatred. One of my daughters has this condition as well (just one of many examples of misophonia running through families) and I am her main "trigger person". I understand what it is like to be always trying to avoid the sounds you think will aggravate the other person. I have to "walk on eggshells" around her. It is just that I do understand what she is feeling, and it isn't personal. It is a difficult problem - especially in families. I grew up trying to hide my condition from mjy parents while white-knuckling my way through excruciating mealtimes. No wonder my teeth are ground down!

Misophonia is a curse, and it doesn't help that few professionals know much about it. There has been only one or two journal articles about it - one from some psychiatrists in Vancouver. I belong to an online forum for people with misophonia - it has over 2000 members - and most are extremely relieved to find a group that understands them. In some ways that is like discovering as an adult that you have AS. That is what happened to me: a couple of years ago I discovered that I was on the spectrum and also that other people have this weird sound sensitivity that I have. It has been an amazing time - yay for the Internet.

So, I am sorry that you have experienced the unpleasantness of being the "trigger". I have been both sufferer and trigger - I understand both sides.



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28 Sep 2012, 12:15 am

i've found wearing an mp3 player to be effective at masking lots of offensive sounds. :idea:



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28 Sep 2012, 12:48 am

auntblabby wrote:
i've found wearing an mp3 player to be effective at masking lots of offensive sounds. :idea:


Yep. I do that a lot. I wear earphones on the train each day because it is possible to be trapped with people who are eating or drinking or just being noisy. But at home, people sometimes get offended if you wear earphones - they take it personally. And you also can miss a lot of things that you do want to hear. Mind you, I do know one or two people with misophonia who have contemplated making themselves intentionally deaf - e.g. either by having an operation or by injuring their ear drums. Rather drastic, but people vary in the intensity of their misophonia: some find it annoying while others find it sheer hell.

Misophonia is a social curse.



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28 Sep 2012, 11:06 pm

further mp3 player thoughts-
use the player as a tool, when you don't see anybody gesturing towards you or beckoning you, listen to the player so as to be distracted from other unpleasant sounds. or consider making your own white/pink noise mp3s to play on the mp3 player, these are not as distracting as music but they will better enable you to keep up with the dinner table conversation while partially muffling the most egregious noises. :idea:



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29 Sep 2012, 4:10 am

auntblabby wrote:
further mp3 player thoughts-
use the player as a tool, when you don't see anybody gesturing towards you or beckoning you, listen to the player so as to be distracted from other unpleasant sounds. or consider making your own white/pink noise mp3s to play on the mp3 player, these are not as distracting as music but they will better enable you to keep up with the dinner table conversation while partially muffling the most egregious noises. :idea:



Yeah, but what do you do when you're a college student in class? Professors would have a fit about headphones, and I need to hear their lectures. And EVERYONE eats during class, or chews gum, or drinks. EVERYONE.



one-A-N
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29 Sep 2012, 5:35 am

auntblabby wrote:
further mp3 player thoughts-
consider making your own white/pink noise mp3s to play on the mp3 player, these are not as distracting as music but they will better enable you to keep up with the dinner table conversation while partially muffling the most egregious noises. :idea:


You can easily find pink, white and brown noise MP3s for free on the web. I have them. But they make hearing conversation difficult. AND ... if you have misophonia, you may well react to the partially muffled sound anyway. Misophonia is not related to the volume of the sound - it is not a problem with loud chewing noises, but with any audible chewing noises. It is a bit like those Aspies who react strongly to light touches on their skin. I find that unless I have complete blockout of the sound, the earphones don't stop the misophonia. That is fine on the train when I don't want or need to listen to anyone else - I can be in my little sound cocoon and read books or watch movies on my tablet. It isn't OK when I am with family or friends, however. Unfortunately there is no simple solution - I have had this condition for well over 40 years now. Occasionally, I just have to have a glass of wine or other alcoholic drink to get through a situation (sitting at table with a noisy open-mouthed eater or slurper). It is the only legal drug that provides (temporary) relief from misophonia.

I am closely following the reports of some people who are undertaking neurofeedback to treat their misophonia. It is expensive and it appears to take from 30 to over 100 sessions (!), but a few people claim that it has substantially cured them - presumably by retraining the parts of the brain involved in misophonia. I think it is too early to make a call about the effectiveness of that treatment, especially when it is costly, but an effective, lasting treatment would be great. There is a small amount of neurological research under way, and some other professions are also trying to develop coping strategies for people with misophonia. It is all so new to health professionals, however, and most have never heard of it.

Fortunately, long ago when I was in high school, people were not allowed to eat or drink in class, and chewing gum was absolutely forbidden at school - it was equated with vandalism, because of the need to clean off dried gum stuck under desks. So I was only exposed to misophonia in any frequency at home (the family dinner table was torture). I tried to wear earplugs, but got into trouble for not answering my father when he asked me questions. Restaurants are not so bad, because there is so much background noise that the trigger sounds are usually masked - and there is often a glass of wine to help. Trains and elevators are a problem, so I wear earphones in those places. And work can occasionally be a problem but I can wear earphones at my desk, and I have my own office. Home is still a significant problem area, and some public places where both conversation and eating a drinking are frequent. My Aspie tendency to spend lots of time alone is further complicated by my misophonic tendency to avoid any situation where people are eating or drinking in small groups (e.g. 2 or 3 people having supper while watching TV).