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KenG
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30 Nov 2012, 3:25 pm

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Thorkil Sonne is betting that, given the right environment, an autistic adult could not just hold down a job but also be the best person for it:
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/02/magaz ... ntage.html


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dyingofpoetry
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30 Nov 2012, 6:57 pm

I think my autistic superpowers are pretty amazing myself!


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30 Nov 2012, 9:31 pm

AH! I remember listening to a podcast on this story a couple years back!! Wondered if I'd find it elsewhere!! Thank you for finding it :)


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AgentPalpatine
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30 Nov 2012, 11:21 pm

There was a thread about this article in General Discussion, but few posts. I'll post my (edited) thoughts.

I read the article and skimmed the 83 comments to date (as of Thursday). It was an early release for the Sunday paper.

The author is a Pulitizer Prize winning science writer who specializes in neurology. I'm not familar with his other writings.

The author was careful to represent both the positive and the negative sides of the story, pointing out the accommodations made, the successes of the program, and the unfortunate failures.

The descriptions of the positive side of the program were balanced with negative sides, for instance noting the employee who talked about train disruptions every time there was a storm (which I gather happens regularly in Copenhagen), and the employee who didn’t bring in a cake on Fridays to an office where cake was always brought in.

The story made clear that this program has so far had a 1 in 6 success rate at planting employees with employers, and the difficulty in explaining the failed placements to hopeful parents.

I'm not sure if some of the story is the result of cultural differences, where something’s are more easily discussed in Denmark, but they would never be conveyed in a business/science/cultural story in the New York Times. I believe that the cultural aspect of the story may have played a part in the article.

The comments were the usual split of comments on a story about autism. I expect many more comments after the story has circulated on the web for a few days. It was trending on Google as of this morning.



Ellingtonia
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01 Dec 2012, 3:44 am

AgentPalpatine wrote:
The story made clear that this program has so far had a 1 in 6 success rate at planting employees with employers, and the difficulty in explaining the failed placements to hopeful parents.


I believe the one in six referred to the rate of autistics who were able to join the program after being interviewed, not the rate of people who were successful at their placements. Although maybe you consider not being placed at all as a failed placement, so I'm not sure if I'm correcting you or clarifying you. Here's the relevant part of the article anyway:

"Autistic people, like everyone else, have diverse abilities and interests, and Specialisterne can’t employ all of them. Most people Specialisterne evaluates in Denmark don’t have the right qualities to be a consultant — they are too troubled, too reluctant to work in an office or simply lack the particular skills Specialisterne requires. The company hires only about one in six of the men and women it assesses."



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01 Dec 2012, 9:25 am

Very good article. It makes a genuine case for using the diverse skills people have - not emotion-based fluff about how we're all valuable, but a rational argument (in a word: specialisation). He's done very well to get as far as he has, but I'm not sure how scalable it is. Tolerating all the quirks of your autistic employees must be very difficult and I sure wouldn't be able to put up with that kind of stuff. Raising an autistic child of his own probably helped there. Interestingly, the article makes no mention of the challenges of signing up employers, which I imagine would be the hardest part of all.



Oodain
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01 Dec 2012, 10:05 am

there is another danish intitiative called aspIT, alex held a talk at one of their conferences.

aspIT is very similar to specialisterne, but they also offer a specially laid out education minded specifically towards people with ASD's


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AgentPalpatine
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01 Dec 2012, 10:05 am

Ellingtonia wrote:
AgentPalpatine wrote:
The story made clear that this program has so far had a 1 in 6 success rate at planting employees with employers, and the difficulty in explaining the failed placements to hopeful parents.


I believe the one in six referred to the rate of autistics who were able to join the program after being interviewed, not the rate of people who were successful at their placements. Although maybe you consider not being placed at all as a failed placement, so I'm not sure if I'm correcting you or clarifying you. Here's the relevant part of the article anyway:


Ellingtonia, You are correct, that's what I get for reading the article on a smartphone.

FMX, the writer is a science writer, that may explain why the article did not cover ther employer portion.



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01 Dec 2012, 11:11 am

awesome,go Danmark.

my grandmother cena marjorie rassmusen would be proud


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SpiritBlooms
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01 Dec 2012, 11:45 am

..



Last edited by SpiritBlooms on 04 Dec 2012, 1:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

vermontsavant
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01 Dec 2012, 1:46 pm

SpiritBlooms wrote:
Interesting, but didn't we already know that many Aspies can be successfully employed? There's such a broad range - the word "spectrum" isn't used by accident. I'm living proof of the possibility. What I worry about is that people will read this article and assume that any Aspie that legitimately can't be employed is just milking the system. People who don't understand will point and say look, those people go out and make a living, why don't you?

I worked - successfully - at jobs for more than 25 years. I loved and thrived at doing technical writing-editing. But I also wound up eventually in a higher level position that I wasn't suited for. In management - and aren't we all encouraged by the higher pay to seek such positions? - the strengths of an Aspie are rather lost, and the stress can be incredible.
i think the individual featured in the arcticle has classic autism not AS


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dyingofpoetry
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02 Dec 2012, 12:39 pm

Quote:
i think the individual featured in the arcticle has classic autism not AS


Can we use terms like Kanner's autism, non-verbal, or deep-end spectrum, or something like that instead of "classic autism," because, personally, I happen to consider myself a classic! :P


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AgentPalpatine
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02 Dec 2012, 12:47 pm

Taking a step back from this article, I think that we really have to see this past week as an important week for Activism in it's many forms. This NYT article would not have been possible if not for the work of one concerned parent in Denmark, who is now working to bring his ideas to the United States. Even the article would not be possible if not for the work of thousands of individuals, both on and outside the spectrum, who have worked to show positive person-first concepts to the media and society at large.

Also this week, Thursday saw the success of advocacy with the political system in the United States. ASAN mounted a lobbying campaign on short notice to get invited before the US House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform hearing on Autism on November 29th. Just to be able to get on the speaking list so quickly was an impressive achievement, and to be able to present a person-first concept before the commitee was outstanding.

We need to follow up with these successes.



antifeministfrills
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12 Dec 2012, 5:13 pm

dyingofpoetry wrote:
Quote:
i think the individual featured in the arcticle has classic autism not AS


Can we use terms like Kanner's autism, non-verbal, or deep-end spectrum, or something like that instead of "classic autism," because, personally, I happen to consider myself a classic! :P


kanner's autism and nonverbal aren't synonymous though, are they?



Buttersboy142
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12 Dec 2012, 8:37 pm

This stuff really cheers me up. It's nice knowing that we can be seen as advantageous in some ways rather than a burden.



androbot2084
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14 Dec 2012, 6:46 pm

So the autism advantage is the advantage of the superhuman?