Can you have narcissistic traits together with aspie traits?

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hey_there
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17 Dec 2012, 7:33 pm

I think I may have a few of both, but not enough of either for a diagnosis of Aspergers or NPD. How common is that? :?

I have some traits which may be narcissistic and these. which i know are something else.
Like,
* poor hygiene
* can't "read between the lines" when someone is talking
* don't understand sarcasm at all and I take everything literally :oops:
* and others that are aspie



windtreeman
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17 Dec 2012, 9:05 pm

I could be wrong but I think I saw a thread on narcissism here recently and a lot of people said they had some narcissistic traits. I, personally, can relate strongly to several symptoms in narcissism:

Hypersensitivity to any insults or imagined insults
Inability to view the world from the perspective of other people
Bragging (subtly but persistently) and exaggerating their achievements
(from Wikipedia)

But for all I know, the narcissistic traits could be developed mechanisms for dealing with some of the inadequacies caused by Asperger's Syndrome. For example, bragging or exaggeration in an attempt to better relate to or socialize with peers, hypersensitivity to insults because so often, for so many of us, conversations have imploded without ever realizing that we'd done something wrong and so on. I'm going to assume that very few Aspies develop narcissistic traits until later in life and instead, either adopt them in self-defense or an attempt to copy those we admire (film characters, actors, etc.) with the hope of achieving some of the success they embody. Think how narcissistic both Han Solo and Indiana Jones were (love 'em though!).


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hey_there
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17 Dec 2012, 10:09 pm

windtreeman wrote:
I could be wrong but I think I saw a thread on narcissism here recently and a lot of people said they had some narcissistic traits. I, personally, can relate strongly to several symptoms in narcissism:

Hypersensitivity to any insults or imagined insults
Inability to view the world from the perspective of other people
Bragging (subtly but persistently) and exaggerating their achievements
(from Wikipedia)

But for all I know, the narcissistic traits could be developed mechanisms for dealing with some of the inadequacies caused by Asperger's Syndrome. For example, bragging or exaggeration in an attempt to better relate to or socialize with peers, hypersensitivity to insults because so often, for so many of us, conversations have imploded without ever realizing that we'd done something wrong and so on. I'm going to assume that very few Aspies develop narcissistic traits until later in life and instead, either adopt them in self-defense or an attempt to copy those we admire (film characters, actors, etc.) with the hope of achieving some of the success they embody. Think how narcissistic both Han Solo and Indiana Jones were (love 'em though!).


Yeah, I have the second one you listed, you know, inability to view the world from the perspectives of others. I don't like insults either. This isn't related but how are you with sarcasm? I made a thread here: http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt218445.html



Stargazer43
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17 Dec 2012, 11:19 pm

I remember seeing a thread on here not long ago titled something like "Aspergers: the next step in human evolution". So yeah, you can have both narcissistic and aspie traits ;).



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17 Dec 2012, 11:48 pm

Meh I think you gotta be careful, narcissism is running rampant in our culture nowadays.

A true narcissist won`t be detected by answering a few questions.

It`s a constant thing. It`s common in my family, and I think it may be related to the spectrum in a way.

However things like risk tasking, bullying, and inability to rationalize ones faults typically goes with it.

Also there tends to be a cyclical need for attention that I don`t think most aspies seek.



aghogday
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18 Dec 2012, 1:25 am

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/article ... /table/T4/

At least in the table from the study linked above, it's pretty uncommon among individuals actually assessed with Asperger's as only 1 out 62 individuals with Asperger's was assessed with it.

While these two symptoms listed after this paragraph were described in Wiki for narcissistic personality disorder, they are also clinical features seen in some with ASD's, as a result of difficulties with social-emotional reciprocity, impairments in non-verbal communication, and the experience of being bullied and ridiculed in life, for not meeting the social expectations of others.

Hypersensitivity to any insults or imagined insults
Inability to view the world from the perspective of other people

I think the third brief characteristic, from Wiki of bragging about one's accomplishments and embellishing in subtle ways is pretty unusual for people with ASD's as a deficit of sharing one's accomplishments with other people is actually one of the impairments listed in the criteria for Autistic Disorder and Asperger's syndrome. I think in general, most people do that anonymously online more than they would in real life. So, a life online may make some people seem more narcissistic than they likely are in real life.

I do think in real life people who do continuously attempt to embellish their achievements in life, find themselves in a bit of a fix sometimes with folks with good rote memories who pay attention to detail that more often might notice when the details of a story about one's life continues to change in subtle ways. It's even easier to notice someone online doing this as there is usually a permanent record of words, and one doesn't even have to rely as much on their rote memory for those kind of details.



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18 Dec 2012, 1:50 am

windtreeman wrote:
I could be wrong but I think I saw a thread on narcissism here recently and a lot of people said they had some narcissistic traits. I, personally, can relate strongly to several symptoms in narcissism:

Hypersensitivity to any insults or imagined insults
Inability to view the world from the perspective of other people
Bragging (subtly but persistently) and exaggerating their achievements
(from Wikipedia)


Can you relate to them from the point of view of a Narcissist though? An autist's "hypersensitivity to any insults or imagined insults" is due to abuse, to feeling small, whereas a Nar's angry reaction to an insult is due to their ego. They don't fancy themselves to be small; they're above you. And if someone, in their own perception, is towering over everyone, they will possess an "inability to view the world from the perspective of other people". Don't expect anyone on the top (Nars) or the bottom (us!) to understand the plight of the regular people. Their bragging comes from the fact that they know they're really really really special, and they want to make sure you know they are too!



Ettina
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18 Dec 2012, 7:59 am

Aspies can be narcissists as easily as NTs can.



richardbenson
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18 Dec 2012, 10:21 am

If I'm not mistaken anybody can be diagnosed with a personality disorder. I have one, and if I remember correctly they develoup because of a tramatic upbringing?



Ettina
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18 Dec 2012, 10:50 am

Quote:
If I'm not mistaken anybody can be diagnosed with a personality disorder. I have one, and if I remember correctly they develoup because of a tramatic upbringing?


Some are, some aren't.

Borderline personality disorder is almost always associated with a history of severe childhood abuse. It's felt to be closely related to PTSD.

In contrast, schizoid and schizotypal personality disorder are strongly genetic conditions, which seem to have no parenting component to them.

Most of the others are a mix of genetics and environment. The environmental factor can be abuse, or it can be something else entirely. (eg Narcissism can be from being 'spoiled' as a child, leading to an inappropriate expectation that everyone else will be just as indulgent.)



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18 Dec 2012, 10:59 am

From what I understand, there's different degrees of self-love... No self-love would mean that you have low self-esteem. Some self-love is healthy and is considered self-respect. Too much would be narcissism. So yes, you can have narcissistic traits but it doesn't mean you're a narcissist.

Generally though, narcissists would not want to publicly admit that anything is wrong with them, so if you are wondering about it, you probably don't have it.



hey_there
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18 Dec 2012, 4:28 pm

deltafunction wrote:
From what I understand, there's different degrees of self-love... No self-love would mean that you have low self-esteem. Some self-love is healthy and is considered self-respect. Too much would be narcissism. So yes, you can have narcissistic traits but it doesn't mean you're a narcissist.

Generally though, narcissists would not want to publicly admit that anything is wrong with them, so if you are wondering about it, you probably don't have it.


I know I don't have the actual disorder.
I just have these traits:

I am annoyed by others' stupidity at times. This happens sometimes when I'm watching games shows. :P

I tend to hold grudges, even if the person gives a genuine apology for what happened. I accept the apology, but I still won't forget what happened.

I'm jealous of others who are better than me or have more than me or are luckier than me. (exp. if someone has worked hard and has finally achieved a goal, good for them, but if they they're just lucky and something good happens then I'm very unhappy .)

I am upset if someone does the same things I do and will apply rules when convenient (double standard)

I think some rules are dumb and I shouldn't have to follow them. (but I do follow them, though)

I am very impatient at times and can act immature (exp. If someone is looking at something that I want to look at I just take it. I will NOT wait for it)

I can be quick to criticize others

I am unable to feel empathy (not that I don't want to, I just can't)



Ravenclawgurl
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18 Dec 2012, 9:24 pm

Sheldon Cooper!



jcq126
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18 Dec 2012, 9:51 pm

Wow haven't posted here in a long time. I was diagnosed with Schizoid Personality Disorder + Narcissistic Personality Disorder after a few weeks of testing and evaluation with a psychiatrist. I still believe that it is a misdiagnosis for Asperger's though as an Aspie could easily come off as a Schizoid/Narc.



kat333
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18 Dec 2012, 11:24 pm

hey_there wrote:
deltafunction wrote:
From what I understand, there's different degrees of self-love... No self-love would mean that you have low self-esteem. Some self-love is healthy and is considered self-respect. Too much would be narcissism. So yes, you can have narcissistic traits but it doesn't mean you're a narcissist.

Generally though, narcissists would not want to publicly admit that anything is wrong with them, so if you are wondering about it, you probably don't have it.


I know I don't have the actual disorder.
I just have these traits:

I am annoyed by others' stupidity at times. This happens sometimes when I'm watching games shows. :P

I tend to hold grudges, even if the person gives a genuine apology for what happened. I accept the apology, but I still won't forget what happened.

I'm jealous of others who are better than me or have more than me or are luckier than me. (exp. if someone has worked hard and has finally achieved a goal, good for them, but if they they're just lucky and something good happens then I'm very unhappy .)

I am upset if someone does the same things I do and will apply rules when convenient (double standard)

I think some rules are dumb and I shouldn't have to follow them. (but I do follow them, though)

I am very impatient at times and can act immature (exp. If someone is looking at something that I want to look at I just take it. I will NOT wait for it)

I can be quick to criticize others

I am unable to feel empathy (not that I don't want to, I just can't)


Apart from the empathy and the impatience, I am all of the above.



hey_there
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18 Dec 2012, 11:48 pm

kat333 wrote:
hey_there wrote:
deltafunction wrote:
From what I understand, there's different degrees of self-love... No self-love would mean that you have low self-esteem. Some self-love is healthy and is considered self-respect. Too much would be narcissism. So yes, you can have narcissistic traits but it doesn't mean you're a narcissist.

Generally though, narcissists would not want to publicly admit that anything is wrong with them, so if you are wondering about it, you probably don't have it.


I know I don't have the actual disorder.
I just have these traits:

I am annoyed by others' stupidity at times. This happens sometimes when I'm watching games shows. :P

I tend to hold grudges, even if the person gives a genuine apology for what happened. I accept the apology, but I still won't forget what happened.

I'm jealous of others who are better than me or have more than me or are luckier than me. (exp. if someone has worked hard and has finally achieved a goal, good for them, but if they they're just lucky and something good happens then I'm very unhappy .)

I am upset if someone does the same things I do and will apply rules when convenient (double standard)

I think some rules are dumb and I shouldn't have to follow them. (but I do follow them, though)

I am very impatient at times and can act immature (exp. If someone is looking at something that I want to look at I just take it. I will NOT wait for it)

I can be quick to criticize others

I am unable to feel empathy (not that I don't want to, I just can't)


Apart from the empathy and the impatience, I am all of the above.
Wow! What do your family/friends say about that? Do they ever get really annoyed?