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pawelk1986
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25 May 2013, 10:23 am

I read article about lowering voting age to 16 to fight ageism :D , i think it's dumb idea and bad example to rest of Europe and World.

What's a sixteen year old can know about politics, except that this kid is easier to manipulate than adult. Maybe it's the politicians count.

Lowering the voting age is too dangerous for this reason that the national parliaments would be able to get celebrities the likes of Justin Bieber

Lowering the voting age is too dangerous for this reason that popculture "celebrities" like Justin Bieber can be elected as MP in National Parliaments, and it's step toward's idiocracy

Reducing voting is also dangerous because government maybe urgent be left-wingers to further age reduction, and someday 12 years old would have voting right and that is RIDICULOUS. It would be like gay marriage right, when they got what the wanted, they now want adoption rights.
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Jacoby
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25 May 2013, 10:52 am

Sure, let 16 year olds vote but make all voters pass a civics test then. Bet those left wingers would **** their pants at the thought of that. Just mining for votes and nothing more. Children's interests are represented through their parents.



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25 May 2013, 11:21 am

For the most part, politicians who have suggested this route have seemed to be those desperate for uninformed votes (ie- the Scottish National Party, the Parti Quebecois, etc) to push their sovereigntist agendas, though I am sure there have been some politicians not related to a secessionist movement who promote it


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25 May 2013, 11:34 am

One word: Prefrontal cortex.


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pawelk1986
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25 May 2013, 12:20 pm

GGPViper wrote:
One word: Prefrontal cortex.


Do you refer that teenagers, don' t have Prefrontal cortex :D It's open secret :D



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25 May 2013, 1:29 pm

Stupid idea. The voting age should be raised to 21 or above. Candidates for public office should only be those who have served honorably in their nation's armed forces - they know a little something about service and sacrifice. 16-year-olds know nothing about service, sacrifice, or even honor, so they know nothing about what it takes to run a country. They're concerned only with matters of vanity, popularity, entitlements, and doing whatever they want to do without anyone telling them 'No'. They'd make the perfect support group for any party that would promise them freedom and handouts, so of course any candidate or political party that is desperate for votes would want a constituency of ignorant and gullible people who are easy to manipulate.

Again, allowing 16-year-olds to vote is a stupid idea.



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25 May 2013, 2:01 pm

Fnord wrote:
Stupid idea. The voting age should be raised to 21 or above. Candidates for public office should only be those who have served honorably in their nation's armed forces - they know a little something about service and sacrifice. 16-year-olds know nothing about service, sacrifice, or even honor, so they know nothing about what it takes to run a country. They're concerned only with matters of vanity, popularity, entitlements, and doing whatever they want to do without anyone telling them 'No'. They'd make the perfect support group for any party that would promise them freedom and handouts, so of course and candidate or political party that is desperate for votes would want a constituency of ignorant and gullible people who are easy to manipulate.

Again, allowing 16-year-olds to vote is a stupid idea.


Allowing only people who have been in the armed forces will make for very few candidates in countries such as Japan, Iceland, the Netherlands and so on.
I've found it strange so many politicians have a background in law, but very few have a background in finance or economics. If often see politicians talk like idiots on these topics: "Greece is going to pay us back, with interest" when the reason for that loan was they couldn't raise money on their own.



pawelk1986
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25 May 2013, 2:36 pm

Fnord wrote:
Stupid idea. The voting age should be raised to 21 or above. Candidates for public office should only be those who have served honorably in their nation's armed forces - they know a little something about service and sacrifice. 16-year-olds know nothing about service, sacrifice, or even honor, so they know nothing about what it takes to run a country. They're concerned only with matters of vanity, popularity, entitlements, and doing whatever they want to do without anyone telling them 'No'. They'd make the perfect support group for any party that would promise them freedom and handouts, so of course any candidate or political party that is desperate for votes would want a constituency of ignorant and gullible people who are easy to manipulate.

Again, allowing 16-year-olds to vote is a stupid idea.



Allowing 16 years old to vote is not only bad idea is very bad idea not to say horrible, i think 18 is very god, and shouldn't be changed. But you saying only member of armed force should be to eligible to candidate, i think it's wrong in many ways. First militarization of society, second that would exclude many aspies from politics, because, not all of us are fit for military service



ruveyn
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25 May 2013, 2:45 pm

Jacoby wrote:
Sure, let 16 year olds vote but make all voters pass a civics test then. Bet those left wingers would **** their pants at the thought of that. Just mining for votes and nothing more. Children's interests are represented through their parents.


Who gets to write the tests? In the Southern states of the U.S. there was a time when Negroes were required to take a literacy test to determine if they could vote. No surprise that most failed the test and did not get to vote.

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25 May 2013, 2:54 pm

Nah, let’s raise the voting age to 100. Nobody knows how to live better than they do! Besides, it’d save a lot of hassle handling the votes and reduce immensely the chances for someone to tamper with them.


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25 May 2013, 3:06 pm

Frankly, the voting age should be 30. Young people lack the life experience to make sound political choices. Indeed it's easier to hoodwink the young into bad ideas because they are drawn to idealistic values that life experience would clearly says are unworkable.



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25 May 2013, 3:13 pm

I wouldn't say those above the voting age make any more informed choice to be honest, mostly that people are more or less opinionated.

However I would be against it, because it won't be any more democratic, and there needs to be a set age. Why change it?

One of the myths about voting it is it representational. It is a very, very minute part representational in any given election, and mostly about generating a result in the fairest way possible. From a a purely mathematical point of view, you can't model voter will in any given moment, and besides people are incredibly fickle as it is. Modeling is based on data, and it is impossible to know that much about the populous, and a vote contain very little data at all.

Voting is a necessary and important part of democracy, but it isn't the only part. The reason why it works is not because it is perfect, but because a turnover is more or less inevitable.

Real democracy, isn't perfect. It is actually the mess and the wranglings ensure that it is more democratic not less. That is not exclusive to elections, there is plenty of turnover outside of elections.

I don't like it if the party I didn't vote for gets in, but I have to accept, if that didn't happen enough it could be a very dangerous thing indeed, and actually I might be wrong about them. Time in opposition only helps, it is especially humbling where a part has lost bad, and some positive things can come out of that.

Also democracy isn't all about one party holding power and getting knocked off after a full term. Democracy is about scrutiny, and strong opposition.

Just think what would happen is some of the electorate view's actually come to fruition.....

Opinions are one thing, governance is another thing altogether. It is not so easy, to come up with workable policies, and satisfying populism.



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25 May 2013, 3:21 pm

zer0netgain wrote:
Frankly, the voting age should be 30. Young people lack the life experience to make sound political choices. Indeed it's easier to hoodwink the young into bad ideas because they are drawn to idealistic values that life experience would clearly says are unworkable.


I would just as much against this, as lowering.

Frankly there is no evidence to suggest that those over 30 are any more informed, and you might as well ban stupid people, old people, and half the electorate while you are at it.

It is a really bad precedent to set.

Like it or not people making uniformed, or misinformed decisions (according to others), plays an important part in democracy.

If you believe that voting is representational (which I don't), then you have to accept that being young, senile or uniformed is part of the representation, as it is certainly part of the demographic.



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25 May 2013, 5:03 pm

Most people are too simpleminded at any age to cast a well thought out vote.
They could lower the voting age to 10 and it wouldn't matter. :roll:


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Last edited by Raptor on 25 May 2013, 5:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

xenon13
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25 May 2013, 5:15 pm

The Americans LWOPP such people, why not let them vote?



Keni
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25 May 2013, 6:25 pm

When I was 15 I thought it was terrible that my country could be run without my well-informed vote....
I had all the answers it was all so obvious :lol:

Looking back, I really thought I could make a difference.
We were much less informed than youngsters today though, the only information came from the papers & TV.

My first reaction was "No, no, they don't know enough". And then I look around at the adult voters who supposedly do...
why the hell not give teens the vote, it can't get any worse.