More NT questions about Aspergers

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I am NT. Friend has Aspergers.

Friend won't leave aspergers routine / special interests to participate in other activities.

#1 Is it still nice to invite him to do things?

#2 How much self awareness does he experience? Does he know by insisting on only doing his approved aspergers activities he has shut the world out?

#3 Please describe in exact words as possible what he experiences when asked to leave routine. Specifically the moment he is asked and while he is doing the activity. As an example lets say a party downtown with people he doesnt know. Fear? Extreme anxiety? I need to understand thank you.

Not here to rustle jimmies so if your opinion is i should join an NT forum i am ok with hearing this. Im am here for all viewpoints thank you.

From personal experience, many, if not most, of people with Asperger's have an acute awareness of their neurological differences.

Some people with Asperger's could relate well to people who are seen as being "neurotypical" (NT); others, not so much.

I'm an undiagnosed person with an autistic history. I still exhibit Aspergian symptoms.

Really, Asperger's runs the gamut; Asperger's, like other forms of autism, operates under Spectrum conditions.

You'll find a wide variety of opinions on this forum.

People with Asperger's feel bad when they are excluded; from my standpoint, it would be hypocritical to exclude NT's, when I don't want to be excluded myself.

It is essential, I believe, that NT's and people on the Spectrum become educated about each other, and their accomplishments.

It is essential, I believe, that people on the Spectrum and NT's do not practice strict segregation from each other, and embrace the concept of Neurodiversity.

I hope you are not as vapid and as mindless as Ron Burgundy Or Tex Baxter. You seem pretty ok, though.

Last edited by kraftiekortie on 24 Apr 2014, 1:58 pm, edited 2 times in total.

If you want to know what he experiences and what he thinks is nice you should ask him. It is not universally the same for everyone.

You should run for congress

LOL......I actually believe what I wrote.

Probably. However when people get bit so many times by a particular thing they learn not to do that thing anymore. I can't fault someone for making a list of things that they will no longer participate in.

Even an amoeba knows how to move away from something sharp or caustic.

1 yes
2 probably a lot
3 stress in the form of any number of emotions.

I admire your care for your friend. If you are interested, I'd suggest doing some research on aspergers as well as talking to him and getting a scope on his individual needs. He may never change, or your friendship could help him to open up to the social world outside of his. Either way, thanks for caring. Friends are important.

I'm happy that you care.

Everyone is different, but here is how I would want to be treated with what you have mentioned.

1) yes, still invite him

2) for me, I've always had considerably MORE self-awareness than I am given credit for. In fact, quite often the reason I pull away is *because* I know I hurt people, not because I think I don't. I would give him the benefit of the doubt that he knows and that it's painful for him, too.

3) I never really want to go to a "party downtown with people [ I ] don't know". No part of that statement sounds fun. I would primarily be consumed with fear of sensory overload and would want to avoid it.

If I am in "the zone" and doing something I am highly interested in, the experience feels more like I'm zipping by going 120 miles per hour and someone asks me to stop and ride in their golf cart with them. Sometimes, I do really want to, but might need help to slow down and do it. Other times, I find more success "jumping track" to a similarly paced activity (typically something that would involve something else I care about and engages the mind).

1. it depends on your friend, if he liked being invited then by all means invite him, just let him a few days prior, which means no sudden invitations, this is very very stressful.

2. in my opinion, in order to function aspies NEED to be aware 24/7 of what you are doing. but sometimes, in stressful moments an aspie can shut down, this just means theyre on 'auto pilot', so he may not reply to questions very well, may not talk, staring and slow movemnts, that means he just needs time to relax and wake back up

3. its like an anxiety attack when your routine is ruined, its just the thought that something is different or gone draws a blank in the mind, and you sit there thinking "what am i suppose to do?!?! i need to plan this out!! " and then sometimes, for me, all i can do is pace, and stim and repeat in my head "what am i suppose to do now?! im suppose to do this!"

but i can choose to change the routine, i just plan to change it prior. but everyone is different

hope this helps

The only thing I would add here is that maybe sometime you should sit him down and explain why you ask him to do things. Aspies can be confused by this ("Why does he keep asking me when I keep saying no?") and it would help him to understand and maybe give him some idea of friendship and socialization, if you spell things out.

For example, you could say something like: "Maybe you think it's odd I keep inviting you out when you don't accept, but you're my friend and I'd feel like I was excluding you even if you may not see it as being excluded. I don't mind that you don't go but I like to give you the opportunity in case some day it may be something you decide you DO want to do. It's okay with me that you don't go, but if you ever say yes, I'd be happy to have you there. I wouldn't ask you otherwise."

A party downtown with loud music and lots of strangers is a recipe for profound sensory overload and anxiety for an Aspie. Don't drop your Aspie friend. Invite him to do things one-on-one with you or with a small group of friends who he mostly knows, so it's not so overwhelming. A lot of us do like to try new things as long as they don't involve elements likely to overwhelm us. Also, be willing to do things related to your friend's interests sometimes.

Hi.

Sorry I only answered one of the questions.

1. Yes, I would still invite him. Would I would advise him depends on the extent of his social difficulties. If he has relatively minor difficulties. I would give him the space and allow him to navigate the situation on his own. If he has more major difficulties, I would offer more explicit guidance

2. I already answered that question.

3. It depends on the extent of his differences. Sometimes, a person with Asperger's could deal with changes in routine just fine.
Other times, he might need to be informed of transitions, so the transition doesn't suddenly "come up" in an overwhelming
manner.

I wish I could actually SEE the person; that way, I could offer better advise.

Let me try and answer all three
Yes of course you should ask, be well aware that 1:1 interaction is something we can generally do just fine, and wouldn't you be offended if your friends actively avoided you by not asking.

On 2) and 3)
I want you to imagine being a deer in the headlights of an oncoming car. Though physically capable of escaping, you can not move, you can not respond in another mannor, everything is on overload and you just shut down.
This is how we often feel in our interactions with the world.
The reason for needing routines, and obsorbing ourselves completely in our interests is that it is the means to take some degree of control over our lives.

And again on 3
Ok so I am doing something that I find highly fulfilling, and safe, something is am probably really good at, and instead want me to trade that for an experince that is unpleasant on a sensory level (like holding your hand in a flame is unpleasent) and then either feel like a burden or end up alone waiting for you to Finnish engaging in an activity that I neither fully understand, nor am any good at. Sounds like a self esteem building experience.

I can only answer how I would feel and respond. I will say that yes aspies like to do things besides their focused interests. However keep these in mind:

1. Ask your friend well ahead of time if they would be willing and would like to participate. By well ahead of time I mean give at least a couple days notice if possible. I know I am VERY routine driven and if I have something planned out or are doing it, I am much LESS likely to agree to go. If your calling and he/she knows you generally do spur of the moment (impulsive) things. They may well not answer the phone even. I dislike saying no to friends but I dislike feeling pressured at the last minute even MORE.

2. Don't be disappointed if your friend says no, just say ok perhaps next time. Do NOT leave them feeling pressured.

3. If it is a crowded affair expect the answer well ahead of time as many of us suffer from sensory overload issues. I once took up an invitation to go to a casino. Well after about 5 minutes with the bright lights, sounds, throngs of people, etc I literally RAN for the exit. It was WAY too much for me to handle.

This is just a start hard knowing what all specifics apply to your friend. Aspies can be a variable as any group on likes, dislikes, etc. We are individuals and are different from one another. Why they call it a spectrum because of the differences that exist and how effected we are by them.

Remember, we are not your friend! We probably have a similar amount in common as you do with any given NT. We can only offer best guesses.

It is really great to see that you care so much about your friend though

1) Yes, still invite him. Give him the opportunity to avoid being left out if that is what he wants.

2) Hard to say, particularly if he has any co-morbids (particularly intellectual disabilities which can make self awareness very difficult). Chance are, he's had bad experiences in "the rest of the world" before and knows that sticking to his safe activities means he avoids the bad. He might not be aware of how capable he is of coping with new things now that he's older; he might also not be aware that some of the new activities that open up to older people are actually quite enjoyable.

3) This is the hardest question to answer. I have no idea how other people feel. Sorry. I can't even say how I feel, because I can't compare it to your feelings.

1. Yes. If you really want him to come with you, you should try to convince him of why he'll have a good time at your proposed activity. If I were you, I'd plan out my arguments ahead of tim & include some actual inticements (food, activities, girls?) if possible of things you know for a fact he clearly likes. You should also do your best to explain to him why you personally would like him to be there and how much you want him to go with you.
If successful, do your best to ensure he's having a good time, isn't upset by senosory issues, isn't standing alone not having any fun, isn't hungry or thirsty, and if he asks you to leave early with him, you should go.

2. Probably way, way, way, more than your other-people-focused allistic self does. Autism literally means 'self-ism' because a major feature is an acute, constant awareness of oneself a tendency to withdraw into oneself. Autistics are sometimes so incediably self-aware, it can be overwhelming or even painful at times. The problem you're having is that you don't realize that many of us LIKE to shut out the world for long periods of time. Some days, I'm up to go out, see people, interact, maybe even do a little socializing out of the people I know once in a while. Other days, I'm happy to sit on my chair, watch my TV go on the 'net & stay put in my nice, dark, quiet little cave. If you want his company, convince him that you want it and that the activity you're proposing will be preferable to his special interest quiet time. Again, plan it out ahead of time & try to include inticements.

3. Breaking a routine can be rather jarring, and at best it registers as a palpaple dissonance.
Frankly, I like parties & I'd probaby be happy to go with you, but I literally spent years getting used to such gatherings, learning how to interact during them, and acquiring a taste for various intoxicants. I like having conversations & getting intoxicated with random people, and I know when I need to go outside for air and less noise, inside for warmth, my limits with intoxicants & sensory stimuli, and how to leave when I'm no longer having fun.
Plus, I like looking at the pretty girls & if the music is good techno & the setting is conducive, I'd probably even dance.
I can't tell you what your friend might be feeling.
Anything from contempt, detached amusment, or confusion to annoyance, mild anger, moderate anger, extreme anger, discomfort, or even ambivalence.
It's possible he even wants you to take him along, but he needs to be forced into it to get himself to do it.
Have you tried just asking him?


The truth is that you really need to ask him directly about this stuff if you want to understand what's going on.
I know it breaks a ton of unwritten allistic codes of conduct & is generally considered intrusive & even rude to ask direct questions like that, but frankly as an autistic adult I'd much rather people ask me about me than try to get than information from others who obviously can not answer accurately for me.
I could be wrong about your friend, but he'll probably answer any reasonable, direct question put to him if he's at all typical.
Either that or do what I suggest above a couple times: convince, cajole, & bribe.