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pawelk1986
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25 May 2014, 11:43 am

I think so that abortion, in particular elective abortion is wrong and sinful.

I described it in detail in this topic
http://www.wrongplanet.net/postp6073430.html



The_Walrus
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25 May 2014, 12:00 pm

As the zef develops and becomes more worthy of life, so does how horrible and invasive the procedure to kill it becomes.

Personally, I think any woman willing to go through a risky, and really unpleasant, procedure to kill a six-month foetus obviously has a damned good reason, and should be allowed to do it.



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25 May 2014, 12:16 pm

We've had this discussion many times on here. I believe that the unborn are human life that we must protect, convenience is not an excuse to murder. One should take responsibility for the life they created.



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25 May 2014, 12:20 pm

This would be better off in the women's forum IMO, I'm certainly not qualified to have an opinion on abortion.

I don't like the idea of abortion, but I don't have to. As a man I will never ultimately be responsible for making that decision, and for that I am VERY grateful. Call it male privilege.

That said, I have had discussions like this with previous sexual partners following 'scares'. Not being able to make a 'right' choice at the time, we elected to choose the lesser of two evils.


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pawelk1986
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25 May 2014, 12:23 pm

Jacoby wrote:
We've had this discussion many times on here. I believe that the unborn are human life that we must protect, convenience is not an excuse to murder. One should take responsibility for the life they created.



i couldn't agree more with you :D



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25 May 2014, 12:42 pm

I don't have a vagina, so it's best to stay out of the debate entirely. I am nominally pro-life, though.


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25 May 2014, 4:16 pm

I view abortion as a form of murder.

However, given the prevalence of rape, the way men are so often encouraged to have lots of sex, the way women are so often conditioned to not stand up to men, the fact that birth control doesn't always work even when used correctly, the fact that there are forms of birth control that can have really nasty side effects, the dangers associated with pregnancy, and issues with overpopulation, I can't with good conscience support a ban on abortion.



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25 May 2014, 4:57 pm

The_Walrus wrote:
As the zef develops and becomes more worthy of life, so does how horrible and invasive the procedure to kill it becomes.

Personally, I think any woman willing to go through a risky, and really unpleasant, procedure to kill a six-month foetus obviously has a damned good reason, and should be allowed to do it.


Sorry whilst I support abortion I think six months is going way to far, several preterm babies have survived with medical assistance from as early as 22 weeks. I would put the cut off point at 12 weeks unless the mothers life was in genuine danger.


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The_Walrus
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25 May 2014, 5:02 pm

DentArthurDent wrote:
The_Walrus wrote:
As the zef develops and becomes more worthy of life, so does how horrible and invasive the procedure to kill it becomes.

Personally, I think any woman willing to go through a risky, and really unpleasant, procedure to kill a six-month foetus obviously has a damned good reason, and should be allowed to do it.


Sorry whilst I support abortion I think six months is going way to far, several preterm babies have survived with medical assistance from as early as 22 weeks. I would put the cut off point at 12 weeks unless the mothers life was in genuine danger.
24 weeks is the limit in the UK. I'd quite happily go up to 12 months tbh. Being viable or even out of the womb is a meaningless difference. And in any case, survival at 22 weeks is very low.



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25 May 2014, 5:18 pm

The_Walrus wrote:
DentArthurDent wrote:
The_Walrus wrote:
As the zef develops and becomes more worthy of life, so does how horrible and invasive the procedure to kill it becomes.

Personally, I think any woman willing to go through a risky, and really unpleasant, procedure to kill a six-month foetus obviously has a damned good reason, and should be allowed to do it.


Sorry whilst I support abortion I think six months is going way to far, several preterm babies have survived with medical assistance from as early as 22 weeks. I would put the cut off point at 12 weeks unless the mothers life was in genuine danger.
I'd quite happily go up to 12 months tbh. Being viable or even out of the womb is a meaningless difference. .


Really! but then I would like to strangle crying babies in the supermarket and cafes the noise drives me nuts :lol:


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25 May 2014, 6:21 pm

pawelk1986 wrote:
I think so that abortion, in particular elective abortion is wrong and sinful.

I described it in detail in this topic
http://www.wrongplanet.net/postp6073430.html


I don't think any man should have a say in the matter unless he has experienced childbirth for himself.

Its not a coincidence that the majority of these prolifers you encounter tend to be male.

The word 'sinful' is invocative of religious beliefs which should be kept a personal matter. Not used to emotionally blackmail people into adopting a different social view.


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Last edited by thomas81 on 25 May 2014, 6:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Jacoby
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25 May 2014, 6:24 pm

The_Walrus wrote:
DentArthurDent wrote:
The_Walrus wrote:
As the zef develops and becomes more worthy of life, so does how horrible and invasive the procedure to kill it becomes.

Personally, I think any woman willing to go through a risky, and really unpleasant, procedure to kill a six-month foetus obviously has a damned good reason, and should be allowed to do it.


Sorry whilst I support abortion I think six months is going way to far, several preterm babies have survived with medical assistance from as early as 22 weeks. I would put the cut off point at 12 weeks unless the mothers life was in genuine danger.
24 weeks is the limit in the UK. I'd quite happily go up to 12 months tbh. Being viable or even out of the womb is a meaningless difference. And in any case, survival at 22 weeks is very low.


WOW

Why stop there, why not age 5 or 10 or 20? Why not any dependent person? The homeless and disable, anybody that's a burden on another? It follows the same logic. Think about what you said right there, it really is an unbelievable statement especially on this site.



Jacoby
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25 May 2014, 6:26 pm

thomas81 wrote:
pawelk1986 wrote:
I think so that abortion, in particular elective abortion is wrong and sinful.

I described it in detail in this topic
http://www.wrongplanet.net/postp6073430.html


I don't think any man should have a say in the matter unless he has experienced childbirth for himself.

Its not a coincidence that the majority of these prolifers you encounter tend to be male.

The word 'sinful' is invocative of religious beliefs which should be kept a personal matter. Not used to emotionally blackmail people into adopting a different social view.


We all were born, one doesn't have to give birth themselves to feel the need to value and protect all human life



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25 May 2014, 6:27 pm

Jacoby wrote:
The_Walrus wrote:
DentArthurDent wrote:
The_Walrus wrote:
As the zef develops and becomes more worthy of life, so does how horrible and invasive the procedure to kill it becomes.

Personally, I think any woman willing to go through a risky, and really unpleasant, procedure to kill a six-month foetus obviously has a damned good reason, and should be allowed to do it.


Sorry whilst I support abortion I think six months is going way to far, several preterm babies have survived with medical assistance from as early as 22 weeks. I would put the cut off point at 12 weeks unless the mothers life was in genuine danger.
24 weeks is the limit in the UK. I'd quite happily go up to 12 months tbh. Being viable or even out of the womb is a meaningless difference. And in any case, survival at 22 weeks is very low.


WOW

Why stop there, why not age 5 or 10 or 20? Why not any dependent person? The homeless and disable, anybody that's a burden on another? It follows the same logic. Think about what you said right there, it really is an unbelievable statement especially on this site.



Hmmm, false analogy. A woman can die at any point of a pregnancy due to the presence of a foetus. Until the point that they are born, they are a parasite to the women's body.

Its wrong to tell a woman that you don't have any choice regarding having a foreign body inside you that can potentially kill you at any point.


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25 May 2014, 6:29 pm

Jacoby wrote:
thomas81 wrote:
pawelk1986 wrote:
I think so that abortion, in particular elective abortion is wrong and sinful.

I described it in detail in this topic
http://www.wrongplanet.net/postp6073430.html


I don't think any man should have a say in the matter unless he has experienced childbirth for himself.

Its not a coincidence that the majority of these prolifers you encounter tend to be male.

The word 'sinful' is invocative of religious beliefs which should be kept a personal matter. Not used to emotionally blackmail people into adopting a different social view.


We all were born, one doesn't have to give birth themselves to feel the need to value and protect all human life

Not the point. A man will never be burdened with the process of childbirth itself, and for the most part women take on the lion's share in the bringing up of a child.

Its said that when a woman becomes pregnant she places one foot in the grave. Who are you to tell her she can't take it out?


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pawelk1986
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25 May 2014, 6:31 pm

Jacoby wrote:
The_Walrus wrote:
DentArthurDent wrote:
The_Walrus wrote:
As the zef develops and becomes more worthy of life, so does how horrible and invasive the procedure to kill it becomes.

Personally, I think any woman willing to go through a risky, and really unpleasant, procedure to kill a six-month foetus obviously has a damned good reason, and should be allowed to do it.


Sorry whilst I support abortion I think six months is going way to far, several preterm babies have survived with medical assistance from as early as 22 weeks. I would put the cut off point at 12 weeks unless the mothers life was in genuine danger.
24 weeks is the limit in the UK. I'd quite happily go up to 12 months tbh. Being viable or even out of the womb is a meaningless difference. And in any case, survival at 22 weeks is very low.


WOW

Why stop there, why not age 5 or 10 or 20? Why not any dependent person? The homeless and disable, anybody that's a burden on another? It follows the same logic. Think about what you said right there, it really is an unbelievable statement especially on this site.


You mean Aktion T4 :D
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Action_T4