I never know what to do with my daughter

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Appreciate you sharing your story.

hi,no problem DW!

ASD Mommy - Yes I believe she is under a lot of stress too - not sure why it surprises me so much, I had a horrible time at age 14 to 16. I thought it was situational though because my parents split up when I was 14 and I was bullied a lot at school.

Sweetleaf - I think some anti-anxiety meds may be great for her, but I am worried about side effects because if she feels even mildly sick to her stomach or mild headache, she is miserable. She can't tolerate not feeling good. I am thinking hospitalization would be better than the police too, but am not sure they would admit her Before diagnosis, last September, she was brought by the school police officer because she wanted to form her under the mental health act. Once the clinical social worker that saw her decided she likely had aspergers, they just sent us home and told us to get her tested. If they had formed her, she could have been diagnosed right away and maybe even prescribed meds and perhaps things would be calmer now.

Buyer Beware - Thanks for sharing about how you felt so out of control as a teen. It helps me to understand my daughter and what she is going through. I know I had some difficulities with moods too and had to see a shrink. They said I was a roller coaster of emotions and were going to put me on meds, but I never did take any. I used to have to keep magazines to rip and would punch brick walls too. So I can kind of see why she is having such a hard time - but I feel that I am trying to help her so much, why isn't it helping? My parents certainly weren't bending over backwards to please me. I feel I can't reach her at times.

DW a mom - You are right that hopefully I can get her to see that too many activities is too hard on her next year. I let her pick the activities because she said that they were the only reasons she would attend school - she really hates going to school and having some fun activities helped motivate her to attend. It is just so hard to get that balance.

Waterfalls - I am realizing that it can't continue this way. I spoke to her last night and this morning about us likely having to get her medication for her anxiety and she is so resistant and says she won't take anything. I am thinking even I could use some anti-anxiety pills too because I take natural remedies for anxiety and depression, but this is too much to handle that they don't help as much I would like. Maybe our home would be calmer if we were both on anti-anxiety meds. I am not too worried about treatment options because we are on the waiting list for ABA therapy which is supposed to be good for emotional regulation and she will be in the aspergers program next year for high school. I think having my twins in separate schools will help a lot because they will not be constantly competing for friends, grades and activities. Yesterday I let my AS daughter stay home from school because she seemd overwhelmed and exhaused from her soccer meet the day before and my girls got along wonderfully last night after being apart all day.

Kingdomofrats - thanks for sharing about the positives of institutionalized care. It seems if you get the right place, it can really help you out as an individual. It must have been awful for you to not be able to enjoy music, food, water or tv - all things my daughter really loves.

Pddtwinmom - My daughter was tested for comorbid conditions because her dad has both bipolar and borderline personality disorder. I was actually relieved to find out my daughter had autism and not his mental health issues. I was also afraid to have her diagnosed because since he got his diagnosis, it gave him an excuse to do as he wishes and he hasn't seen his daughters for the past 10 years and he just sits around playing his guitar and living on disability. I know that violence should not be tolerated at all, but when she gets to that point, she is not really fully there and will not remember a lot of the event. I really think getting us both something for anxiety would make it a calmer household. I know I am supposed to be the epitome of calm to help her, but unfortunately I get really anxious too when she is constantly yelling and lecturing me and then her sister will start yelling too and then I just feel like I am going crazy too.

Hi Triplemoon. I'm so sorry you're going through this. I'm not walking in your shoes, so it's easy for me to sit at my computer and give advice. I hope you receive it in the spirit that's it's given. Please accept my apologies of i ever cross any lines.

Here are a few more things to consider. Your daughter sounds like she's cognitively strong. To me, that means that she is capable of making choices. I don't mean that she can when she's in a full meltdown, but in the window of time before the meltdown happens. However, she may not be able to recognize when the meltdown is imminent. It sounds like you have a good idea of when she's on the edge. That is the time when you have to give her a choice. Give her two options that may help her calm down. And reiterate that violence will not be tolerated, so she has to pick one.

A couple of things are concerning to me. 1) you've become accustomed to living with rhis level of violence. That is not okay. It can be a slippery slope that sends you into an altered reality bit by bit. This is not normal, even with ASD, and is not okay. 2) this is your problem to fix. ABA will not fix this. It may help, but it sounds like your expectations may be too high, and that you're waiting for ABA to save you. That's not how it works. Fixing this has to start with how you approach your child. I can't tell you how to do that because you are the expert on what happens in your house, but you have to try something different. 3) I think your daughter may be capable of more than you think she is. It is exhausting fighting these battles, but she's 13 and selfish (like all 13 yr olds), controlling (again, pretty common), thinks she knows everything (once again, no surprises there), and gets rewarded for bad behavior with extra attention and accommodation. I think she may be able to do better than she has been, if she is required to and has the right tools.

I really hope this helps and that I haven't overstepped. I'm just so concerned for you all.

Best!
Femi

Oh I think my mom would have sent me away. She may have picked up a phone or something and start calling around or tell my shrink she needs a hospital for me to go to. I knew of one boy who was always in and out of hospitals in Seattle and when he kept throwing an ax at my brothers and their friends, my parents told his parents and bam he was immediately hospitalized.

If you had follow the OP's posts, you will see she has stated her daughter does not want to change. She gets pissed when she and her other daughter lock themselves in a room from her and she knocks down the door and breaks it because she is so pissed she can't harm them. She refuses to do the tools her mother gives her to calm down. She has also stated because her daughter has AS, she thinks she doesn't have to change and everyone has to put up with her s**t. Also consequences don't seem to work with her daughter like it would with a two year old. Just give them time outs or leave places like play areas. The two year old shoves another child, bam the parent takes them and they leave and the two year old hates that and the mother tells her child "You pushed her and we are leaving, you do not push other kids." That is what my mom did with me and I stopped after a while, I am not sure how long it too for it to sink into me but consistency was the key. And people do get medical treatment in hospitals. It's not like a prison where you ship them there and they are there locked away forever. No, they are given treatment. My aunt was in one for four years before getting out and an aspie boy I knew would be in and out of them. If your life is in danger, time to send them away for help. I find it pretty selfish to endanger your other kids lives and other peoples if your kid is going out and hurting others.

OP, go ahead and continue getting abused by your daughter and endangering your other daughter's life. I think there ought to be a law about violent kids. Make it illegal to have them in your home when there are other kinds involved. Now families will be protected from violence and it will be mandatory to hospitalize them or they get arrested for child endangerment but the system will have to change first.

I see it as her daughter does not know how to change and, for that reason, is refusing to try. ASD can make it difficult to see options as being viable, and alternate roads as existing at all. Which can result in giving up and then basically writing a cover up story to preserve your own sanity and to appease your family. My problem with that is that rarely is it the truth. So, the job of the parent becomes helping the child find and understand the truth, and in that process they learn how to change their behavior. All much more complicated than I can describe in a few sentences, but there are solid reasons we on this forum fight for our kids long after there appears to be no reason to. We know better. There IS an answer, in the vast majority of cases, and a way to make things better. Don't fall for the surface appearance of what is going on with your child; always dig deeper and with a very open mind. We don't need to write off these kids; I've way too much proof on this board that things can and will get better.

I think you are seeing this situation as much more obdurate than it actually is, and making far too many negative assumptions about a very confused youngster. I am not hearing anything happening that the sister and mother can not come back from, yet you are proposing solutions that the daughter most likely never will. Certainly, parents have to balance the rights and needs of ALL members of a family, but that does not require what you suggest.

I did follow the OP, I read the whole thing hence why I figured I'd leave my imput. As for breaking down the door, I doubt it has to do with being pissed because she can't harm them...she's pissed because they are separating her from them, I mean she mentioned coping abilities of a 2 year old...thinking about 2 year olds I have come in contact with that is more likely than being pissed she can't hurt them. A lot of times 2 year olds don't handle anger/frustration and might try to hit and kick sounds like this girl is exibiting that same sort of behavior but she's bigger than a two year old so it does more damage but it seems more like she can't regulate it than is being abusive and wants to hurt people and from what was described it sounds like her cognative abilities and what not could be a bit behind and of course there is the autistic sticking to routines which can make it even harder to change how you deal with something just sounds to me like a kid who needs some help regulating their feelings/reactions and behaviors.....that is what I got out of the OP. But then add to that the autism....that can certainly complicate things. I am not oppossed to the OP sending her somewhere she could get more intensive help, but the way that comment I responded to about that was worded seemed more to be implying like send her away for good which I mean if the mom really cannot care for the child sometimes that ends up having to happen but I think being they are still so young there is time to get intensive help and get to a stable enough point where she is safe at home and not causing danger for herself or others.

And man do I wish people would quit assuming I didn't read the OP if my opinion varies from theirs....there is limited info in the OP, i said my perspective based on whats there....my perspective is hardly infalible but to me it sounds more like a kid with problems regulating emotions and behavior(who probably feels like crap about it on the inside) rather than a bratty, abusive kid who just wants to hurt people.

I have been so busy at work, I can finally take the time to read and respond again.

Pddtwinmom - yes my daughter is cognitively strong, but like I said her coping skills are that of a 2 year old, so I know she wants to behave better, but she doesn't know how. After a meltdown, she will apologize and cry and want a hug and feels bad and says she doesn't want to fight. I realize that her sister and I always having to fend off her attacks is not good and very similar to living in an NT abusive relationship and that is why I am considering medication for her to help her and us. I just started taking valerian yesterday and hope it will calm me because I know that my being calmer is essential to helping her be calm. I also think ABA therapy will be helpful because we will get a whole team to help us with emotion regulation, which is her biggest problem in life. I have also ordered two books on managing meltdowns in ASD and hope they will help too. You said that fixing has to start with how you approach your child and that is the problem - I do not have the skills yet to properly approach her. I am hoping ABA, her aspergers class in high school, different books will give me the tools I need that i haven't found yet. We have made some great progress and can go weeks where everything is pretty calm, but I guess she is overwhelmed with her schedule at school right now and we are in a rough patch. Do not worry about crossing any lines - any advice and different perspective is immensely helpful to me, as well as your words of support.

League Girl - I dont't think sending my daughter away is the answer. I think she needs the adults in her life to help her because she is obviously having a hard time now. I think medication may be helpful to her and that is why I am considering it. My daughter does not get pissed off because we are hiding in my room and she wants to hurt us - she doesn't want to be alone with all the awful emotions she is feeling. She refuses to use tools that calm her down because lately she is so anxious all of the time and so easily upset that she is not able to make choices and help herself. I know I painted a gloomy picture in my OP, but really it isn't usually constant meltdowns in our house. We usually get two or three weeks of relative calm in between her meltdowns. I think she is having a difficult time with too much happening at school and her coping skills are nonexistant and she is just lashing out because she wants help. I also do not feel that she is endangering our lives. Yes she can get violent, but we aren't walking around with bruises and cuts and having to seek medical help. Usually she flails out at us and it barely hurts, but I still want it to stop. The other day when she kicked me hard, she felt that I had hurt her first because I pushed her to the ground when I wanted to keep her away from her sister. This is why I know something has to be different because I don't like this cycle we are in.

DW a mom - I see things the way you do - my daughter is confused and wants to do better and doesn't know how. I will keep trying to find solutions because that is what my job as a mom is - to help her. I would never want to have to resort to sending her away because I see how badly it affected her dad when his family did the same thing to him at her age.

Sweetleaf - Thanks for helping explain to everyone that a two year old has a hard time handling anger and frustration. It's funny because at two, she was sweet and gentle and kind all of the time. She never had temper tamtrums and she was so even tempered and easy as a baby. It is only as she has gotten older and the hormones kicked in that her cognitive skills are so in constrast to her coping skills. That is why I am so desparate to get her the help she needs because she can be very sweet and fun and funny, but lately we are just seeing her upset side.

I hope I figure out what to do. I prefer natural remedies to actually putting her on medication with tons of side effects that will make her feel miserable. I have started her on fish oil because it is supposed to be very good for your brain and I am considering trying her on valerian (natural form of valium) to calm her. I know someone mentioned having AS and chamomile supplements were helpful for them. Should I post on the general board and see what other AS people have tried?y. I tried my daughter on St. John's Wort over the years, but it would only make her very happy for about a week because she doesn't suffer from depression, just lots of anxiety. I have tried her on passionflower on occassion to see if it would help calm her down, but it didn't. Perhaps if she had it daily it would work better?

Have you looked at the index stickie, above, to see if there are topics on natural remedies? I know that these are one area you will hear a HUGE variety of opinions on; the truth is pretty squishy, so it is mostly experiment and see what sees to work.

Have you considered diet changes? A lot of people have had success eliminating one or more diet elements that can function as triggers in people with food sensitivities. Food sensitivities are different from allergies, in that they don't always leave clear medical tracers. So, you are left to experiment. My husband and son do not eat soy, for example; I avoid non-naturally occurring sugar and some types of dairy. None of these things are cures, of course; it is a simple equation in that if someone feels better, they function better, and cope with challenges better. Common items to consider carefully eliminating include gluten, casein, soy, eggs, certain food dyes or additives and ???? (check the posts on diet, you will hear lots of personal experiences there).

What is hard about any of these changes is that they take time, observation, and dedication - things that are going to be in natural short supply for you right now. So, you have to decide if the investment from you is likely to be worth it. Start with things that don't seem too difficult: if your family isn't that into bread and pasta, eliminating gluten may not be that stressful (although watch for the gluten in things you never thought had it). Long run, though, it could be the things that you all eat the most that are problems: we figured out the soy issue when my son was eating protein bars every day (usually made with soy isolate).

Also glad to hear you are working on you; hopefully that will help.

When I get a chance, I will have to check out all the posts on natural remedies on here. Just no time at work and no internet at home. I feel that since melatonin has been such a life saver for her finally being able to sleep at night, I would like to see if some natural anti-anxiety pills would be just as helpful. She really hates taking pills of any kind except for the melatonin, so I am hoping if I find a natural one, she will be more amenable to taking them. She hates the fish oil pills because she says they are so big.

Diet changes - really I wouldn't want to remove anything from her diet because she LOVES food and having an array of snacks to pick from makes her very happy. I feel if I ensure she has plenty of fruits, veggies and yogourts to pick from, along with lots of carbs, she does well. She also adores sugar and I make sure she has nutella to put on bread as an emergency snack. It really seems to calm her a lot.

You may be right about things taking time, but I also think the meds my doctor would prescribe would be hit and miss too. I am just so worried about side effects because she would not handle having even a mild headache or fogginess or fatigue.

You have to be really, really careful with it because it can regally mess up the liver, but I had pretty good luck with kava kava in my early 20s. I used that after my oldest daughter was born because I did not want to risk getting caught with marijuana.

Which also worked really well, at least in the respect of helping me keep my temper.

Not recommending it at her age though. Amotivational syndrome in a young teen is a real threat-- seen that first-hand. My cousin was about 12 when she started smoking. She does OK, holds a job and raises her kids good and all-- but she definitely has not lived up to her potential.

She is brilliant-- she should have been a famous actress or artist by now, not peddling bedroom makeovers for JCPenney.

What is amotivational syndrome? You lack motivation?

We wouldn't be able to try Kava Kava here in Canada because it has been banned since 2002. I am sure something else can be found that would be comparable

You might have some luck with valerian (never worked for me, but hey) or chamomile (which works for me mainly as a sedative). The upside is that for pill haters both of them can be taken as a nice cup of tea. I do love a nice cup of tea. But there too, the self regulation to shut up and brew a cup is required.

I am having lots of luck with calming myself with valerian. I had the calmest week with my girls after starting it on Wednesday. I also started my AS daughter on fish oil for the past week and that seems to be helping her. Hopefully this will all continue this week and into the future. Parenting is so much easier when everyone is calm.