Parents called out police two days in a row

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Elkclan do you understand people on the Autism Spectrum know this? Do you know the guilt that comes with having a meltdown, the self-loathing, feeling like a burden? Even possibly feeling suicidal and everyone would be better off without you? Maybe some people on the Autism Spectrum act "abusively" because everytime they've melted down people screamed and abused them? I recently had a meltdown, you have no control, it feels like being posessed in a horror film. Do you think on top of all of that blaming people with Autism helps?

Have you considered calling the police on someone having a meltdown is abusive? That the terror of an authority figure coming after them next time will cause them to do snything to stop a meltdown. I self harmed in school after being punished for my meltdowns. I don't want to trigger anyone with details, but it was bad. If anything I think people on the Autism spectrum should be kept safe from abusive partners or people who exacerbate their meltdowns by calling the cops.

Aaanndd now I'm upset, I'm going off to play more LocoRoco.

I stopped by to add this whole "I'm a victim of my Autistic husband!" thing reminded me of the Cassandra Disorder nonsense from some years ago. Basically it was the idea wives of men with Autism are victimized by their inability to express affection.

I disagree.

Impact is part of it, but intent, context, the nature of the behavior and the nature of the relationships between people can also be part of it (i.e. power imbalances, dependency). Not everything that scares or upsets others is abuse.

I'm not saying that it's okay to throw things around and break things (there are exceptions -- like if the things are yours and neither you nor anybody else will have problems because of breaking them or if you're allowed to break/throw them, and you're alone or with people who aren't afraid or upset by your behavior). I'm not saying it's okay to do or say things that people find scary or upsetting or hurtful (again there are exceptions, like what I was saying about how hearing someone you care about say they want to commit suicide might be scary and upsetting, but that doesn't automatically make it wrong or unacceptable for them to tell you -- context, intent, and your relationship with the person determine that). "Not abuse" does not mean "not a problem for anyone, totally acceptable and harmless" -- it just means "not abuse".



That's true, but if they have the ability to talk about what's going on in their head you can ask them to tell you why they do and say things. You can also look at what you know about them, look at the situation and the context, and make reasonable guesses.



I agree. I never said otherwise. I described that sort of behavior as violent.

And I know it can be scary to watch. I never said otherwise. I thought it was clear that I knew this because in my examples I talked about people watching the behavior and being scared by it.

Where we disagree is on whether or not throwing stuff around and breaking things is violent towards other people and whether or not it is abuse. I said sometimes it is, and sometimes isn't.



I agree that it is, with very few but noteworthy exceptions, verbally abusive to scream at people, and I agree that it's verbally abusive to say ugly (which I am assuming means cruel, mean, derogatory, deliberately insulting/offensive, deliberately hurtful, deliberately intimidating or deliberately frightening) things to people. I never said otherwise.

What I did try to say, was that not all screaming is directed at people (sometimes it isn't directed at anybody), and that in some cases the context determines whether or not words are ugly or abusive, and that the context determines whether or not random screaming (screaming that is not directed at anybody) is abusive.

Additionally, I'm saying now that not all screamed words are ugly words and not all screaming even has words in it.

Last edited by animalcrackers on 02 Nov 2014, 7:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I stand corrected. I also apologize. I was literally just thinking what I said I was thinking -- that you meant assault or threats (i.e. that you were thinking of meltdowns that involved assault or threats). I made assumptions about your experience based on what I know of the law where I live and what I know of the laws in the UK, and because I didn't think about whether or not you had children.

I've had police involvement in my meltdowns, too, always called by the neighbours. I thank god that the police officers that showed up at my house never reacted like the ones that showed up at yours or at NiceCupOfTea's house. The police never pulled out weapons, I don't think they threatened me (if they did I've forgotten), and I was never arrested -- I've only ever been restrained, had injuries assessed (that might have been paramedics or fire fighters, though...they all show up at once sometimes), and been taken to the hospital for psychiatric evaluation. There were no minor children at our house (except me, for most or all of those incidents...not sure which, I just know I was in my late teens).

By elkclan's definition of abuse, where intentions and context don't matter at all (e.g. such as the person who calls the police being afraid that you're going to hurt them or that you're going to hurt someone else, or being afraid you're going to hurt yourself really badly, or just needing a meltdown to stop for some other perfectly legitimate reason and knowing of no better way to handle the situation even if they aren't afraid for or of you), where the only thing that matters is the impact a behavior or action has on the person affected by it and how that affected person interprets it, it would be abusive a lot of the time.

I'm sorry but she didn't make it up. It is the way it is. If you read about abuse and watch shows about it, you will see how these abusers also don't always have control over what they do due to poor impulse control or anger and they are not even autistic and they are still labeled as an abuser and get told what they are doing is abuse and I have seen some feeling bad about it too. There is no exception and no one is exempted from the label. Even my own mom will say I abused her because I used to hit her. I never gave her black eyes or pushed her down the stairs or broken any of her stuff or given her a head injury. I was never that strong. I also ted to say hurtful things too when I am very upset and I don't even realize it and have no memory of it. I have also been told by my own mother cops can be called on me if I keep on screaming at my husband while I was under a lot of stress because of our upcoming wedding and stuff that had to be done and I even threw my cell phone at him and accidentally got him in the face because he told me to calm down. He gave me a hard time about it for about a year and my mom said "Good, you shouldn't even be doing that."

Why is autism exempted from this word and not everyone else even if they also can't help it? Why am I not exempted from it and other autistic people are? How fair is this? Do we need to have a certain amount of autism in us to be exempted from the A word? I have seen nothing mentioning this when I would read about abuse but it would have the behaviors listed as abuse. And I have read how there was no excuse for it and how it's common for victims to make excuses for the abuser to justify it. My mom never made excuses for me if I abused her rather it was verbal or screaming or hitting. She said she had always helped me despite the abuse. She said that to me when I was about 17 while taking me home after seeing my therapist.

Last I checked, there is no exceptions about abuse and who is exempted from the label. I find your response ironic Violetyoshi because you have went on about how you were abused by LFA kids in special ed and got traumatized by them and I have seen you go on about being against violent kids, especially on Facebook on the Dr. Phil page a few years back. Now you are okay with this just as long as it's a meltdown? That makes no sense. Were those autistic kids not having meltdowns when they attacked you?

I...I don't know. I just would be terrified if the cops were called on me. I'm sorry for not being consistent in my thoughts. I just don't know...I guess I should've never posted here, I always get things wrong. I'm really confused, I must be doing something wrong to be called out like this. I just don't understand...I just... Tht was years ago, are you the same person you were years ago? I was scared, I just wanted to be safe at home, the school wouldn't let me. I'm scared now. Why can't people leave my past alone? I can't change it. I just don't want anyoe to hurt like I'm hurting now. Why do I keep trying to stand up for others? When will I learn all it does is make me a target?

I have posted as Spokane Girl and likedcalico on here. I am not sure what person you are referring to. I never posted anywhere else you have except the autism forums and we were in that Ban Screaming Kids from Restaurant group coincidentally before it changed into a childfree like group and then the name changed to Ban Kids from Restaurants and eventually got dead and I am also on the DR. Phil page but never made a post there except maybe once about some out of control teen who appeared to be a sociopath.

I was someone who had been convinced I was a horrible person for having sound sensitivity. They understood, those from the childfree community. I should never have posted in this thread. I wish I had been able to realize it would just be an excuse to bring up my past from when I was a wounded scared girl. I guess I forgot how cruel people can be, exploiting people's pasts to silence them. Opening old wounds and poking into them until that person just gives up.

That wasn't me and all I did was ask and I do that to everyone when I see inconsistencies. Some get pissed about it and some just explain. :shrugs:

Some people can be very hurt when their past is used to point out inconsistencies, especially if they forgot that part of their past. I think holding someone's past behavior against them is called holding a grudge. You need to learn to deal with people as they are in the present. People do not stay as they were in the past, they learn new things and grow. I didn't realize what I was having for my entire time in high school were meltdowns, I thought something was wrong with me. I wasn't told other students were aggressive because they were having meltdowns, they were just being aggressive.

I also have been doxxed, had a cyberbully collect my posts and use them to prove I was a monster. They posted where I lived and a picture of me, which I was able to take down. Being reminded of my past is a trigger. I hurt people because high school taught me that was how you be social. That being nice means you lack an understanding of social cues. I couldn't stop being in survival mode. I had no understanding what meltdowns were I just didn't want to be hurt. I couldn't leave, I was forced against my will to return to a place where I was hurt so many times, I forgot how it felt to be safe. I try to help others, but I keep getting it wrong.

I'm sorry. I shouldn't have posted here. Maybe a part of me is envious that people in abusive relationships have the opportunity to get help or leave that I didn't. All I've known for so long is fear. I was fine until I had a meltdown. Of course as always I am told I must understand others pain, and not expect my pain to be understood. Maybe that's why I feel I need to help others even if I don't know what I'm talking about. I was told if I didn't understand why my bullies hurt me I was bad. Maybe I just need to stop trying to help, it only makes things worse.

VY - you have every right to post.

I've seen inconsistencies in your posts about the situation of abuse in the recent past (i.e. last few weeks maybe a month). There's nothing wrong with being called out for inconsistencies and if you've changed your position from a few years ago or even last week or even just now you're entitled to say "I've changed my mind."

Or maybe sometimes humans are just inconsistent. That's ok. We don't always remember what we've said or we get carried away in the moment.

But I think there is a logical inconsistency of people claiming abuse from people who happen to have autism but then saying that autistic people don't abuse or behaviours that are linked to autism can't possibly be abusive. Sometimes they are.

And sometimes nice people engage in abusive behaviours. I know I've shouted at my son. I shouldn't. I should find other ways to deal with stuff. I was raised in a shouting household. He DOES respond to shouting. But there are better ways to deal with that! And I used to be a lot worse. Now, I rarely shout. And sometimes I shouted with intent - not to abuse, but I was in control. And other times I felt completely OUT of control. Those probably were the times when my actions were the MOST abusive.

And sometimes behaviour than can be abusive (shouting) isn't abuse in the right context. If I saw my son about to step into traffic, and shouting would stop him - I wouldn't feel it was abusive or wrong. My friends have hurt me really badly - in rugby practice - it wasn't abuse - even though one girl has sent me to hospital twice! (actually both those incidents were accidental and weren't part of tackles, but I have been deliberately physically hurt by my friends, just not that badly)

And thanks LeagueGIrl for the abuse defense. (Not defense of abuse!)

Thanks Elkclan.

About calling the police for a meltdown..

Is using a sledge hammer for brain surgery. My husband's meltdowns got increasingly more violent due to work stress. Think how a young Aspie let's loose at home after a terrible day at school. I never said anything, and just let him be by himself.

It wasn't until he started slamming his head bloody into the wall, that I got concerned. I didn't know he had Aspergers, and he was already knocking himself out with the head slams.

The sole reason I called the police is he was endangering others with his actions. I could not have lived with myself someone's grandmother died, because I didn't call. I've had people who told me later, should have let him do his thing, and if he died or was maimed so be it. Sort of like suit yourself fool. I would have called the police on anyone doing what my husband did.

The reason the guns where drawn, is my husband's actions where so over the top abnormal (even by meltdown standards), the police thought he was a) armed and/or b) high on something. I couldn't say he didn't have a weapon or wasn't on something. I honestly didn't know.

I have read about Cassandra syndrome. *shrug* It doesn't fit me. My husband doesn't need my saving, he needs to find his own way that works for him. I'm too damn lazy to consider someone a human fixer upper project and sink all my time into that.

I have found out, that my city's police force has had autism awareness training. The police would have never had weapons out if they knew the person had Autism in a typical meltdown situation like the OP had.