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MSBKyle
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07 Nov 2014, 8:28 pm

Why does God make us come to a world full of diseases, war, bad people, and evil? Why do some people seem to have everything and others seem to have very little? Why does he take some people young and lets others live to 100 and older? I have faith and I do believe in God and a higher power, but I don't understand the way things work at times. God is suppose to be perfect and all powerful. If he is perfect, then why is there chaos and suffering in this world? Where is God when bad things are happening? Why do people work hard and get very little or nothing and others prosper? I have so many questions about these things and I would really love to know the answers. I know that no one can simply answer these questions except God, but does anyone else feel this way or have these questions?



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07 Nov 2014, 10:41 pm

Your premise is flawed since it depends on the assumption that one or more gods exist.

An omnipresent, omnipotent, omnibenevolent and omniscience is logically impossible.
Any other category of god that may hypothetically clearly has little interest in the suffering of man.

Based on a lack of evidence I personally can only conclude that gods do not exist, your mileage may vary.


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ripped
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08 Nov 2014, 12:53 am

Because there is nothing to prove that God is any more perfect than you are.



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08 Nov 2014, 4:03 am

Because he does not exist! If he did then hes some sick sadistic bastard with insecurity issues!


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08 Nov 2014, 6:24 am

I will keep on believing no matter what anybody else thinks, that is my prerogative. there has to be an ultimate purpose to it all, AFAIC.



Shep
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08 Nov 2014, 7:26 am

To everyone who has responded on this thread thus far except auntblabby, this is not a "does God exist?" thread, it's a "Why does God..." thread. Keep the "nonexistent" arguments to threads on the subject. (And I'm excluding auntblabby because he's not debating that premise like the rest of you are.)

MSBKyle wrote:
Why does God make us come to a world full of diseases, war, bad people, and evil? Why do some people seem to have everything and others seem to have very little? Why does he take some people young and lets others live to 100 and older? I have faith and I do believe in God and a higher power, but I don't understand the way things work at times. God is suppose to be perfect and all powerful. If he is perfect, then why is there chaos and suffering in this world? Where is God when bad things are happening? Why do people work hard and get very little or nothing and others prosper? I have so many questions about these things and I would really love to know the answers. I know that no one can simply answer these questions except God, but does anyone else feel this way or have these questions?
The movie God's Not Dead will help you greatly with this. I have no connection with this other than seeing clips of it at my church (not the one I'm starting) and having done the sermon series on it. Now it's time to dissect this post (but in a friendly way -- no harm intended here! :D )

MSBKyle wrote:
Why does God make us come to a world full of diseases, war, bad people, and evil?
The latter three are a matter of free will -- God chose to give us that so that we could either choose to appreciate him, or choose to reject him. What point is making a perfect world where every single being praises you? I'm sure it gets boring and mundane fast. So he did chose to allow us to decide, and things only prospered from there!

As far as the first one goes, I'll be honest, I need to research that one before I can answer that for you :)

MSBKyle wrote:
Why do some people seem to have everything and others seem to have very little?
The movie I mentioned above has a scene that addresses this. Ever notice how most of the richy-rich people have a significant distrust for God, or seem to only half-believe? There's a reason for this. Think of it this way: if you had a prison cell with the door wide open, that was decked out with all the money, hookers, beer, technology, gadgets, and was the size of a mansion, and there were ZERO consequences for doing bad things, would you enjoy it there? I know I would. But here's the thing: suddenly that door slams on shut, and all that good stuff disappears, and you realize time just ran out and you're stuck in prison. Now what? Is it too late to turn back and realize a darker power was behind it all? That you could've desired the right things in life and been given eternal happiness as a result, instead of temporary gain and eternal suffering? That's why some people seem to "have it all", while the lower guys like us wonder why we don't have more. God isn't about riches, he's about faith.

Matthew 6:24 (NIV):
"No one can serve two masters. Either you will hate the one and love the other, or you will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and money."

Hebrews 13:5 (NIV):
"Keep your lives free from the love of money and be content with what you have, because God has said, 'Never will I leave you; never will I forsake you.' "

Hope this helps!

MSBKyle wrote:
Why does he take some people young and lets others live to 100 and older?
More honesty, this one will need research as well before I can get back to you :)

MSBKyle wrote:
I have so many questions about these things and I would really love to know the answers. I know that no one can simply answer these questions except God
Shenanigans, humans can answer them too. God gave us his word through the Bible, and through that many, many things are answered (although to be fair, not everything is! Do animals go to heaven? Doesn't say! :) )



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08 Nov 2014, 11:02 am

It is not that God -allows- pain and suffering. It is that God cannot prevent them in all cases.

The notion that God is Omnipotent is a bogus notion. If God were Omnipotent, He could make a rock so heavy that He could not lift it.

ruveyn



0_equals_true
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08 Nov 2014, 11:30 am

There is a separation between a concept of a creator, and a "god' that wishes to be worshiped, and actual give a s**t what happens.

This whole exercise is rather circular, whether there is a god or not, suffering is part of nature, you don't need to believe to be a good person. That is something you need figure out yourself.



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08 Nov 2014, 12:38 pm

Because the creator-god is evil.



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08 Nov 2014, 1:17 pm

The answer to me is incredibly simple as i have experienced heaven and hell in REAL LIFE..

UP CLOSE AND PERSONAL...

LIGHT COMES FROM DARK...

Truly it's as simple as that..to me....

But more on that here.. below so above.. for those who are interested..

few or many as they may be..

as i don't want to make this 'my' show.. here. :)


http://katiemiafrederick.com/2014/11/08 ... uper-hero/


I would never come to know GOD like I do if it were not for ALL my suffering in life.. in the darkness of what CAN BE.. BEFORE light strikes like LIGHTENING in one's life with ONE.. AS THE LIGHT OF HEAVEN.. INSTEAD OF DARK OF HELL...

I appreciate every suffering moment of IT.. and i Thank THE GOD of Mother Nature True for IT...

Every second of every day.. NOW.. always NOW.....

Living is an amazing thing.. both in dark and light.. Heaven exists on this terrestrial plane...

Some folks TRULY walk in heaven and some folks TRULY walk in hell... and again since i've been to both
places I CAN RELATE...

As to why.. truly why should the GOD of ALL have to answer to silly little human beings like a speck of dust in ALL OF creation.. in silly little human words...

But for one who listens.. the answer may be clear in Karma.. but that is an issue of instinct and intuition.. aka FEELINGS..

THAT no science project will ever likely know...

And that's what's really cool about it.. we do not KNOW.. that's the illusion... THE KNOW part.. of culture.. complex language.. and what is described as standard IQ.. in modern 'westernized' cultures...

The LIVING..FEELING..MOVING.. PART IS reality...

But again.. neither my cat or i have to know that....

WE LIVE IT.

WE FEEL IT.

WE MOVE IT.

AND i for one SING IT...

AND THAT'S ENOUGH. :)

for me..

i do NOT need to know it..

i can NOT know it..

But YES..!

i live it.. feel it..

MOVE IT.. AND SING IT...

MOST Humans are born to live IT.. feel IT.. move IT and sing IT...

Most everything else is complex written language and cultural illusion.....

And to be clear the interdependent relationship of all things is what i consider IT..
AKA GOD aka MOTHER NATURE TRUE... Nah.. not hard not to prove..
@ALL.

Apologies in advance for anyone who is annoyed by poetic responses.. and or free verse languaged form..

but sometimes IT's JUST necessary to DO IT..

To get a point across.. in FEELING.. NOT only words....

'As words without feelings are just empty houses without humans.'

My quote, by A way..:)


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Shep
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08 Nov 2014, 2:51 pm

ruveyn wrote:
It is not that God -allows- pain and suffering. It is that God cannot prevent them in all cases.
I respectfully disagree with this. God gave us eternal life, with no sickness, health issues, or anything of the sort. He made one tree in the garden of Eden that would void all of this and told Adam and Eve not to eat from it. This goes back to the free will thing -- how can you truly show appreciation for someone? By choosing to care, not being forced to. I mean let's face it, you love your pet more than your physical computer, right? But your computer does anything and everything you tell it to do. It's not until something goes wrong and it misbehaves that the feeling you have of that computer is soured, and it's not until when it's fixed that said feeling is even better than the baseline (for a while, at least, until it's back to doing everything you want it to do).

More to the point: Adam and Eve could choose not to eat from that tree, or they could choose to disobey God and eat from it. We know how that turned out, and that was the start of death and disease. So it actually is that God allows it. Keep in mind: in times of crisis, you find out who your true friends are. Sickness is a crisis that God (while not having "invented" it) can repurpose for the same reason. Are you spiteful at him for getting sick, or trust that in the end, everything's going to be okay, regardless of the outcome?

ruveyn wrote:
The notion that God is Omnipotent is a bogus notion. If God were Omnipotent, He could make a rock so heavy that He could not lift it.
This is circular logic. If he made a rock so heavy he couldn't lift it, then he wouldn't be omnipotent. Not to mention, what exactly would the point of said rock be? What would you do with it? Where would you put it? And which of the 100 to 200 billion galaxies would you put it in? Come to think of it, where is it said that such a rock doesn't exist, sitting there to prove us all wrong??? :wink:



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08 Nov 2014, 5:10 pm

a minority opinion here, but that IMHO god is "all that is," and "all that is" is god, IOW we all are pieces of god and in the aggregate ARE god. I'm inclined to believe that the trinity of 1]father 2]son 3]holy spirit is 1]god in the form of god's creation, 2]god's creation itself, and 3]creation as the combined spirit energy of the creator, IOW it can be said we are both the creators as well as the created.



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08 Nov 2014, 5:15 pm

This is a common question people ask. Indeed, if there is a loving God, then why does he permit suffering? Well, I'd like to share what I've learned.

The God from the Bible has a name: Jehovah. ( Psalms 83:18 ) He allows suffering due to moral issues that were raised long ago. What issues? In the garden of Eden, a spirit creature, now known as Satan, called God a liar who withholds good from his creatures. (Genesis 3:3-5) By his words, Satan also implied that the first woman, Eve?and by extension, all humans?would be better off without God's rulership. Thus, Satan was calling into question the rightfulness of God's sovereignty. The first human couple, Adam and Eve, ended up siding with Satan and chose to rebel against God's rule. By doing this, they asserted that man can decide for themselves what is good and what is bad.

The rebellion in Eden raised vital questions. Who has the right to rule? Whose rule is right? Could humans do better if they were not ruled by God? To answer such questions, time was needed. Thus, for a limited time, Jehovah has allowed rebellion against his sovereignty to show that no effort to rule without him benefits people. (Ecclesiastes 7:29; 8:9) Looking at the world today and some 6,000 years of human history, the evidence is quite clear. Human rulers have failed; they are incapable of solving mankind's problems. (Jeremiah 10:23)

It is clear we need God's rulership. Jehovah knows His way of ruling is best. Soon he will bring an end to all human governments and wickedness. (Daniel 2:44; Proverbs 2:22) He will also get rid of all suffering. Concerning what life will be like on earth in the future, the Bible says: "He [God] will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former things have passed away." (Revelation 21:4) Those who choose to be ruled by God will be able to live forever on earth. (Acts 10:35; Psalm 37:29)



Last edited by MBoura on 09 Nov 2014, 1:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

auntblabby
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08 Nov 2014, 5:44 pm

MBoura wrote:
This is a common question people ask. Indeed, if there is a loving God, then why does he permit suffering? Well, I'd like to share what I've learned.

hiya MBoura :) welcome to the club. 8) at this point I'd welcome god clearing the slate and starting anew.



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08 Nov 2014, 6:32 pm

Shep wrote:
ruveyn wrote:
It is not that God -allows- pain and suffering. It is that God cannot prevent them in all cases.
I respectfully disagree with this. God gave us eternal life, with no sickness, health issues, or anything of the sort.

You are assuming the existence of an afterlife. Ruveyn is Jewish, and many Jews reject the idea of Heaven.

I think it's also worth remembering that free will doesn't exist, so there's not much sense appealing to it.



Shep
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08 Nov 2014, 6:39 pm

The_Walrus wrote:
You are assuming the existence of an afterlife. Ruveyn is Jewish, and many Jews reject the idea of Heaven.

I think it's also worth remembering that free will doesn't exist, so there's not much sense appealing to it.
I'll just say it: this whole post is flat-out wrong. "Existence of an afterlife" comes straight out of their own beliefs. See here for an example:
Quote:
Traditional Judaism firmly believes that death is not the end of human existence.
There's a whole page on proving that point wrong. And that's just the first one I Googled quite honestly.

And for the "free will doesn't exist" point, that's just downright silly :lol: