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Gauldoth
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11 Jun 2015, 5:15 am

yellowtamarin wrote:
A woman doesn't give a man sex. Two people (or more) have sex together. So a man doesn't need to offer anything in exchange for sex, he can "offer" the same sex that she is "offering" because they are having that same sex together.

You keep saying that; that women are willing to exchange sex for sex with men. But both empirical and scientific data seem to suggest otherwise. Do you seriously expect me to take your word over that?

yellowtamarin wrote:
This says nothing about the fact that it is more difficult for some men to find willing female participants than others. That's a whole different story, yet you seem to be using your example of undesirability (I'm basing this on what you are saying, not meaning to assume) as a generalisation, i.e. you think that if women don't want to have sex with you, they must not want to have sex at all. But since you have denied following women to their homes and looking through their bedroom windows, and instead base your assumptions on your own experience plus observing women generally in non-sexual environments, you can't possibly know how things in the bedroom really are for "nearly all women".


You keep trying to make this about me because you by now I'm sure you've realized you can't beat me in an argument. Trouble is it's not just me. There are tons of guys out there, some who are even more attractive and overall just better than me, who are in the exact same situation. You know you women don't usually like to associate with icky omega/low-status males, but just look around the Internet for a while. There are tons of sites full of guys like this; love-shy, sluthate, even this very own website. See, the real problem here is that it's not just me. There's tons of other guys in the same situation. Why? Because they're low-status males who have nothing but their own consent to exchange with women for theirs, and women will NOT exchange sex for sex. And if no men are around who have anything that actually interests them to exchange for their consent, then women will simply not have sex. This is further backed-up by studies that show that humans today are descended from twice as many females as they are from males.

So, yeah, I don't really need to see women actually having sex to know whether they enjoy it or not. The way women use sex as a means to leverage men to get other things that you're actually interested in, the way you seem to try to get away with giving out as little of it as possible even when the goods are delivered, plus the scientific and empirical data... that tells me all I need to know about how women's attitude toward sex. No matter how much you vociferously claim otherwise. :roll:



kraftiekortie
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11 Jun 2015, 8:40 am

I think it would help you if you listened to other people's viewpoint, rather than just argue all the time.



goldfish21
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11 Jun 2015, 11:32 am

Gauldoth wrote:
You keep trying to make this about me because you by now I'm sure you've realized you can't beat me in an argument. Trouble is it's not just me. There are tons of guys out there, some who are even more attractive and overall just better than me, who are in the exact same situation. You know you women don't usually like to associate with icky omega/low-status males, but just look around the Internet for a while. There are tons of sites full of guys like this; love-shy, sluthate, even this very own website. See, the real problem here is that it's not just me. There's tons of other guys in the same situation. Why? Because they're low-status males who have nothing but their own consent to exchange with women for theirs, and women will NOT exchange sex for sex. And if no men are around who have anything that actually interests them to exchange for their consent, then women will simply not have sex. This is further backed-up by studies that show that humans today are descended from twice as many females as they are from males.

So, yeah, I don't really need to see women actually having sex to know whether they enjoy it or not. The way women use sex as a means to leverage men to get other things that you're actually interested in, the way you seem to try to get away with giving out as little of it as possible even when the goods are delivered, plus the scientific and empirical data... that tells me all I need to know about how women's attitude toward sex. No matter how much you vociferously claim otherwise. :roll:


You've done the same thing here as in another thread - declared yourself the winner of an argument even though no one else has agreed you're the winner & to the contrary people are explaining to you why you're wrong. Ridiculous.

You've also completely ignored my post explaining to you that it isn't your status as to why you can't get laid. It's your AS symptoms and terribly lacking social skills. Guaranteed.

I personally know many "low status" males who aren't exactly "beautiful people" or in good shape, who don't have ANY money - just debt. No cars. No fancy clothes. Nothing they can be used for by women (besides sex itself) & yet they manage to get laid just fine because their social skills are good enough to communicate with women & get themselves dates and one night stands. It really is as simple as that.

If you want to connect with women, treat your AS symptoms & improve your social/communication skills.


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Gauldoth
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11 Jun 2015, 1:12 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
Gauldoth wrote:
You keep trying to make this about me because you by now I'm sure you've realized you can't beat me in an argument. Trouble is it's not just me. There are tons of guys out there, some who are even more attractive and overall just better than me, who are in the exact same situation. You know you women don't usually like to associate with icky omega/low-status males, but just look around the Internet for a while. There are tons of sites full of guys like this; love-shy, sluthate, even this very own website. See, the real problem here is that it's not just me. There's tons of other guys in the same situation. Why? Because they're low-status males who have nothing but their own consent to exchange with women for theirs, and women will NOT exchange sex for sex. And if no men are around who have anything that actually interests them to exchange for their consent, then women will simply not have sex. This is further backed-up by studies that show that humans today are descended from twice as many females as they are from males.

So, yeah, I don't really need to see women actually having sex to know whether they enjoy it or not. The way women use sex as a means to leverage men to get other things that you're actually interested in, the way you seem to try to get away with giving out as little of it as possible even when the goods are delivered, plus the scientific and empirical data... that tells me all I need to know about how women's attitude toward sex. No matter how much you vociferously claim otherwise. :roll:


You've done the same thing here as in another thread - declared yourself the winner of an argument even though no one else has agreed you're the winner & to the contrary people are explaining to you why you're wrong. Ridiculous.

You've also completely ignored my post explaining to you that it isn't your status as to why you can't get laid. It's your AS symptoms and terribly lacking social skills. Guaranteed.

If you want to connect with women, treat your AS symptoms & improve your social/communication skills.


Nope. Admittedly my AS doesn't help, but my low-status is mostly due to my being physically unattractive. With enough good-looks, you can even "override" your Aspergers all-together. After all, a good-looking Aspie is a strong, confident lone wolf, a rebel who doesn't follow the trends. While an ugly Aspie is just an anti-social creep. :roll:

goldfish21 wrote:
I personally know many "low status" males who aren't exactly "beautiful people" or in good shape, who don't have ANY money - just debt. No cars. No fancy clothes. Nothing they can be used for by women (besides sex itself) & yet they manage to get laid just fine because their social skills are good enough to communicate with women & get themselves dates and one night stands. It really is as simple as that.


Again, so you say. But much like your claim that women are as sexual as men are and enjoy sex as much as we do, reality and the facts around us seem to indicate otherwise. :roll:



mpe
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11 Jun 2015, 2:06 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
rdos wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
You both completely missed gay men who grant mutual consent & F for the pure pleasure of it.


A marginal group that has no neurodiversity connection, so it's not interesting (asexuality is far more common).

goldfish21 wrote:
Also, neither of you has posted an explanation for lesbian sex. If it's not for pleasure, or for getting a man to give them something, or to make babies.. then how do you even explain it's existence??? I'm curious what you two's theory on that one is.


I could. In the case of neurodiverse lesbians, one factor might be to avoid men and sexual intercourse. Other than that, women pairing up seems to be a neurodiverse relationship trait, but then it probably typically is bisexuality, not exclusive homosexuality. It also seems like many lesbians actually do not have sex (could be wrong, but this is something I've read).


Fail. There's a lot higher LGBT rates amongst those with ASD vs. NT's. So, there is a connection.


There is also a higher rate of polyamourous and kinky people amongst ND's.
It would be better to say that there is more diversity (which includes asexuals) here.
Even some hetero, monogamous and vanilla ND people could potentially benefit from 'unconventional' relationships. e.g. avoiding co-habitation.



mpe
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11 Jun 2015, 2:12 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
Gauldoth wrote:
You keep trying to make this about me because you by now I'm sure you've realized you can't beat me in an argument. Trouble is it's not just me. There are tons of guys out there, some who are even more attractive and overall just better than me, who are in the exact same situation. You know you women don't usually like to associate with icky omega/low-status males, but just look around the Internet for a while. There are tons of sites full of guys like this; love-shy, sluthate, even this very own website. See, the real problem here is that it's not just me. There's tons of other guys in the same situation. Why? Because they're low-status males who have nothing but their own consent to exchange with women for theirs, and women will NOT exchange sex for sex. And if no men are around who have anything that actually interests them to exchange for their consent, then women will simply not have sex. This is further backed-up by studies that show that humans today are descended from twice as many females as they are from males.

So, yeah, I don't really need to see women actually having sex to know whether they enjoy it or not. The way women use sex as a means to leverage men to get other things that you're actually interested in, the way you seem to try to get away with giving out as little of it as possible even when the goods are delivered, plus the scientific and empirical data... that tells me all I need to know about how women's attitude toward sex. No matter how much you vociferously claim otherwise. :roll:


You've done the same thing here as in another thread - declared yourself the winner of an argument even though no one else has agreed you're the winner & to the contrary people are explaining to you why you're wrong. Ridiculous.

You've also completely ignored my post explaining to you that it isn't your status as to why you can't get laid. It's your AS symptoms and terribly lacking social skills. Guaranteed.


Another hypothesis would be that AS & lacking social skills is the cause of both...



goldfish21
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11 Jun 2015, 5:07 pm

Gauldoth wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Gauldoth wrote:
You keep trying to make this about me because you by now I'm sure you've realized you can't beat me in an argument. Trouble is it's not just me. There are tons of guys out there, some who are even more attractive and overall just better than me, who are in the exact same situation. You know you women don't usually like to associate with icky omega/low-status males, but just look around the Internet for a while. There are tons of sites full of guys like this; love-shy, sluthate, even this very own website. See, the real problem here is that it's not just me. There's tons of other guys in the same situation. Why? Because they're low-status males who have nothing but their own consent to exchange with women for theirs, and women will NOT exchange sex for sex. And if no men are around who have anything that actually interests them to exchange for their consent, then women will simply not have sex. This is further backed-up by studies that show that humans today are descended from twice as many females as they are from males.

So, yeah, I don't really need to see women actually having sex to know whether they enjoy it or not. The way women use sex as a means to leverage men to get other things that you're actually interested in, the way you seem to try to get away with giving out as little of it as possible even when the goods are delivered, plus the scientific and empirical data... that tells me all I need to know about how women's attitude toward sex. No matter how much you vociferously claim otherwise. :roll:


You've done the same thing here as in another thread - declared yourself the winner of an argument even though no one else has agreed you're the winner & to the contrary people are explaining to you why you're wrong. Ridiculous.

You've also completely ignored my post explaining to you that it isn't your status as to why you can't get laid. It's your AS symptoms and terribly lacking social skills. Guaranteed.

If you want to connect with women, treat your AS symptoms & improve your social/communication skills.


Nope. Admittedly my AS doesn't help, but my low-status is mostly due to my being physically unattractive. With enough good-looks, you can even "override" your Aspergers all-together. After all, a good-looking Aspie is a strong, confident lone wolf, a rebel who doesn't follow the trends. While an ugly Aspie is just an anti-social creep. :roll:

goldfish21 wrote:
I personally know many "low status" males who aren't exactly "beautiful people" or in good shape, who don't have ANY money - just debt. No cars. No fancy clothes. Nothing they can be used for by women (besides sex itself) & yet they manage to get laid just fine because their social skills are good enough to communicate with women & get themselves dates and one night stands. It really is as simple as that.


Again, so you say. But much like your claim that women are as sexual as men are and enjoy sex as much as we do, reality and the facts around us seem to indicate otherwise. :roll:


AS traits & your own thoughts/beliefs/perceptions are far bigger constraints than your actual appearance. I know some pretty "ugly" looking guys who have decent social skills are able to attract women fairly frequently. If they believed they were unattractive and couldn't get women, then that would be their reality, and they wouldn't get laid. But to the contrary, despite being terribly out of shape with tons of facial scars (pock marks, dog bites, and a run in with a barbed wire fence all on one face for example) he's still confident in himself and able to communicate with women all the time.

Further, I bet YOU think you're uglier than others think you are. To prove my point, post a picture and let others give you their honest feedback on yourself. From my own experience, I used to believe I wasn't good looking even though people would compliment my looks. I was depressed and assumed others were just telling me what they thought I needed to hear and that I was in fact unattractive. I still don't think of myself as some male model or anything, but I'm no longer depressed and don't perceive myself as an ugly human being. Change your thoughts & perceptions and your entire reality changes for the better.

As for womens' attitudes towards sex... again, your perceptions, thoughts, beliefs etc form your reality. My and MOST other peoples' reality is that most women do in fact enjoy sex and don't just use it as a form of currency to get what they need or want from the male end of the economy.


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Gauldoth
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11 Jun 2015, 5:38 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
AS traits & your own thoughts/beliefs/perceptions are far bigger constraints than your actual appearance. I know some pretty "ugly" looking guys who have decent social skills are able to attract women fairly frequently. If they believed they were unattractive and couldn't get women, then that would be their reality, and they wouldn't get laid. But to the contrary, despite being terribly out of shape with tons of facial scars (pock marks, dog bites, and a run in with a barbed wire fence all on one face for example) he's still confident in himself and able to communicate with women all the time.

Further, I bet YOU think you're uglier than others think you are. To prove my point, post a picture and let others give you their honest feedback on yourself. From my own experience, I used to believe I wasn't good looking even though people would compliment my looks. I was depressed and assumed others were just telling me what they thought I needed to hear and that I was in fact unattractive. I still don't think of myself as some male model or anything, but I'm no longer depressed and don't perceive myself as an ugly human being. Change your thoughts & perceptions and your entire reality changes for the better.

As for womens' attitudes towards sex... again, your perceptions, thoughts, beliefs etc form your reality. My and MOST other peoples' reality is that most women do in fact enjoy sex and don't just use it as a form of currency to get what they need or want from the male end of the economy.


Ah, the old "just be confident" shlock. I honestly can't even tell if you're serious about that, all I'll say is that if you are, and you're actually that naive, then I envy you for your innocence. :roll:

As for the rest, I'll just repeat (once again) what I said before and move on: you say one thing, reality and the facts around us say another, and in my experience, empirical data and scientific studies tend to be a hell of a lot more reliable than random guys on the Internet. :roll:



yellowtamarin
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11 Jun 2015, 6:50 pm

Gauldoth wrote:
There are tons of guys out there, some who are even more attractive and overall just better than me, who are in the exact same situation. You know you women don't usually like to associate with icky omega/low-status males, but just look around the Internet for a while. There are tons of sites full of guys like this; love-shy, sluthate, even this very own website. See, the real problem here is that it's not just me. There's tons of other guys in the same situation. Why? Because they're low-status males who have nothing but their own consent to exchange with women for theirs, and women will NOT exchange sex for sex. And if no men are around who have anything that actually interests them to exchange for their consent, then women will simply not have sex. This is further backed-up by studies that show that humans today are descended from twice as many females as they are from males.

So, yeah, I don't really need to see women actually having sex to know whether they enjoy it or not. The way women use sex as a means to leverage men to get other things that you're actually interested in, the way you seem to try to get away with giving out as little of it as possible even when the goods are delivered, plus the scientific and empirical data... that tells me all I need to know about how women's attitude toward sex. No matter how much you vociferously claim otherwise. :roll:

"Most women don't have sex with whoever asks them" =/= "Most women don't enjoy sex".

Yes, it is true that most women will not have sex with someone they are not interested in (for whatever reason). Yes, some women probably "offer" sex sometimes and play games where they only give so much in order to get other things that they want. What on earth has that to do with whether they enjoy the act of sex when they do have it, with someone they want to have it with?



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11 Jun 2015, 11:00 pm

Thread not going anywhere.
(locked at OP's request).


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