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ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
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25 Jun 2015, 4:53 pm

Why couldn't the founding fathers put that in the constitution then we would all be free to earn without government hassling us. Of course, it would wreck havoc on the environment but there would be more opportunity.



naturalplastic
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25 Jun 2015, 5:05 pm

Probably because half of the founding fathers relied on laborers who couldnt earn pay (ie were slaves). Lol!

But yeah- if I wanna sell my daily bread by selling crack to school kids...gosh darn it!...why should the government stop me????



ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
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25 Jun 2015, 5:09 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
Probably because half of the founding fathers relied on laborers who couldnt earn pay (ie were slaves). Lol!

But yeah- if I wanna sell my daily bread by selling crack to school kids...gosh darn it!...why should the government stop me????



Who should stop you is the kids' parents. The government is losing the war on drugs because the culture will not police itself. Doesn't want to take on the responsibility.

What people are doing now is throwing their arms in the air, saying the government has to do it. It's like no one wants to take on responsibility. It's always the government that must do everything.



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25 Jun 2015, 5:30 pm

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
Probably because half of the founding fathers relied on laborers who couldnt earn pay (ie were slaves). Lol!

But yeah- if I wanna sell my daily bread by selling crack to school kids...gosh darn it!...why should the government stop me????



Who should stop you is the kids' parents. The government is losing the war on drugs because the culture will not police itself. Doesn't want to take on the responsibility.

What people are doing now is throwing their arms in the air, saying the government has to do it. It's like no one wants to take on responsibility. It's always the government that must do everything.


So the government should not protect us from burglers, and rapists, and from foreign armies, and foreign terrorists, and from ISIS, and so on. No police? No armed forces?



ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
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25 Jun 2015, 5:39 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
So the government should not protect us from burglers, and rapists, and from foreign armies, and foreign terrorists, and from ISIS, and so on. No police? No armed forces?


I never typed anything close to what you just typed but there are times it's either strike or be struck because the government cannot be there. Are cops everywhere all the time? Even in a police state, they can't be everywhere at once. Do you agree the government cannot protect people from drugs? They haven't so far. In this area, you MUST be proactive and take responsibility. You have to protect yourself. You have to decide you don't want to take them and be strong and show resolve. Otherwise, folks will just place drugs before you and you will be tempted to take them.

Demand runs the drug market. If no one buys the drugs, drug dealers don't make money, thus, they go out of business and find another way to make money. That's the free market determination.



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25 Jun 2015, 6:14 pm

Just so this doesn't turn into a War On Drugs thread here are some other ways to earn money that people have tried that were stomped on by government interference:

-adding dyes to food to cover up that it has gone bad, adding chalk dust to flour to stretch it out (two of the many business practices that got the FDA formed with Food Purity Act)

-dumping toxic waste in rivers or burying it

-locking workers in stores
http://www.thenation.com/blog/172426/ohsa-charges-workers-were-locked-inside-target-stores-overnight

The FDA is government interference to keep people from earning money by selling you adulterated or poisonous food and medication. The EPA is government interference to keep people from earning money by just tossing waste from their company wherever they want. OSHA is government interference to keep people from earning money by paying other people to work in dangerous, unhealthy conditions.

There are a lot of regulations and they sure could be streamlined, but unfettered capitalism with no government regulations whatsoever would be a nightmare for consumers, workers and the environment.

If you think the EPA is just getting in the way of people making a living, look what happens without it.

http://www.fidelity.com.au/insights-centre/investment-articles/chinae28099s-industrialisation-is-an-environmental-disaster/

Quote:
China’s water is generally unfit to drink and can be deadly too because it is riddled with industrial waste, farm chemical runoff and untreated sewage. As much as half the water in cities is said to be unsafe for humans, according to reports, while as much as one-third of the waterways of major rivers is unfit for human use. Dead fish are a regular sight on China’s rivers, depriving locals of what should be a healthy source of food. Xinhua, for instance, reported on September 3 last year that fish killed by chemical waste covered more than 40 kilometres of the Fu River[6] in central Hubei province. In March last year, thousands of dead pigs were found in a river that supplies water to Shanghai. A water-scarce country such as China – 20% of the world’s population but only 7% of the earth’s water – can’t afford to make unfit what water it has


But at least some people made money. :skull:



ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
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25 Jun 2015, 6:52 pm

Janissy wrote:
Just so this doesn't turn into a War On Drugs thread here are some other ways to earn money that people have tried that were stomped on by government interference:

-adding dyes to food to cover up that it has gone bad, adding chalk dust to flour to stretch it out (two of the many business practices that got the FDA formed with Food Purity Act)

-dumping toxic waste in rivers or burying it

-locking workers in stores
http://www.thenation.com/blog/172426/ohsa-charges-workers-were-locked-inside-target-stores-overnight

The FDA is government interference to keep people from earning money by selling you adulterated or poisonous food and medication. The EPA is government interference to keep people from earning money by just tossing waste from their company wherever they want. OSHA is government interference to keep people from earning money by paying other people to work in dangerous, unhealthy conditions.

There are a lot of regulations and they sure could be streamlined, but unfettered capitalism with no government regulations whatsoever would be a nightmare for consumers, workers and the environment.

If you think the EPA is just getting in the way of people making a living, look what happens without it.

http://www.fidelity.com.au/insights-centre/investment-articles/chinae28099s-industrialisation-is-an-environmental-disaster/
Quote:
China’s water is generally unfit to drink and can be deadly too because it is riddled with industrial waste, farm chemical runoff and untreated sewage. As much as half the water in cities is said to be unsafe for humans, according to reports, while as much as one-third of the waterways of major rivers is unfit for human use. Dead fish are a regular sight on China’s rivers, depriving locals of what should be a healthy source of food. Xinhua, for instance, reported on September 3 last year that fish killed by chemical waste covered more than 40 kilometres of the Fu River[6] in central Hubei province. In March last year, thousands of dead pigs were found in a river that supplies water to Shanghai. A water-scarce country such as China – 20% of the world’s population but only 7% of the earth’s water – can’t afford to make unfit what water it has


But at least some people made money. :skull:



Due to fraudulent practices, unscrupulous sellers would quickly go out of business if no one bought their products.

Instead, they go to the ones who don't put weird stuff in the food and this is why free enterprise stands a chance of working. It's easy to tell. Quality speaks volumes. Even now different levels of quality exist, even with regulations. Some food items pulsate with horrible fillers and preservatives, turkey bacon being chief among. Everything is listed on the label and the consumer chooses what to buy. There has to be a point when the consumer takes control and says, I will buy eggs because they do not have a harmful ingredient (unless you count all that cholesterol in the yolk) and eggs will be the focal point of my diet, so long as I split the yolk in half. It's easier to do if they are hard boiled.
Prime example of modern day food contaminants are trans fats. It still goes on. Those shock value ingredients like chalk - it sounds ghastly - oh my God they are putting chalk in our food and this is the worst thing they could put in it! It's chalk which could be made with arsenic for all anyone knows! Or cyanide. Lead, maybe? Nowadays they don't come out and say, look here at this is chalk I am adding, they just have different names so you don't really know what they are adding unless you research it. Could be worse than chalk (so long as it doesn't have anything toxic in it. If it's anything like today's chalk, it most likely contained calcium carbonate) as in trans fats. Research has shown hydrogenated oils are pretty darn bad. So, I look on the label and avoid them unless I really want that frozen pizza. Now the government will do us all a favor and do away with them all together but, through information sharing, I had already regulated them myself.

Here is some info on calcium carbonate in food today from wiki: Look for E170 in the ingredients list.

Quote:
As a food additive it is designated E170;[29] INS number 170. Used as an acidity regulator, anticaking agent, stabiliser or colour it is approved for usage in the EU,[30] USA[31] and Australia and New Zealand.[32] It is used in some soy milk and almond milk products as a source of dietary calcium; one study suggests that calcium carbonate might be as bioavailable as the calcium in cow's milk.[33] Calcium carbonate is also used as a firming agent in many canned or bottled vegetable products.


So see, heh, they are still doing it!! !! Even with the FDA the chalk is still there!

Today it's trans fat. Tomorrow it will be something else, sugar, maybe? Processed, refined sugar is another terrible ingredient that harms loads of people. So it pays to do homework even though sugar makes everything taste so much better and it can be hard to resist with a sweet tooth.

This is why you have the option of going simple - as in meat that hasn't been processed, vegetables from the produce department or farmer's market. Organic whenever possible. If you keep it simple, you are less likely to eat something harmful. I try to avoid processed food because they add too many preservatives and sometimes, chalk, like in Soy and Almond milk. Seems both are more processed than plain old 1% cow's milk yet we are led to believe they are healthier. The food pyramid shows we should limit fats, oils and junk food anyway and junk food is today's "chalk flour." People still eat it, even when they know it can destroy their bodies.

Locking employees in a Target sounds like keeping them from earning since they are not free to moonlight so it would actually be unconstitutional.

And, if polluting water kept people from being able to sell it, thus, earning from the sale of it, that would be unconstitutional under my amendment, also.



chapstan
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25 Jun 2015, 7:08 pm

Well in the Declaration of Independence we have certain inalienable rights . . . Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

Could one try to argue "earning a living" is part of the pursuit of happiness?



ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
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25 Jun 2015, 7:11 pm

chapstan wrote:
Well in the Declaration of Independence we have certain inalienable rights . . . Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

Could one try to argue "earning a living" is part of the pursuit of happiness?


Being able to earn enough money to live comfortably seems to be a key ingredient in one's happiness, so yes!



chapstan
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25 Jun 2015, 8:34 pm

Now of course some like to say, we have the right to the pursuit of happiness, not necessarily to actual happiness. We can chase our dreams but aren't guaranteed catching that dream.