Spouse refuses to see if he is has aspurgers or autism

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Good for you, Elkclan. You have come a long way, and I want to applaud you for that. I made the mistake initially in your early days here of thinking you did not have the willingness to make the changes you have obviously made and achieved. I apologise for misjudging that. I admire the huge changes you have obviously made. Well done you. Fantastic!

I am glad you felt understood, just.....be careful about assuming too much. Everyone really is different. Some people here are more hardened and burdened by life, some retain more optimism. Most of us will say what we think, and sometimes as in the real world it may be hurtful or irrelevant.

I also don't know that I'm in any position to give advice, or whether this is quite what you are looking for, but on the theme that we each are responsible for pursuing our own happiness, the commonality I notice for people in what are often termed neurodiverse relationships who are at peace is complete comfort that what you feel and believe is legitimate.

Rather than waiting for your partner to guess your needs and feelings (something he is unable to do) and rather than assuming he is selfish because of autism (that's false, some autistic people are self centered, some are not and what defines that is personality and how much they and you share a common point of view; if that exists, you may experience an autistic person as incredibly giving and understanding.....really!! but then be shocked when it doesn't last about everything) I think it's important to believe in the validity of your own experience and convey your wishes and needs clearly, concretely, and quickly, before bitterness sets in on your part or defensiveness on his "it's my birthday next week and I'd like you to take me out for a nice Italian meal/get takeout from that place where we met and then spend the evening together etc" might work hints will often be acted on but not the way you want.

I may be misjudging, and often do, however, many of the happiest NT women I have met don't seem to have perfect husbands so much as they feel entitled to feel as they feel and ask for and get what they want.

You shouldn't need him to have any diagnosis to feel entitled to that, just a recognition what's happening and desire to change it, with or without him.

Could you make him read anything? "Be different", an autobiography by Robeson? He has been a sound and light technician for Kiss and a gifted nerd. His views are fairly humouristic and non-labelling, as he is an advocate for neurodiversity. His texts might provide a good mirror for your husband - if you could read it together.
Maybe a naive thought, but it might be worth a try.

My husband was diagnosed at 50.

What did the diagnosis do? It moved his ass to get his depression and anxiety treated, and it saved our marriage.

How?

I finally understood his isolating behavior, sensory issues, and meltdowns were not because of me. What a burden lifted from my shoulders. He would have acted like that with any other human.

My whole life pre diagnosis was twisting myself to keep him from being triggered. I was scared of the melt downs, and his monologs made me feel stupid and inadequate. I thought he was deliberately do all that on purpose.

When I told my husband all this in therapy, he was horrified and started crying. He had no clue how his monologs made everyone feel. We never said boo. We thought he wanted to lord over everyone. The melt downs. We all thought he did it to drive home a point, not uncontrollable behavior.

In the NT world, you almost never call people on their behavior, you just avoid them. So as he got older, the behaviors escalated, people dropped off being friends, and work fired him. When the neighbors called the police on his last big melt down, I told him something was wrong, and he needed help or else I was leaving.

The diagnosis didn't change him. It didn't make Autsim go away. I don't personalize all his actions like I did before. I make sure I'm more considerate for his need for down time. It also gave him an idea how people viewed him before and he's modified some behaviors. The real long monologs are gone. There are things I don't push for anymore because he just can't do them.

He still wants to be married. I asked him if he wanted a divorce after his diagnosis. I figured if dealing with humans was so stressful day in and day out, wouldn't being by yourself with no real obligations except yourself be better? Freedom to start over, and not have marriage and a kid 24/7. I didn't want a divorce, but if he felt he needed that, I would have.

He said he needed people in his life, and loved me. So we are still together.

@B19
Do you participate in this board to judge who is and who is not ok? Do you believe your applause and/or contempt is somehow making a difference in the lives of others? Do you seek to understand before wanting to be heard? What is your motive on these pages?

Wow! What's bringing that on? I don't get how B19's words would elicit such a strong negative reaction from you.

If you want to understand people with AS, understand this - they will often say openly things that NTs refuse to admit they ever thought. I think probably pretty much everyone who is a regular on a forum has looked at a new poster and thought 'oh, they'll follow this classic pattern I've seen before'. B19 is willing to admit to thinking that, and admit to being wrong.

Are you this defensive with your husband, too?

Simple, direct questions were asked of B19. I would say that would be the best route on here, would it not? Why are you so defensive of those questions?

8 question marks to one phrase I said - and more ...Maybe you didn't read his earlier to my post? Not respectful or kind, which is where most NTs are most comfortable operating. It's not a fear of being direct - It's from of place of knowing what is helpful and will create connection. There is a WAY to say things

Am I defensive? Yes I suppose I am a bit. Being attacked verbally isn't something I enjoy

I will sign off this board now because it's as painful as my 18 - year marriage. It's been good to see this for sure. Confirmation of sorts

LSG, I hope you saw Tawaki's post before you signed off for good. I think her experience could be very helpful for you moving forward, and I hope you can follow through with her in PM.

Either way, I sincerely wish the best for you and your husband. It's difficult to work the NT/ASD divide in a relationship (if, indeed, that's what is at play in your situation), but not impossible. Good luck!

I think people often get autism and narcissism mixed up. If you look at Tawaki's post for example what she wrote about her husband, he made some changes and the fact he felt bad and stopped doing certain things, that is a sign of not a narcissist there because narcs do not change and they stay the same while aspies do change.

But anyone else who is in a toxic relationship, the chances are the person is a narcissist and I think many people confuse this. I would suggest for the OP and elkclan to read up on narcissism and relationships. When I read about it, I have learned that my ex was actually a narcissist than aspie so that explained why he was so toxic and his traits too, it was all narcissism. Everyone has always told me he was an as*hole. I do not doubt those women on AssPartners are in a abusive relationship with their ex's and partners because I have been there and can relate but the only thing that bothers me about that forum is them blaming it all on autism and you would think they would be relieved that it's narcissism than autism because they can now scratch off that we are all toxic people and out to hurt them and bring down their low self esteem because that is narcissism, not autism. But nope, they don't want to hear that wonderful news so they want to continue hating on us. I think it should be called narcpartners. I am sure one can have both. Plus few of those women have admitted they are not even sure their partner is aspie or not but they don't care so they will just keep continuing scapegoating autism.

Also it seems like people always get offended when they find out that someone once thought of something negative about someone. For example, "I'm pregnant." "Oh, I thought you were just getting fat." The preggers is now offended because she just found out that the other person thought she was getting fat. But I think this is human behavior than NT because I have seen plenty of times online written by ASD people. They tell people they are autistic, the feedback they would sometimes get is "Oh I just thought you were an as*hole, now that explains everything" and they are so offended about that they ever thought that of them. Or maybe they are offended about the fact that they came off that way to others so they feel bad than what was said to them. But B19 had apologized for even thinking negative of elkclan. How many people out there actually apologize for misjudging someone? Instead they just say what they thought of you before and then say nothing else. No apology.

I don't know if the OP's husband is narcissist or not because she didn't really say what issues they are having and what he does to her that hurts her but I agree a diagnoses wouldn't change it even if he does have Asperger's. If someone isn't willing to change, a label isn't going to work. It's not like her husband will think "Oh s**t, I have been wrong all this time, what can I do to improve to make this marriage better and to help my wife feel better so I won't keep hurting her or making her feel bad. What can I do to help myself now that I know I am the one with the problem." That is a pipe dream someone can have. But if that is too much for an aspie to handle, then divorce is the option because they love their partner and don't want to keep hurting them and making them depressed because they deserve someone better.

I don't know what you mean by this but B19 was only saying that she misjudged Elkclan when she first came on the site. There was nothing else implied by that post. We often feel that people misjudge us before bothering to understand our point of view and B19 was only admitting she felt that way about Elkclan initially but now admits to being wrong. There's nothing malicious intended there.

Ok, I think the OP can see where B19's comments are actually quite a bit off. That's what I'd call a backhanded compliment. It fails the "Is it true, it is helfpul, is it kind, does it add to the discourse?" test. I wasn't upset by it, because I think it was meant in a positive way or at any rate I'm going to assume it was. But I have to admit I read it a couple of times and it stung a little. I was gonna let it go, but since folks can't seem to see what's wrong with it, I'll chime back in - only so you can see the impact of the statement on the NT receiver.

Basically it reads: "I thought you were a loser, guess I was wrong..." It's pretty patronising. Who is B19 to judge me? And it was done in a public forum. Like when my Aspie spouse criticised me in front of other people - only trying to be 'helpful' and 'truthful'. Nope, it's demeaning and embarrassing - though obviously I don't have enough a lot of skin in this game, so it's not as hurtful. It's also distinctly lacking in understanding that it was never about 'willingness', it was about about both physical and mental strength that had been worn down by being in an abusive relationship.

@LeagueGirl - nope, my estranged husband isn't a narcissist in the sense of NPD. My mother is NPD. The effects on the person in the relationship with someone on the spectrum and the narcissist are indeed pretty similar, but the motivations and many of the individual characteristic actions are quite different. Gotta say this though, narcissists can be a shedload more fun! But they can also be more wilfully harmful.

Wow. Narcissists can be more fun than aspies, even though they regularly intentionally harm people to amuse themselves. Gee, I wonder why you're not so popular here? If you really feel that way about people on the spectrum, then feel free to leave this support forum (for people on the spectrum) and don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.

I was surprised and what B19 wrote bothered me as something that, if she wrote it about me would have been quite upsetting. I'm glad if you're not upset (though it seems like you are, but not sure).

I would have felt stung, too, and I have AS.....but I believe B19 identifies as NT and what you wrote also bothered me but you also identify as NT.

Maybe the differences are just that, differences.....not evidence of a divide.

I thought B19 was aspie. I am sure she wasn't trying to be mean.

Ok, it was just one post that I thought said NT and I must have misread, or maybe a misprint. And yes, I think she is very nice, too .

I actually looked and she said she is aspie in her very first post.