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Cockroach96
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16 Sep 2015, 6:26 am

My little sister believes in Santa. As an experiment, I asked her: "How does he have money for all those gifts, how does he know where every child lives, how does he travel to their homes and deliver the gifts?". She answered: "He just crafts the toys and travels using his sledge, he sneaks into children's houses at night and gives them the gifts. He learned by heart where every child lives.".

Religious people sound similar when they try to argue the existence of God. Believing in God is just as irational as believing in Santa.


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Humanaut
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16 Sep 2015, 6:33 am

We are all God's little children.



LoveNotHate
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16 Sep 2015, 7:23 am

Many math and scientific proofs are based on the concept of "infinity".

However, have you ever seen an infinity?

How do you know one exists?

Yet, you accept math and science 's faith based concepts as rational? How come?



Humanaut
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16 Sep 2015, 8:36 am

LoveNotHate wrote:
...have you ever seen an infinity?

Yes. There is no end to a circle.



LoveNotHate
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16 Sep 2015, 8:58 am

Humanaut wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
...have you ever seen an infinity?

Yes. There is no end to a circle.


Only in faith based theory.

In reality, everything ends. The circle will eventually crumble to dust.



izzeme
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16 Sep 2015, 9:03 am

LoveNotHate wrote:
Many math and scientific proofs are based on the concept of "infinity".

However, have you ever seen an infinity?

How do you know one exists?

Yet, you accept math and science 's faith based concepts as rational? How come?


The scientific community knows and accepts that there is no infinity, it is used as a hypothetical measurement, a shorthand of saying "A Crapload of whatever i'm measuring" (time, distance, mass, what have you).

We accept math and science's concepts becouse we have seen them work in multiple situations, and just assume they will work 'infinitely' untill we have a reason to doubt it.
The point with god is that the first criterium is not met: we have not 'seen' him work, not in a testable situation that cannot also be explained by another effect (like "a crapton of time and some 'luck'")



Jacoby
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16 Sep 2015, 9:21 am

There is no answer to anything, you can't know so why would anybody have a strong opinion on it either way? It would irrational.



Humanaut
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16 Sep 2015, 9:44 am

LoveNotHate wrote:
In reality, everything ends.

Do you believe existence will cease to exist someday?



LoveNotHate
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16 Sep 2015, 9:55 am

Humanaut wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
In reality, everything ends.

Do you believe existence will cease to exist someday?


Isn't this what the physicists tell us "the darkness is coming" where everything will be dark and cold, the energy of the stars will be spent, and existence will end for all.



Humanaut
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16 Sep 2015, 10:21 am

I thought global warming was the endlösung.



naturalplastic
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16 Sep 2015, 4:10 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:
Humanaut wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
...have you ever seen an infinity?

Yes. There is no end to a circle.


Only in faith based theory.

In reality, everything ends. The circle will eventually crumble to dust.


An object made in a circular shape will crumble to dust because it has a temporal end.
But he meant that the object has no spatial end.

The number of whole integers is infinite. There is nothing "faith based" about that. Everyone encounters infinities all of the time.



LoveNotHate
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16 Sep 2015, 11:38 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
Humanaut wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
...have you ever seen an infinity?

Yes. There is no end to a circle.


Only in faith based theory.

In reality, everything ends. The circle will eventually crumble to dust.


An object made in a circular shape will crumble to dust because it has a temporal end.
But he meant that the object has no spatial end.


The principals of geometry tell us that the circumference of a circle is not infinite.

In your mind, you are imagining an infinite looping.

However, for this looping to exist in reality, then something has to perform the loops.

The circle alone does not contain loops; it's just a circle.

Arguably, nothing in reality can infinitely loop.

naturalplastic wrote:
The number of whole integers is infinite. There is nothing "faith based" about that. Everyone encounters infinities all of the time.

Many concepts can be infinite within the abstraction of math.

Math problem: A person eats an infinite number of hamburgers, and gains an infinite number of calories ...

However, in reality, the application of the abstract concept breaks down.

We don't see an infinite number of things in reality.

No human or computer can count to infinity.

So, what makes you think a countable infinity exists in reality?

Well, you take it on faith, right?



naturalplastic
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17 Sep 2015, 12:18 am

LoveNotHate wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
Humanaut wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
...have you ever seen an infinity?

Yes. There is no end to a circle.


Only in faith based theory.

In reality, everything ends. The circle will eventually crumble to dust.


An object made in a circular shape will crumble to dust because it has a temporal end.
But he meant that the object has no spatial end.


The principals of geometry tell us that the circumference of a circle is not infinite.

In your mind, you are imagining an infinite looping.

However, for this looping to exist in reality, then something has to perform the loops.

The circle alone does not contain loops; it's just a circle.

Arguably, nothing in reality can infinitely loop.

naturalplastic wrote:
The number of whole integers is infinite. There is nothing "faith based" about that. Everyone encounters infinities all of the time.

Many concepts can be infinite within the abstraction of math.

Math problem: A person eats an infinite number of hamburgers, and gains an infinite number of calories ...

However, in reality, the application of the abstract concept breaks down.

We don't see an infinite number of things in reality.

No human or computer can count to infinity.

So, what makes you think a countable infinity exists in reality?

Well, you take it on faith, right?


No. Because doubting the existence of infinity takes MORE faith than accepting it. So I take it on the absence of faith.

But that's if youre talking about abstract math.

If youre talking about "things", or "objects" who said there was an "infinity"? At the moment the Universe is thought to be finite, and even the number of atoms in it are thought to be a certain finite whole integer number.



Humanaut
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17 Sep 2015, 1:48 am

LoveNotHate wrote:
Arguably, nothing in reality can infinitely loop.

This notion is not necessarily wrong, but can matter infinitely exist in one form or another?



Edenthiel
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17 Sep 2015, 2:18 am

LoveNotHate wrote:
Arguably, nothing in reality can infinitely loop.


An isolated, spinning mass that does not exchange angular momentum with the outside universe.

I don't think 'faith' is the same as 'accepting proof'?


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