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K_Kelly
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21 Oct 2016, 8:53 pm

Let me explain my title. I am not super religious person either, but I'm also not an atheist. Sometimes I wonder if atheism has been "hijacked" by progressives and the "regressive left" at one point. It's just been something that was on my mind. The atheists today certainly do seem to have a political agenda, but it's an agenda that I don't necessarily agree with. It's very clear to me.

I'm familiar with the historical interpretation of the relationship between atheism and communism, though.



RetroGamer87
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21 Oct 2016, 8:57 pm

Yes it has. The left have made atheism like a religion which is contrary to the principles of atheism.


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21 Oct 2016, 9:02 pm

Atheism is simply believing in no gods/religion...also I don't think there is any direct connection between atheism and communism. Though I don't find the idea of communism to be the worst thing, but that is also when it has more democratic elements over authoritarian and totalitarian government...the former hasn't really existed on a large scale.


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K_Kelly
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21 Oct 2016, 9:11 pm

RetroGamer87 wrote:
Yes it has. The left have made atheism like a religion which is contrary to the principles of atheism.


I would like you to elaborate with detail.



naturalplastic
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21 Oct 2016, 9:41 pm

How do you hijack a stationary object?

"Atheism" isn't enough of a cause, or of a force in society to be able to be either "driven", or to be "hijacked" because its more of a non-belief, than a belief. Even if the number of atheists grow I don't see it becoming a force in society analgous to the way religion has been, or as secular political ideologies are.

Its true that in America in the late 20th Century religion is associated with conservatism, and liberalism is associated with secularism (though not necessarily atheism).



But the two most famous (or infamous) atheists in history were Karl Marx, and Ayn Rand, who were opposite ends of the political spectrum. Both both were evangelical about their politics. Niether were all that evangelical about their lack of faith as such (as far as I know). Their atheism was an afterthought to their politics.

Evangelical atheists are a recent phenom. One of these new missionaries spreading the good news about the lack of faith was the late Christopher Hitchens who was also an apologist for W. Bush. So Hitchens wasn't particularly progressive or leftist.

So if you wanna abandon your religion you don't have to leave the GOP. The trouble is that your fellow GOPers might stigmatize you. Its more conservatives marginalizing atheism than it is progressive taking over atheism. So if you wanna stop the GOP from driving atheism into the arms of the left then maybe you should become the leader of a new "Atheist Right".



Last edited by naturalplastic on 21 Oct 2016, 10:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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21 Oct 2016, 10:15 pm

I think that, at least today, Republicans are far more likely to disown/reject and denigrate atheists than atheists are to latch on to any one political party--be it liberal, conservative, independent, or otherwise. Of course, the whole idea that "God is a Republican" probably probably doesn't attract atheists in the first place, either!



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21 Oct 2016, 10:39 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
a new "Atheist Right"

There are some groups of that kind. This is one:

http://secularright.org/


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luan78zao
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22 Oct 2016, 1:18 am

'Not believing in a deity' is a personal decision, not an institution, so it can't be 'hijacked.' And as others have pointed out, there are plenty of nonbelievers who can be called 'right wing,' so if you announce that you're an atheist few will assume that you're a leftist as well.

The far left, the Marxists, aren't really atheists at all. They reject traditional religion but merely substitute the People for God, the State for the Church, and the writings of Marx, Lenin etc. for Holy Writ.


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RetroGamer87
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22 Oct 2016, 1:28 am

K_Kelly wrote:
RetroGamer87 wrote:
Yes it has. The left have made atheism like a religion which is contrary to the principles of atheism.
I would like you to elaborate with detail.
No. I'm lazy.

I'll leave this video here instead.


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GGPViper
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22 Oct 2016, 3:03 am

How about a counter-question?

Has Christianity been hijacked by The Right?

Acts 2:38-47 wrote:
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.

41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.

42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.

43 And fear came upon every soul: and many wonders and signs were done by the apostles.

44 And all that believed were together, and had all things common;

45 And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need.


46 And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart,

47 Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

Acts 4:33-37 wrote:
33 And with great power gave the apostles witness of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus: and great grace was upon them all.

34 Neither was there any among them that lacked: for as many as were possessors of lands or houses sold them, and brought the prices of the things that were sold,

35 And laid them down at the apostles' feet: and distribution was made unto every man according as he had need.


36 And Joses, who by the apostles was surnamed Barnabas, (which is, being interpreted, The son of consolation,) a Levite, and of the country of Cyprus,

37 Having land, sold it, and brought the money, and laid it at the apostles' feet.

And the most famous one:

Mark 10:17-25 wrote:
17 And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life?

18 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.

19 Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother.

20 And he answered and said unto him, Master, all these have I observed from my youth.

21 Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me.

22 And he was sad at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions.

23 And Jesus looked round about, and saith unto his disciples, How hardly shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God!

24 And the disciples were astonished at his words. But Jesus answereth again, and saith unto them, Children, how hard is it for them that trust in riches to enter into the kingdom of God!

25 It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?s ... ersion=KJV
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?s ... ersion=KJV
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?s ... ersion=KJV


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adifferentname
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22 Oct 2016, 3:10 am

No. It doesn't belong to anyone and you can't take it away from anyone.

Some atheist groups have been co-opted by progressives, but I was never entirely enamoured with the notion of collective atheism anyway.



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22 Oct 2016, 3:34 am

Well wouldn't be it be equally as logical to say that atheism has not been hijacked by the left it is just that they tend to vote left due to the fact that the right is embracing more religious and conservative viewpoints that atheists disagree with.



RetroGamer87
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22 Oct 2016, 4:33 am

[metaphor]I'd say Christianity has been hijacked by the Pharisees.[/metaphor]


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22 Oct 2016, 10:11 am

K_Kelly wrote:
Has atheism been hijacked by the left?

Yes.








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22 Oct 2016, 10:34 am

Hijacked is a terrible word for this. Not only does it gratuitously convey the sense that a terrible crime has been committed, but it suggests a deviation from an expected course.

Atheism doesn't have a course, therefore it can't be redirected to some other course.

Of course, anyone can find examples of atheists who hold extreme anti-religious views, but there are plenty of others you don't see because they aren't out on the corner carrying signs saying "I don't care whether you believe in nonsense or not" or making long Youtube screeds about how "talking about this doesn't seem like a particularly good use of time."

No, atheism hasn't been hijacked by the left or anyone else, the idea makes no sense.


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naturalplastic
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22 Oct 2016, 11:05 am

RetroGamer87 wrote:
K_Kelly wrote:
RetroGamer87 wrote:
Yes it has. The left have made atheism like a religion which is contrary to the principles of atheism.
I would like you to elaborate with detail.
No. I'm lazy.

I'll leave this video here instead.



You cant "violate the principles of Atheism" because there are no "principles of Atheism" except that there is no god/gods. Atheists don't have a unified creed besides that -that they can either adhere to, or violate.