Has the LGBT community become a deranged cult?

Post Reply New Topic

/\ This 110%

Unfortunately a childhood (and now ex-) friend of mine recently jointed the alt-right cult. It was someone I least expected would as well, thus it's especially shocking and I'm still processing it. I still don't understand what could ever inspire anyone to take on Nazi ideology.

If dudes aren't being oppressed, then why do certain double standards exist where the guys are "losing" like the social attitudes about how tall men are, etc. ?

If you're saying guys are more oppressed than women, that'd be wrong. Guys are in control of the presidency, most seats in the government as well as in corporations. This, for the most part, isn't just in America either but worldwide. Women are fully capable, we just have a power hold.

As per being oppressed due to being a guy - I don't see it. Do some women have a problem with our attitudes? Yes, but men also have a problem with the attitudes of some women. Can guys have difficulty getting a girlfriend? Yes, but there isn't a conspiracy - girls have difficulty getting boyfriends as well. Can some girls have image standards that are upsetting as a guy? Yes, but many guys also have standards for girls as well. I just don't see any way I'm getting oppressed as a dude specifically.

Other than that, unsure what you're saying...

The right is indeed dangerous, but so is the left. The reason your points don't show this danger is because you're using a one-for-one comparison. The inspiration that causes the left become violent, agressive, and forceful are not as often based on the same things that the right is inspired by. Instead the far left equivalent issue death threats to people who simply agree with one or two points on the right. They push people out of opportunities and social circles for not agreeing with liberal perspectives. Personally I am slightly more left-leaning these days that I have been for a while but TBH... the Antifa-side of the left... is equal to the hateful alt-right. The duopoly has caused both of these organizations (DNC & GOP) to be too big to fail so that they can continue to grow to ignore the violence and destruction of their extremest sub-groups. When people stop hurting other people over politics... that's when we'll know we've finally progressed past being wild animals. Or for that matter, when people stop being violent with other people at all. We can do it!



I don't think men are more oppressed by women by a long shot, but it'd be an error to say that they don't have cases where they are marginalized, forced to comply with society's expectations, not given certain opportunities because of their gender, and sometimes on the receiving end of bigotry (misandry).

I think it's clear that women are systematically oppressed more than men, but I wouldn't say that men don't deal with systematic oppression at all personally.

Are there any concrete examples that you can provide, though where men have been:

- "Marginalized"
- "Forced to comply with society's expectations"
- "Not given certain opportunities because of their gender"

Also, in a way that women aren't? It just reads as two different sides of the same exact coin.

The examples I've mostly seen are "she won't go out with me" which applying the term "oppression" to is really flimsy.

If you're talking "be a man" and "toxic masculinity" and "this is and this isn't what a man should be" with "society's expectations" - yeah, that definitely exists. I just don't personally label that as oppression per se or as a male only problem though since women also contend with a female equivalent of that. If not, more so, since our expectations have led many women into anorexia or depression/suicide over their body image and etc. With that said, "be a man" has led many guys to suicide and an early natural grave, oddly there I'd say we're as a gender oppressing ourselves more since I think the pressure of "be a man" comes more from other men than it does from women per se.

EVERY community has become either become a deranged cult or is on the verge of becoming one, because it's just natural human behavior to think one is superior. Of course, there are many people think they are inferior, but that's the exception, not the rule.

I am going to skip the examples because you've already hit on a few good ones (in bold above). What's important to consider is that oppression isn't just dependent on being "more oppressed" than someone else.

With the logic you use above you could say that LGB folx are not oppressed because Trans people face more severe oppression, and often share the same kind of oppression that the LGB folx experience. That's not the case, in fact all of us in the LGBT+ deal with discrimination and oppression.

If you took away the oppression that women face, but left what men face in place... then you could clearly say that men do have to deal with oppression.

I think the reason that it seems as though these experiences that they have are not oppression is because it's so much less than women experience. I would say that perspective is certainly valid, but it doesn't remove the fact that men do struggle with cohort-based discrimination / oppression / complications etc....

Do men have it easier than women? YES!... but do men have some difficulties in life imposed on them by society for being a man... also-yes... but in lower-case-letters

But, do you have examples of "marginalization" or "not given certain opportunities" because of their gender.

I am a guy and in all honesty - I've never experienced or witnessed oppression due to my gender in either of those two areas. With the examples I stated most of that comes from other guys and it's based on personality, rather than gender. For example, many confident jocks never experience the marginalization that comes from "be a man."

I would say there is without a doubt marginalization based on one's personality, height, weight, etc. I just don't see it as due to being a male alone, mostly because "be a man" and etc. comes primarily from other men marginalizing guys who are softer or physically weaker than they are. The reason it comes from society is it's a world ran by men for stereotypical men. Do some girls contribute to this? Yes. But, I have also personally experienced the biggest push towards ending that discrimination is from women rather than from other men.

Thus, why I place it on the cult of personality and appearance rather than gender. All LGB face discrimination for loving the same gender, while not all men face "be a man" discrimination because they fit what society expects.

Difficulty getting a girlfriend? Yeah, but that's marginalization due to my personality and not being a 10 in the looks department rather than being a guy because, unless I've fallen for a lesbian, she's choosing a different guy over me.

As stated, as a guy I've never personally experienced oppression which has a root cause of being my gender. However, I am a guy who has experienced oppression stemming from my personality, physical strength, or appearance.

You're a woman though and I might be blind - thus, please note the various ways that women discriminate against me due to my gender rather than due to my personality or appearance.

A lot of the "trouble with getting a date" for some men is not just gender, but socio-economic concerns on top also. Women are shown to outperform men in these area now. A lot more of a guys date ability comes from socioeconomic position rather than looks.

Do you have access to any of the studies that shows women fare better in that area?

I'd say economical marginalization would have a role to play in dating as well as personality and appearance. It's the one area I'm blind in though, thus why didn't cross my mind to think of that one. I didn't consider that could be part of "rich privilege" before.

I've always been hesitant to align myself with mainstream gay culture because even before 2016 I saw how the politicization was morphing it away from being gay pride. I usually take a lot of flack for this seeing as i fall into multiple minority categories and am expected to support by default. I see the lgbt community as being increasingly held hostage by the political left effectively using their support of gay rights to bolster support for wider left wing policies and bigger government. A similar thing is happening with the right wing of politics where the support of Libertarian and Constitutional Conservatives is used to drive the religous extreme end of the Right. Doomed either way

I think gay culture/LGBT issues have always been a more "leftist" element by default, or that's the way it worked and continues to work in the United States. I don't know how it specifically worked outside America.

I also agree with Hangfire about this happening on both sides. I'll still agree that support for LGBT community is used to "bolster" support for wider or even less desirable policies. It's kind of a game. Also, I've noticed groups like Log Cabin Republicans chose to distance themselves from wider or more varied issues on conservative policies.

I think what you are seeing here is an example, not necessarily of the virtues of Aspies, but of the virtues of a well-organized moderated forum like Wrong Planet.

Facebook, on the other hand, is an absolutely awful platform for any kind of serious political discussion because: (1) It is so huge, hence all too easy for vast, irrational mobs to form within the blink of an eye. (2) People are required to use their legal names, and encouraged to share info about their real-world whereabouts, making it extremely easy for any online disagreement to turn into real-life harassment. (3) It is only very loosely moderated, based on user complaints only, by low-paid professional moderators unfamiliar with the people they are moderating.

I've seen the Internet go through several eras. Generally what I've observed is that large, unmoderated or loosely moderated platforms tend inevitably to spawn endless, ever-escalating flame wars and virtual lynch mobs.

In the old days, before the World Wide Web took over the Internet, there was Usenet, which was fine when it was small, but then devolved into endless flame wars as it got bigger.

Then the Internet went through a period of relative peace and calm, with the advent of private email groups and well-organized, well-moderated web-based forums like this one.

Then came the huge social media platforms like Facebook and the huge unmoderated (or only very loosely moderated) forums like 4chan, and all hell broke loose.

Last edited by Mona Pereth on 13 Nov 2018, 3:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

To reply to the O.P.:

There isn't just one leader that everyone in the LGBT community follows, hence it can't possibly be a "cult" in that sense.

But I agree that the LGBT community, like MANY OTHER groups of many different persuasions, has developed some thoroughly obnoxious manifestations, mostly online. Mostly I think that's because of the kinds of Internet-based platforms that are currently most popular, as discussed in my message above.

Every large group contains some deranged members

LGBT is an example of a group with deranged members

How does the dictionary define "deranged"?

And not "become". Every group has always had some "deranged" members

What's with all the angry topics about the LGBT community?