I am female and have never succeeded. Am I an aberration?

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Hi guys and gals,

I posted something very similar to this in the women only section. A few kind souls responded to me, and I greatly appreciate that, but I was wondering if perhaps I would get a better response in the general section. If I'm infringing any rules by (semi) duplicate posting, feel free to flag this up.

I was wondering if any women here feel different to other females on the high functioning end of the spectrum? I've met, been acquainted with, and observed documentation of, scores of females with ASD, in a variety of settings, all of whom were intelligent, accomplished, socially integrated people who could pass absolutely for neurotypical. Such as these: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/resources/idt-sh/women_late_diagnosis_autism

They are qualified. They have highly successful careers. They are (mostly) extroverts. They make friends easily and usually have wide social circles. They are all married or have a significant other. Most are mothers. They look and behave utterly neurotypical, and at the very least appear to be psychologically (I'm unsure of the correct term) in step with their age. All of them, save for me. I have never seen the story of a female with ASD like mine. Resultantly, I feel like an aberration, another species entirely--something far more disabled and stigmatised. I'm not saying these females don't have any problems, but that, whatever problems they do have evidently do not impede them.

Career-wise, I have rarely even made it to the job interview stage, much less pass. Other females, it seems, can choose whether to disclose their autism or not, because they are all accomplished NT mimics. Unlike them, my autism presents itself in a very obvious manner (maybe I landed a more "male" version of the condition?), so I've never had the option of not disclosing. Try as I might (and I do), I cannot mimic NT behaviour in the slightest. Rinse and repeat for every other area of my life. Few friends, unhealthy romantic relationships (I have a knack of going for men who will end up treating me badly), no kids (obviously).

Unlike other females on the spectrum,I have accomplished absolutely nothing with my life, and it kills me. Please understand this is not an attack on them; rather, it is a (possibly over-dramtic) lament on myself.

Does any other woman with ASD feel like I do, or has experienced similar things? It would be fantastic to know I'm not alone. I hope I haven't put anyone's back up with this woe-is-me story. I appreciate I might sound quite insufferable.

I can relate to some of what you are talking about. While I do have a good social life and varied social outlets now, I have never married and am not seeing anyone presently. I feel that I am not the kind of woman any man would be interested in romantically. They would see me as intelligent, but I can't imagine anybody saying that they liked me and would want to go out with me. I have been working steadily for nearly two decades (sixteen years at my current workplace), but have never been promoted. I have a lot more than I ever thought I would have, but it took me a long time to get it. I am 53 now and likely won't catch up with "normal" women.

Honestly, I can't see why at least some men wouldn't be interested in you, Istomin Fan.

You have qualities which would make me interested in you, should I be "looking."

I hope I didn't embarrass you.

Ever since I was a wee little child, I've always gotten crushes on ladies who look like "library ladies."

I honestly feel that, barring hygiene problems, that anybody could be desirable to someone else.

There is a theory about the male & female phenotype and that any gender can exhibit either so you could be onto something.

But as there are so many variables on the spectrum it could be just that.

Just my uninformed surmation, but some men, or perhaps a fair amount of them, are intimidated by intelligence in a woman. That is their problem, not yours, even though you're the one who bears the brunt of it. I see you have an admirer already here, so there surely must be some men who find your brain power attractive. Obviously it may be something else altogether, but I wouldn't saddle yourself with all the blame. Who knows, maybe you, in a similar way to me, have a habit of feeling attracted to the wrong sort of men?

As for being "normal": as they say, it's a setting on a washing machine. Other women largely don't have your struggles, so it's unfair to compare yourself to them. And at least you can take comfort in the fact that you're a world closer to whatever "normal" is than I am (and I say that strictly for comparitive purposes, even though it may sound otherwise).

If your intelligence scares someone off, that’s a feature, not a bug.

I was unaware of the phenotype flexibility, so thank you for the heads up. Speaking solely from my own experience, all the high functioning females I've known, or known of, all seemed to exhibit the same characteristics, except for me. Conversely, I've encountered quite a few men whose notable lack of traits, and assimilation into NT society, seemed far more female. Maybe the spectrum is more dynamic for males than it is for females? Or that may be due to the majority of diagnosed cases being male.

Interesting point anyway .

There are females who have classic autism. They exhibit the same symptoms as males with classic autism.

I don't believe there is a particular "female" or "male" presentation in classic autism.

Perhaps, in Asperger's or HFA, there is a "female" presentation---though I believe this is far from universal. We have females here who have Asperger's, HFA, or even classic autism, who require assistance in living, just like males with Asperger's, HFA, or classic autism.

We also have females who are able to "mask" their symptoms. There are males who are able to "mask" their symptoms as well.

I believe the "female" presentation of Asperger's/HFA is caused, at least partially, by the "social demands" which are placed on female people as they grow up. Females tend to be "socialized" quite a bit more than males within "Western" society.

Last edited by kraftiekortie on 29 Mar 2018, 10:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

It is just a theory as not enough research has been done into the Female Autism Phenotype

Maybe the OP hasn't accomplished much "monetarily"---but, truly, there are other ways one can accomplish things.

You see the mask not what it took for them to get there nor do you see them when they are burnt out.

There are plenty of intellegent so called”high functioning” females that in truth do not function well at all. Some of them post here.

What I have noticed here is that the men who are struggling tend write I will never succeed, I will never get laid type posts more then the women.

I think it possible that the Autistic women who have succeded, such as featured in the BBC article are the exceptions, (abberations if you prefer) rather than the usual outcome.

As other posters have written, these success stories do not show the extra energy taken to get there, the extra hours learning people stuff explicitly rather than having an inuitive feel for how to do it, or those periods of utter exhaustion and burnout from time to time from that extra effort.

It is also quite possible that there are still far to many women who are autistic but who have been mis diagnosed with a whole raft of other conditions (anxiety disorders, personality disorders, or just labelled as lazy or crazy), whose lives have been to oposite of success stories.

That's my bedtime reading sorted. Thanks

All very true. That I haven't met any females like myself isn't to say they don't exist. Nevertheless, I feel like an utter failure because I have never been able to meet, let alone master, the social demands other female spectrumers (those in my experience, at least) seem to do. They may grow into their social acuity slightly later than their NT peers, but it's something they all seem to develop nonetheless, which I never have done. I do understand what you're saying--we are a spectrum, and everyone's lot differs--I just don't understand why I've never managed to succeed in life, in spite of my consistent and persistent attempts.




Again, very true, and I'm not discrediting that in the slightest because it's something I believe myself. But in the eyes of society in general, and even the other ASD females I've met, I'm an out and out failure. I'm well aware I shouldn't base my self worth on other people's opinions of me, but when I fail at every single attempt to make ways in the world, it's hard not to.

Thank you for your enlightened replies, by the way. And I don't mean that sarcastically.

Exactly. Besides, I don't think anyone wants to be remembered as some sort of failure, so it's natural that those who aren't doing so well keep their mouths shut about it and don't spread their lifestories around. Not that it'd be wrong to do so, but I think everyone would rather be remembered for their achievements rather than for the things they failed at.

As for me, I'm one of those less succesfull women. I mean I can live on my own and handle basic daily activities, but I live in a small rented apartment and still need help with some basic things that aren't in my daily/weekly routine. I have a job, but I only got it recently, last week to be exact, and was unemployed for a long time before it. And it's just a short part time contract so no, I can't call myself succesfull.

But on the bright side: aside from the fact that I learned to talk at young age, I've always been slow at everything, including learning new things, so I keep telling myself that I'm just slow at learning how to live "normal adult life" and that I will get there eventually.

I'm pretty sure I posted in your other thread, but I'll post here, too. Sorry if I'm repeating what I've said before, I sometimes forget what I've said where. But anyway... I've only ever had one job, a part-time cleaning job that was clearly desperate for people and had no interview. Although I do have an interview for a similar job tomorrow - that makes a total of five places out of all that I've ever applied for that I've ever heard a thing back from, and it will only be the second time I've ever had a job interview (assuming a brief preliminary interview counts - and that, I promptly failed because I have a tremor that made me look a lot more nervous than I actually was). I'm an extreme introvert, with social phobia and selective mutism. I have a few friends on WP, I think, and one friend I text with often, but none that I've met in person. WP is really the only social interaction I get most of the time. I've never been in any sort of romantic interest, or had anyone who's met me in person ever show the slightest hint of romantic interest in me (granted, I don't really want a romantic relationship - if it happens at some point, great, but it's far from a priority, and I'm perfectly fine with the idea of it never happening). And I couldn't pass as NT even if my life depended on it - anyone interacting with me at all can at least tell that something's up with me no matter what I do (granted, the selective mutism doesn't help matters any - it makes it extremely difficult or impossible for me to speak in some situations, including oftentimes when I meet someone new). And I too feel very different from most of the HFA women I hear about, and think my autism presents itself in a more masculine way. So long story short, you're not alone in these feelings and experiences. Big dragon hugs, if you'd like them