Will the Mexican State Fall to Warlords?

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Darmok
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21 Oct 2019, 10:19 am

Is Mexico a failed state?


On Mexican State Collapse

You may have read the news just a few days back: the Mexican military captured not one but two of El Chapo’s sons in the heart of Culiacán, the Sinaloan capital. One son freed himself—which is to say his entourage and retainers at hand overpowered and killed the soldiers at hand—and then, in a decisive riposte, seized the entire city center of Culiacán to compel the liberation of his brother.

The forces that emerged were in the literal sense awesome and awful. Heavy weaponry that would be familiar on any Iraqi, Syrian, or Yemeni battlefield was brought to bear. More and worse: custom-built armored vehicles, designed and built to make a Sahel-warfare technical look like an amateur’s weekend kit job, were rolled out for their combat debut. Most critically, all this hardware was manned by men with qualities the Mexican Army largely lacks: training, tactical proficiency, and motivation.

Then the coup de grace: as the Chapo sons’ forces engaged in direct combat with their own national military, kill squads went into action across Culiacán, slaughtering the families of soldiers engaged in the streets.

Cowed and overmatched—most crucially in the moral arena—the hapless band of soldiers still holding the second son finally received word from Mexico City, direct from President AMLO himself: surrender. Surrender and release the prisoner.

It’s an absolutely extraordinary episode even by the grim and bizarre annals of what we mistakenly call the post-2006 Mexican Drug War. The Battle of Culiacán stands on a level above, say, the Ayotzinapa massacre, or the Zetas’ expulsion of the entire population of Ciudad Mier. Killing scores of innocents and brutalizing small towns is one thing: seizing regional capital cities and crushing the national armed forces in open fighting in broad daylight is something else.


https://claireberlinski.substack.com/p/ ... se-a-guest


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Fnord
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21 Oct 2019, 10:23 am

Darmok wrote:
Will the Mexican State Fall to Warlords?
I think it already has.


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EzraS
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21 Oct 2019, 10:30 am

But let us not refer to it as a ****hole.



kraftiekortie
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21 Oct 2019, 10:51 am

It's not a shithole. It's a nation with lots of interesting history. And lots of nice people who would give their left arm for you.

And the common people aren't s**t. The drug dealers and drug lords are.



Fnord
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21 Oct 2019, 11:03 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
... the common people aren't s**t. The drug dealers and drug lords are.
I'm not saying that the common people are s**t (they most definitely are not!); unfortunately, when you sleep with dogs, you wake up with fleas.

Who grows the coca plants and opium poppies? Who processes the raw material into refined products? Who transports the refined products around the country and across the borders?

I tell you, it isn't the dealers or the druglords, it's the common people -- you will never see the dealers or the druglords in the fields, in the labs, or in the trucks, planes, boats or submarines (except to give orders and mete out punishment).

No, it's the common people who do all the dirty work while the druglords and dealers call the shots and reap all the profits.


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kraftiekortie
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21 Oct 2019, 11:18 am

At least some of those people were coerced into doing the druglords’ bidding.

Others were not coerced, but did it out of economic necessity. Culpable—though not as culpable as the druglords.



EzraS
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21 Oct 2019, 11:48 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
It's not a shithole. It's a nation with lots of interesting history. And lots of nice people who would give their left arm for you.

And the common people aren't s**t. The drug dealers and drug lords are.


Obviously.

Please don't put words in my mouth and suggest that I'm calling the common people s**t.



Last edited by EzraS on 21 Oct 2019, 11:50 am, edited 1 time in total.

kraftiekortie
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21 Oct 2019, 11:49 am

You wanted to say "no s**t, Sherlock" LOL

I'm glad you feel that way.



EzraS
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21 Oct 2019, 11:52 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
You wanted to say "no s**t, Sherlock" LOL

I'm glad you feel that way.


I changed my reply. You always manage to ninja me before I can get in an edit through :ninja:

I'm disappointed you would think I would feel otherwise.



kraftiekortie
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21 Oct 2019, 11:53 am

I'm glad you feel the way you do.

I wasn't alluding to you....more to anybody who believes that the Mexicans themselves are crap.



Bravo5150
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21 Oct 2019, 12:01 pm

I think I see why Mexican food is so addictive.



EzraS
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21 Oct 2019, 12:27 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
I'm glad you feel the way you do.

I wasn't alluding to you....more to anybody who believes that the Mexicans themselves are crap.


s**t·hole (noun vulgar slang) an extremely dirty, shabby, or otherwise unpleasant place.
"this place is a shithole, I hope you know that"

A shithole is a profane term for a dirty or dysfunctional place.

"The place I live in is a real shithole"



kraftiekortie
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21 Oct 2019, 12:31 pm

But it’s really not a shithole.

Even in places like Chiapas State, the poorest state in Mexico, there’s much natural beauty.

It’s the people with no moral compass (e.g., druglords) :arrow: who create the seemingly shithole conditions



EzraS
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21 Oct 2019, 12:33 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
But it’s really not a shithole.

Even in places like Chiapas State, the poorest state in Mexico, there’s much natural beauty.

It’s the people with no moral compass (e.g., druglords) :arrow: who create the seemingly shithole conditions


dysfunctional place.



kraftiekortie
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21 Oct 2019, 12:35 pm

The druglords are one of the main causes of the dysfunction.