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techstepgenr8tion
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09 May 2020, 12:48 pm

She got this quite right.

I had a big preamble but I deleted it because IMHO it got a bit too dark. I'll summarize it by this - autistic males (and probably autistic females, I can only speak from my lived experiences) tend to have an extra compounding to the trauma and that's having been told that they were inferior to other people, that the bar they had to jump over was somewhere on the moon, and so to fight like hell and then be forced to fail anyway is probably even more like an eternal flu-dream than it is already for NT's who've been laid low.


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09 May 2020, 7:27 pm

Oh dear. That was like listening to a horoscope.

Nothing's wrong with millennials. We're better informed, better educated, economically worse off than our parents and there's still so many boomers and Gen Xers that we're politically powerless. Of course we're depressed.


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techstepgenr8tion
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09 May 2020, 8:12 pm

There was a horoscope in there? I missed it.

She's not averse to that kind of thing but I didn't detect any 'new age' in this video aside from her talking in favor of free will - which anymore I'm learning to tune out when people bring it up because it means whatever they want it to mean.


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09 May 2020, 10:57 pm

While I don't think best of some of the generalities are fair, the bit about single families seems not fair, nor saying that millennials are opposed to teamwork. But I think that there are fair points that I can directly link to my own experience. I was generally a pretty good student, put my energy to doing okay, got into university, eventually got my bachelor, and have struggled to move forward. I don't live in America, so my student debt is not something I need to worry about until it starts getting repaid at around $50,000 AU, but it feels like I might never reach that point. After little success of finding anything I did a year and a half doing volunteering data entry, a year of that also doing part time bookkeeping, and after being let go I spent an entire year putting in hundreds of job applications in with no success. Finally found a job this year that looked like I could start a reliable job a few times a week, and then was let go a less than two months in because this epidemic hit.

I am generally a positive person, but I think it is fair to say that a big portion of my generation followed a roadmap for success that has done nothing. We are even more educated than previous generations, but we get treated like kids. If you want me to point at the culprit, than I would say it has been capitalism, capitalism that pushed the most important thing for the older generation was getting money and cutting costs, until nothing is left of the pie for the millennial generation to have what the earlier generation had. Millennials then get called lazy, because capitalism says that being poor is just evidence of laziness, while we have direct proof that amount of effort put in does not return equal amounts.

But rather than say that it has made millennials uncooperative, I think that you might more find that we are more likely to not have much patience for just playing nice with a system that wants to exploit.


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techstepgenr8tion
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10 May 2020, 2:58 am

I'm seeing something a bit different - a bit like lack of clinical narcissism = not surviving. It's a bit like the main way to survive the work world is to cultivate the most raging case of cluster B personality disorder that you can and perpetually terrify people into submission with just how many demons you have on a leash. Being human has always been to some degree about who can wave the threat of acute violence the best, it's just really sick and sad to see that dominating the place where we have to go in order to pay our bills (well... sick and sad maybe but if life has only ever been about one thing - ie. genetic dominance - it should maybe be more surprising that our lives aren't perpetually filled with violence in every corner).


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10 May 2020, 9:36 am

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
I'm seeing something a bit different - a bit like lack of clinical narcissism = not surviving. It's a bit like the main way to survive the work world is to cultivate the most raging case of cluster B personality disorder that you can and perpetually terrify people into submission with just how many demons you have on a leash. Being human has always been to some degree about who can wave the threat of acute violence the best, it's just really sick and sad to see that dominating the place where we have to go in order to pay our bills (well... sick and sad maybe but if life has only ever been about one thing - ie. genetic dominance - it should maybe be more surprising that our lives aren't perpetually filled with violence in every corner).


This.
But it should probably be noted that the reason there's not perpetual violence is that even the most dominant individual can be guillotined by an angry mob.

When I said the video was like a horoscope, I was referring to the Jungian perspective.


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10 May 2020, 10:14 am

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
There was a horoscope in there? I missed it.

She's not averse to that kind of thing but I didn't detect any 'new age' in this video aside from her talking in favor of free will - which anymore I'm learning to tune out when people bring it up because it means whatever they want it to mean.


Shlaifu is referring to horoscopes being Barnum statements.

This video is Millennials summed up in a Barnum statement.



techstepgenr8tion
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10 May 2020, 12:34 pm

shlaifu wrote:
When I said the video was like a horoscope, I was referring to the Jungian perspective.

Here's where I sit with that and perhaps it just a matter of taste but - whether one ascribes to Jungian archetypes or some shared plane of data or information being the ground of physical reality (whether you're an idealist or simply a mathematical Platonist the way Sir Roger Penrose seems to be), or whether you look at this from the perspective of massive conglomeration of Richard Dawkins' memetics - the behavior seems to be the same way, and Jordan Peterson's expose on Jungian psychology and the values of the deep-stories in movies like Pinochio IMHO touched on something critical about how our subconscious infrastructure works.

This is one of those areas where there's been a gray area between reductive materialism and.... pretty much anything else including everything from theism to neutral monism... where on one hand someone like Sean Carroll is more than happy to admit that there are different levels of resolution in terms of detail in matter (like looking at the exterior of your smart phone vs. cracking it open to look at the chip set vs. tuning down to atoms or even quarks) and it seems like the archetypal language is probably best thought of as something like looking at the human chip set. Where people get up and arms about it I think is that it sounds spooky, but then the question - is it really spooky, is there enough evidence in the patterns in instinctual and irrational behavior to suggest that there is something to it, and if it's real is there a non-spooky way to look at the accrual of such dynamics as non-spooky (going with the twin assumptions that a) it's being seen accurately and b) can't be spooky because it's impossible for consciousness to exist outside of human brains)?

This seems like a place where culture wars make society significantly dumber, because questions that get closer to looking at core issues are too much like a concession to the other team and consequently everyone needs to keep things rigidly black and white to know whose on what team. While there are a lot of us, I'd say including both of us, who'll wander off that reservation for the sake of our own grasp of what's happening around us. If anything, being on the autistic spectrum puts many of us under enough pressure that we can't survive simply by going with status quo tribes because they're simply not going to care about us no matter how well we parrot their talking points and they'd stomp us to the bottom of any dominance hierarchy for being different (the silver lining of course - we're less likely to be pulled into cults or swept up in mass movements if we've made our own way).

That got a bit lengthier than I wanted it to but I think the main point - I think there's enough nested complexity to make even physicalist arguments for archetypes so long as one's going in a direction like ontic structural realism or some form of non-reductive materialism.


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techstepgenr8tion
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10 May 2020, 12:48 pm

hurtloam wrote:
Shlaifu is referring to horoscopes being Barnum statements.

This video is Millennials summed up in a Barnum statement.

And I get that people will either see themselves in it or not based on how accurately their own experiences mirror what she said.

My own experience - I feel like the whole world has been trying rape and kill me since college and that I've been surviving by the skin of my teeth, all the while racking up trauma and guaranteed very low social status no matter what I do (partly lack of any nepotistic support, partly because social conformity and persuadability, how well people can use and/or corrupt you, and how willing you are even to be used and abused without any glimmer of defiance or self-respect surfacing, is the gold standard for entry).

I also see a lot of convergence between what she's saying in this video and what Eric Weinstein has been saying on everything from embeded growth obligations and H1B visas destroying the incomes of PhD in the sciences and helping colleges keep a perennial load of cheap graduate students for teaching as much as just how many neighborhoods are now only populated by Boomers and Great Generation because Gen X'ers and Millenials can't afford to live in those neighborhoods. Eric also beats the drum, as he did with Lex Friedman recently, on the idea that Boomers are keeping all of the positions of power in all of the institutions and not retiring where as fifty years ago and back you'd have generational turnover in these positions.

I get the sense that there's probably more to the story than Boomers and older simply being 'evil', for example potentially having half a million dollars in end of life medical expenses and - if you survive those procedures - potentially living on the streets afterward after being taken for house and home by the medical establishment, I'm sure has a lot to do with all kinds of asset hording that goes on these days among the elderly. It makes me wonder then, what can be done to remove some of what incentivizes that sort of behavior. At present - Teal and Eric would both agree even if Eric would probably never want to be seen in the same room with her - that the current generational relationship is vampiric and Eric showcased that by bringing up that there are college students getting their student loans paid off by sugar mommy / sugar daddy arrangements, ie. a generation whoring their children and grandchildren out to themselves. That's the extreme case, probably the one meant to first and foremost hit home viscerally, but something has to when you have so few young entrepeneurs (something our economy desperately needs) all because they can't scrounge up much more capital than they need to live with their parents. It's not just about being able to play a victim card at that point, it's many countries - like the US and potentially several in Europe, making the migration from first world status downward toward middle income, where we eventually start resembling Brazil or India more and you'll start seeing '24x' or '30x' on appliances as people in even what were previously more affluent neighborhoods are buying all of their appliances on installment contracts.


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12 May 2020, 7:03 am

Don't you mean "tea" on millenials?

Here's a question: what's wrong with Gen Z? Millenials' method of socializing seems to involve copious sharing of pictures of their food. Gen Z methods of socializing seem to involve copious sharing of memes that are either too surreal to be understood or are about depression and anxiety.

Who's worse off?


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12 May 2020, 8:05 am

All this astrology and no mention of Strauss-Howe?



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12 May 2020, 10:05 am

Whale_Tuune wrote:
Don't you mean "tea" on millenials?

Here's a question: what's wrong with Gen Z? Millenials' method of socializing seems to involve copious sharing of pictures of their food. Gen Z methods of socializing seem to involve copious sharing of memes that are either too surreal to be understood or are about depression and anxiety.

Who's worse off?


A few months ago I was at a meeting of college professors from a handful of places around the country I live in.
How to handle the surge in clinically depressed students was one of the points on the agenda. (We did not find a solution.)
There's definitely a palpable change there between my generation and yours, and I don't envy you.


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12 May 2020, 1:31 pm

As Social Animals The Farther We Move Away From Each Other
The Less We Become Social Animals Of Course; As Usual, Use it or Lose
it Applies to All Stuff Existence. It's Clear that the Younger The Generations
Become Affixed to A screen, the Further Away from Flesh and Blood Face to Face
Interaction they Come And Go; Yes, Literally by Nature the Less 'Human' they become.

Let's Start at the Oldest Part of the Food Chain; Somewhere Between
Forty to Fifty Percent have around 20,000 Dollars or less in the Bank and
Are Going to Depend on Social Security For their Existence At an Average
of Around 17,000 Dollars A Year; So, in Other Words, they have enough to Get
by, If 20,000 Dollars is enough to get by for one Year, if Social Security Goes away;
Chances are it won't go away for the Baby Boomer Part of the 'US Food Chain'; so, they
are likely safe for a couple of Decades, unless too many Pandemics and other
Natural Disasters come, if so as such; Basic Subsistence Moving Beyond Reach.

Generation X, Is Not Far Behind; the Further one Gets Away from the Boomer
Generation as Retirement plans go away; the Problem only exacerbates more.

Millennials, also referred to as Generation Y, Have Been Around Long enough to
See all of what is going away; and now on top of that to pay enough Attention to
Politics that there is not much to trust on top; Generally Speaking, they move to place
to place for Employment as a Village Job for a Lifetime is no longer available for them.

So far we Move From Concern to Worry to Despair, already Particularly Now.

And then there is Generation Z; Basically the Young Skyrocketing
Suicide Generation; as they've Lost so much of the Face to Face Human
Connection as Screen Life is the way of life they have been Spoon-Fed From Birth.

Millennials aren't as much concerned about getting married; Hook-Ups will do.

Meanwhile, Generation Z, is becoming More Like the Reality of Japan; as they
are not nearly as interested in the Opposite Sex than any generation before;

Of course, it's all Predictable;
And Already Happening in
Other Countries Fading Now.

So many Theatrical Productions
Bring 'the Prophecy' to Light; The Age
of 'Terminator' Machines; 'Avatars'; Where
Of course Folks are Plugged into a Matrix;
As Lives continues to Lose the Colors of Flowers;
All the Complex Emotions of Flesh And Blood connections
that truly
make
Us
Fully
Human
Or Not.

Oh yeah; and now there's
Social Distancing, if Purgatory
Wasn't Already Enough in the
Twilight Zone Before; the Basics
Are Human Connections; Now, sadly
even the Potential to make things better
has been taken away from Nature as of course
this Entire Ordeal is from a Part of Nature Where Cultures
Manufactured by Hairless Apes have in deed been effectively
Acting as an Agent to Eat the Face of the Rest of Nature in Hoard and Take
More than Share and Give Back. Karma is Real Action=Consequence; Welcome,
to the Twilight Zone for Real.

People pay little Attention
to Cautions and Warnings
in the Instant Gratification
Of Enjoying
A Quick
Sand
Sink;
Really, A Core of the Overall
Problem is Instant Gratification;
Sugars, And Fats, And Everything Gluttony
in Taking And Hoarding
with not much
left to give
Back and
Share with
the Rest of Nature
as We Rape And Pillage
The Entire Face of it AKA God;
the rest of all we Depend on to even be;
We Will be
'Taken Away'
First in Slow
Increments of
Generation by Generation
more until Balance brings
Light Back to Humanity Again Or Not.

A Boomer, 60 on 6.6.20; A Generation Away from Millennials
And Two From Generation Z; i've Danced With These Folks
In a Metro Dance Hall the Last 6 Years until March 12, when
it Closed Down on College Night Every Week as a Participant
Anthropology Observer; and have over 2,000 Smiling
Faces With me That Truly Say We Are Living For Today;
That's What You do; You Do it 'as long as the Peace lasts'; or just
put
Your
Head
Between
Your Legs and Sob;
Generally Speaking, i've Found
That the Males are afraid and have
Lost Direction; The Women on the
Other hands Still Have Friends, Each Other;
i'm only there to Dance; That Much they can
trust in life with ease for now at least; From
What i've seen, the Women, at Least that age are Wonderful Folks;
The Dudes are okay but they have a whole lot of Fear and Anxiety; plain to see.
Generally Speaking, You Don't Go to A Big Dance Hall, if You are too anxious and depressed;
So it definitely is Skewed Toward Happy; i won't miss Church too much; But the Happy place i will.
All Flesh and
Blood Together
Connecting It
Doesn't Get More
Humanly Real than
The Village All Dancing
Closer to Naked of CuLTuRaL CLoTHeS, Just Free to Be;
Of course in Dance Halls folks tend to be More Open
Minded; So, Truly most Everyone is Accepted and Welcome there;
Way Way Way More than any so-called 'God Church' i've ever Stepped foot in;
But the Conservative
More Closed
Minded
Nature of
The Religion
of Church, is surely
to be expected any day too;
As usually Conservative Nature
Only Increases as folks grow older and even more Anxious;
Seeing So many Ills of even just getting by, each and every minute.

Ain't This Life...

i figured it out; so i enjoy it.


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techstepgenr8tion
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12 May 2020, 8:19 pm

Whale_Tuune wrote:
Don't you mean "tea" on millenials?

Here's a question: what's wrong with Gen Z? Millenials' method of socializing seems to involve copious sharing of pictures of their food. Gen Z methods of socializing seem to involve copious sharing of memes that are either too surreal to be understood or are about depression and anxiety.

Who's worse off?

I don't think anyone was bringing up the question of whose worse off. I think this is more of 'You can finally throw off the gas-lighting narratives you've been fed all this time and accept that what your eyes, ears, and instincts have been telling you - completely against what you've been told to believe - are real and no, you're not crazy, you're just wrapped in pathological liars'.


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13 May 2020, 6:16 am

I've heard someone astutely observe that my generation can't trust anyone. That, I think, is why we suffer so much anxiety and depression. I have zero faith in authority figures to do the right thing or keep me safe and healthy. Due to personal history and the collective history of my country...


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