Does the heterogeneity of autism undermine the neurodiversit

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This thread prob belongs in the political section but never mind.

The central pillar of neurodiversity of autism being “harmless” is a bad joke.

One only has to read the comments on this site to see the trail of destruction to and misery autism gives many but not all.

It’s just Pseudoscience, which is why apart from “accommodations” neurodiversity will never be fully accepted by those in power.

Mainly given the societial burdens and financial cost mental disabilities cause. You don’t need a degree in economics and sociology to see this.

If someone can’t look after themselves someone or some people have to step in to help them and this costs time and money that may not be so available.

If, as suggested, this belongs in the political section then please could it be moved to there.

Please do move.


On topic:

The answer is no.
Neurodiversity exists for it's own purpose, with or without the label autism and no matter in what way it is defined.

It won't even matter whether or not neurodiversity is founded by so-called high functioning autistics.
It won't matter how heterogeneous autism is. It might be the whole point of neurodiversity at all.


Just who the heck puts too many eggs in one basket label?
Or worse, define the label with limited models and definitions?


Which left some of my questions; questions about Neurodiversity outside autism.

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Autism as a Spectrum is a concept diametrically opposed to the premise of the paper.

I never understand what these articles are talking about. Too many big words that I've never heard of.

The concept of Neurodiversity in the pure meaning will exist in the short to medium term.

Flat earthers still exist, there’s a Netflix documentary on them if anyone is interested.

The question was can it move on from its current position of being a fringe movement into something accepted in full by government and society.

By that I mean accepting autism as a natural difference which shouldn’t be touched.

The answer is no because like it or not sometimes autism is a burden to many of those effected, to NTs and government in terms of human time, energy and financial.

Common sense says science & gov isn’t going to say that a grown man who is incapable of looking after himself, living independently and working and paying taxes is “normal”.

The sooner advocates evolve accept and understand that the better they can concentrate on helping autistic people in a more realistic way than wasting time on dead end causes.

I think there needs to be a distinction between those who will at least function adequately if barriers are removed , vs those who no matter what barriers are removed will still struggle to reach an adequate level of functioning .

Of course that would require a definition of 'adequate functioning' . Should it be based on how the average person of the same age and intelligence is functioning ?

Speaking personally I don't think I 'd be doing as well as age and intelligence matched non ASD people would be doing, even if those barriers were removed .

It’s coincidental that someone has started a thread about the “Sally Ann test” and theory of mind.

It’s suddenly occurred to me that the more extreme ND enthusiasts that deny severe autism and cannot understand the basic logic of why autism is categorized as a disorder and not a natural difference is lack of theory of mind.

So basically it’s a product of the disorder itself.

Or, with your own conclusions, a product of bitterness that neurodiversity fails you.

But worry not, some people here can sympathize -- with their loneliness, their desire to conform, their anxieties because uncontrollable behaviors and be, oh, I dunno, 'fitting in'.



If you talk about society and government, you have to look at how dysfunctional NTs are and can be first before trying to redirecting advocates.

Truth? NTs are practically the biggest victims. And they had been for centuries.

As of now? They're too busy panicking in pandemics and moral provocations.
Let alone push for whatever direction of 'progress' you speak of.



And in which from my point of view specifically:
Governments and taxes. LOL. OMGLOL.
I'm sorry -- but this argument just NOT apply in my country. But that's just me, eh??



And, really...
To say neurodiversity won't last long as you say will always mean to eventually stop progress of several mediums of learning, psychiatry -- specifically mental hygiene and several degrees of emotional support along with it -- which is a recently developing thing already.

And about, uhm, 'low functioning' autistics?
Do you speak for them? Do you speak for their parents? Do you also speak for the community and professionals who are involved or as you say, affected?
How much do you know whether or not those who are involved are all against neurodiversity?
And if you are one -- tell us your story then.

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Never gonna happen you say. So you see the future now?
Don't you think outside the damnable box, or think of humans so low that they can't?

Advocates do as they please.
Utilitarian ways are usually not one of them.
You even expect *NT* scientists to do so too?? That's even less realistic.

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I don't believe sensible, pro ND, people are against help being given to those with severe autism , and against such people being regarded as disabled .

It’s all very simple.

Some people prefer talking in semantics and riddles others straight forward facts.

Does the social model of disability ND promote fit John? Yes or No

Would removing all Stigmas attached to johns condition help him live and support himself - yes or no

Will removing all stigmas and worshipping him like a god give him the executive function and ability to work and live on his own - yes or no

For all it’s No

What condition has John been diagnosed with - severely autism, officially

Is severe autism a disability that goes beyond social stigmas (see above) - yes

What can removing stigmas do to help John in his day to day life - not a lot

The question was will severe forms of autism that are actually disabilities prevent the condition from being “de disableised” - yes

Why?

Because johns condition ruins and shortens his life, cost money, time and energy to all who have to look after them.


Because where rubber meets road facts are important.

Whoever says facts don’t matter has never filled in a government form asking for money or help.

Are you disabled yes or no?

There’s lots of Johns around however inconvenient they are for ND and they get made all the time and are not going away soon.

There's a good reason why professionals exists. Why debates exists between advocates.

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Anything about "neurodiversity" belongs here in the "Autism Politics" section