Are there any post coup attempt EX-trump supporters here?

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goldfish21
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12 Jan 2021, 6:34 pm

I’ve seen some comments from some trump supporters online in disbelief that trump would align himself with an attack on the US government & now denounce their support for him. Seems like a reasonable line in the sand.

Just curious if violent insurrection at the direction of djt was finally crossing the line for any of you here?


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slam_thunderhide
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12 Jan 2021, 6:57 pm

I'm sort of the opposite. I never supported Trump, viewing him as a populist-posing fraud, but I have long sympathized with his supporters, including the ones who stormed the Capitol. To clarify:

Firstly, Trump did not support the any sort of attack on the Capitol as anyone who bothers to read his words will see.
Secondly, the Trump supporting raiders used force to get inside the Capitol, but never had any plan about what to do when they got inside, so to call it a coup attempt is ridiculous.

As I posted elsewhere, I'm amused to see the levels of support for the US establishment in here, as if any sort of rebellion against it is a priori bad. I guess you people just want the US establishment to get back to what it's best at: drone strikes against Middle Eastern villages, spying on US citizens, bailouts for bankers while regular citizens are dying of despair.

By the way, are leftists ever embarrassed about the BLM/antifa riots, the 2017 Congressional Baseball shooting, or the assassination attempt against Trump in 2016? Rhetorical question, I know the answer is no.



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12 Jan 2021, 7:00 pm

I've been surprised that none of his lovers have spoken up here since the riot took place. Where is still his support for him? Where are his white knights?

Are they too embarrassed to admit, "I was wrong and you were all right, he was a bad person and he really wanted to rule our country and I had no idea he was capable of this. Everyone the media said about him and lawyers and doctors, everyone was right, I've been duped. I'm so sorry for ever supporting and voting for him. I had no idea that voting him into office would lead to this."


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Fnord
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12 Jan 2021, 7:05 pm

League_Girl wrote:
I've been surprised that none of his lovers have spoken up here since the riot took place. Where is still his support for him? Where are his white knights?

Are they too embarrassed to admit, "I was wrong and you were all right, he was a bad person and he really wanted to rule our country and I had no idea he was capable of this. Everyone the media said about him and lawyers and doctors, everyone was right, I've been duped. I'm so sorry for ever supporting and voting for him. I had no idea that voting him into office would lead to this."
Good set-up ... but what's the punch line?


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League_Girl
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12 Jan 2021, 7:09 pm

Fnord wrote:
League_Girl wrote:
I've been surprised that none of his lovers have spoken up here since the riot took place. Where is still his support for him? Where are his white knights?

Are they too embarrassed to admit, "I was wrong and you were all right, he was a bad person and he really wanted to rule our country and I had no idea he was capable of this. Everyone the media said about him and lawyers and doctors, everyone was right, I've been duped. I'm so sorry for ever supporting and voting for him. I had no idea that voting him into office would lead to this."
Good set-up ... but what's the punch line?



I don't understand.


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goldfish21
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12 Jan 2021, 7:11 pm

League_Girl wrote:
I've been surprised that none of his lovers have spoken up here since the riot took place. Where is still his support for him? Where are his white knights?

Are they too embarrassed to admit, "I was wrong and you were all right, he was a bad person and he really wanted to rule our country and I had no idea he was capable of this. Everyone the media said about him and lawyers and doctors, everyone was right, I've been duped. I'm so sorry for ever supporting and voting for him. I had no idea that voting him into office would lead to this."


Either that or they’re too far gone in their fanaticism and are busy plotting their own participation in extremist acts of violence against various government institutions.

I sure hope not, though. But clearly there are more bad actors than just the ones that descended on the Washington Capitol.


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goldfish21
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12 Jan 2021, 7:17 pm

slam_thunderhide wrote:
I'm sort of the opposite. I never supported Trump, viewing him as a populist-posing fraud, but I have long sympathized with his supporters, including the ones who stormed the Capitol. To clarify:

Firstly, Trump did not support the any sort of attack on the Capitol as anyone who bothers to read his words will see.
Secondly, the Trump supporting raiders used force to get inside the Capitol, but never had any plan about what to do when they got inside, so to call it a coup attempt is ridiculous.

As I posted elsewhere, I'm amused to see the levels of support for the US establishment in here, as if any sort of rebellion against it is a priori bad. I guess you people just want the US establishment to get back to what it's best at: drone strikes against Middle Eastern villages, spying on US citizens, bailouts for bankers while regular citizens are dying of despair.

By the way, are leftists ever embarrassed about the BLM/antifa riots, the 2017 Congressional Baseball shooting, or the assassination attempt against Trump in 2016? Rhetorical question, I know the answer is no.


Sedition, insurrection, and treason are bad. Mmmkay?

It was literally an attempted coup. People died. Trained leos/ex-military participated. They had guns, bombs, riot cuffs, body armour, chemical weapons, riot shields etc. They attempted to seize government by violent force and prevent the peaceful transition of power to a democratically elected President in a free and fair election that’s been investigated & recounted multiple times in contested states. Wtf else do you call it besides a coup? Even international experts are calling it that - a failed one - but still an attempted coup, with complicit police & military actors considering the lack of law enforcement presence and delays in dispatching help.

Why would anyone be embarrassed by BLM? America’s white supremacy problem is what should be embarrassing.

What do extremists shooting up a baseball game or attempting an assassination have to do with leftists? Very little compared to the Majority of republican voters that back the coup at the capitol.


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Jiheisho
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12 Jan 2021, 8:22 pm

slam_thunderhide wrote:
Firstly, Trump did not support the any sort of attack on the Capitol as anyone who bothers to read his words will see.
Secondly, the Trump supporting raiders used force to get inside the Capitol, but never had any plan about what to do when they got inside, so to call it a coup attempt is ridiculous.


Well, I have seen his words and heard them. He certainly incited his supporters to take action, as did his accomplices. He is on record.

And the bombs? Those were not serious. The guy with the restraints? Not a hostage attempt? And what were the calls to hang Mike Pence about? 58 capitol police were beaten and one lost his life? Not serious? Hanging a noose and disabling police cars is just a gag? Even Elizabeth from Kentucky thought she was a member of a revolution.

Perhaps you need a bit of a refresher: 2021 storming of the United States Capitol

Quote:
As I posted elsewhere, I'm amused to see the levels of support for the US establishment in here, as if any sort of rebellion against it is a priori bad. I guess you people just want the US establishment to get back to what it's best at: drone strikes against Middle Eastern villages, spying on US citizens, bailouts for bankers while regular citizens are dying of despair.


That is, no offence, a pretty poor piece of reasoning. Because I am against overturning a democratic election through violence, I am for everything the government does?

Quote:
By the way, are leftists ever embarrassed about the BLM/antifa riots, the 2017 Congressional Baseball shooting, or the assassination attempt against Trump in 2016? Rhetorical question, I know the answer is no.


Wrong again. But at least you are consistently wrong. I am absolutely opposed to all political violence. Ironically, you are still trying to defend a president of the United States and his supporters that instigated an insurrection on our democracy. Five people have died in that insurrection. And it seems those supporters that you sympathize with are planning more violence.

And the funny thing is I am against ALL political violence. Are you? Do you support Rittenhouse that took a gun to a protest and killed two and injured one? Are you disgusted that police dragged George Floyd out of a police car and killed him. Let me say that again: police dragged him out of a police car and killed him. And what about the state violence on BLM supporters by police and Federal troops in DC. Does that make you angry?

This nation is imploding. I am really tired of people deflecting and saying, but they do it too. Grow up. Wake up.



kraftiekortie
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12 Jan 2021, 8:30 pm

I feel like Trump will get his comeuppance soon.....at least partially.

He is almost certain to at least get impeached. All that's needed is about 17 Republicans to vote for conviction when the Senate tries him.

And that's just the tip of the iceberg.....

People like Mitch McConnell, McCarthy (all staunch Trump supporters previously), have spoken out vociferously against Trump

And the Joint Chiefs of Staff!



goldfish21
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12 Jan 2021, 9:31 pm

The DC Attorney General is bringing criminal charges against trump for inciting violence. He can’t escape facing these charges in court once he’s out of office. There’s a very real possibility that even if he doesn’t face the music for any of his other criminality that he Could be sentenced to prison time and die in jail. 8)


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ezbzbfcg2
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13 Jan 2021, 1:22 am

goldfish21 wrote:
Just curious if violent insurrection at the direction of djt was finally crossing the line for any of you here?


I do find the term "insurrection" a little over-the-top. It's like how breaking into and burning down a police station isn't going to change police procedure, it's a disruption. Though it shows there is a large element of society that see a problem with police procedure.

Same with the Capitol storming. None of those people had any real power to change the election results. It was disruption, yes. But "insurrection" seems misleading, as does "coup." There was no organized overthrow of government by a militarized unit.

(I don't condone any of these forms of vandalism or trespassing.)

I fear a glorified sit-in at the US Capitol will now be used as a false pretext to go after anyone and everyone who doesn't tow the one party line. Ask yourself why so many people showed up in the first place. Just like why so many people rioted in Portland and elsewhere.

To say all these people (in all these different protests) are simply "crazy" is to ignore broader problems about the system itself.



goldfish21
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13 Jan 2021, 1:47 am

ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Just curious if violent insurrection at the direction of djt was finally crossing the line for any of you here?


I do find the term "insurrection" a little over-the-top. It's like how breaking into and burning down a police station isn't going to change police procedure, it's a disruption. Though it shows there is a large element of society that see a problem with police procedure.

Same with the Capitol storming. None of those people had any real power to change the election results. It was disruption, yes. But "insurrection" seems misleading, as does "coup." There was no organized overthrow of government by a militarized unit.

(I don't condone any of these forms of vandalism or trespassing.)

I fear a glorified sit-in at the US Capitol will now be used as a false pretext to go after anyone and everyone who doesn't tow the one party line. Ask yourself why so many people showed up in the first place. Just like why so many people rioted in Portland and elsewhere.

To say all these people (in all these different protests) are simply "crazy" is to ignore broader problems about the system itself.


“in·sur·rec·tion
/ˌinsəˈrekSH(ə)n/
Learn to pronounce
noun
a violent uprising against an authority or government.
"the insurrection was savagely put down"”

That’s what it was. It’s not defined as being by a highly trained militarized unit - although, police on scene did describe some of the perpetrators as highly trained. They made bombs and placed them as distractions to divide police resources. They had tactical training and gear. They had chemical weapons and gas masks. These weren’t all just a bunch of basement dwellers - many were off duty cops and ex military.

It wasn’t a peaceful protest or sit in I. The least bit. :roll: 6 people connected to the siege are now dead. They damaged property, stole other property, murdered a policeman via bludgeoning him in the head with a fire extinguisher. Calling it a glorified sit in as absurd and only serves to identify yourself as a domestic terrorist sympathizer. Gross.

This is not how you change a political system in a functioning democracy. You organize and vote - like over 80 Million Democrats did to fire trump and initiate some positive change for the direction of the federal leadership of the USA.


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Jiheisho
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13 Jan 2021, 2:03 am

Some of it was very organized. Armed protestors, five dead, and bombs deployed and you think they were just kidding? Perhaps you need an introduction: 2021 storming of the United States Capitol



ezbzbfcg2
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13 Jan 2021, 2:04 am

goldfish21 wrote:
Calling it a glorified sit in as absurd and only serves to identify yourself as a domestic terrorist sympathizer. Gross.

Don't worry, I'm not Canadian, so I'm not domestic as far as you and your separate country are concerned. Nor are you an American.

It's tragic when people are killed at mass gatherings (like people who've gotten trampled to death at concerts or suffocated in night clubs). Those who deliberately attacked and bludgeoned a police officer to death are indeed guilty of murder. I have no sympathy for them.

But after seeing a whole chunk of the city of Seattle get taken over by separatists, with seemingly little objection, I'm baffled that the the Capitol riot is being compared to 9/11. I don't think American democracy was literally under threat at any point, and those who claim it was are being overly dramatic.

goldfish21 wrote:
This is not how you change a political system in a functioning democracy. You organize and vote - like over 80 Million Democrats did to fire trump and initiate some positive change for the direction of the federal leadership of the USA.


The reason so many Americans are frustrated is not specifically because of Trump. Had we had a normal election day and Trump lost, you wouldn't be seeing this. What's happened instead is that a pandemic had been used to create an election month. Highly irregular and concerning to many who believe in the democratic process.

I'm not really bothered by the winner or loser of the election. I'm bothered by the highly unorthodox process that took place in 2020.



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13 Jan 2021, 2:09 am

This was planned on Parler weeks before Jan 6th. That is why Amazon dropped them and why other hosting providers will not take them and why their lawyers dropped them like a hot potato. I read on Twitter by people that they had been reporting these posts to the FBI. So yes, this was planned.

Edit: Missed a word.


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Last edited by League_Girl on 13 Jan 2021, 3:41 am, edited 1 time in total.

goldfish21
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13 Jan 2021, 2:16 am

ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Calling it a glorified sit in as absurd and only serves to identify yourself as a domestic terrorist sympathizer. Gross.

Don't worry, I'm not Canadian, so I'm not domestic as far as you and your separate country are concerned. Nor are you an American.

It's tragic when people are killed at mass gatherings (like people who've gotten trampled to death at concerts or suffocated in night clubs). Those who deliberately attacked and bludgeoned a police officer to death are indeed guilty of murder. I have no sympathy for them.

But after seeing a whole chunk of the city of Seattle get taken over by separatists, with seemingly little objection, I'm baffled that the the Capitol riot is being compared to 9/11. I don't think American democracy was literally under threat at any point, and those who claim it was are being overly dramatic.

goldfish21 wrote:
This is not how you change a political system in a functioning democracy. You organize and vote - like over 80 Million Democrats did to fire trump and initiate some positive change for the direction of the federal leadership of the USA.


The reason so many Americans are frustrated is not specifically because of Trump. Had we had a normal election day and Trump lost, you wouldn't be seeing this. What's happened instead is that a pandemic had been used to create an election month. Highly irregular and concerning to many who believe in the democratic process.

I'm not really bothered by the winner or loser of the election. I'm bothered by the highly unorthodox process that took place in 2020.


Forgot to mention that police & military are under investigation for their roles in what happened - the lack of police presence to protect the building and its occupants, cops allowing rioters in etc. This has been noted by European experts as a legitimate coup attempt by djt and his loyalists. Pretty serious business.

Doesn’t matter where I live. Domestic terrorists = originating in the country they attacked, which they did.

Umm, American democracy is literally what was under attack. These morons were attempting to prevent a democratically elected potus from being officially certified in order to install their orange cult leader as a dictator instead. How is this not crystal clear to you? :?

The democratic process, while slightly modified to accommodate the fact that Americans are living through a raging pandemic, was the exact same process for every eligible voter regardless of party affiliation or none at all. Democrats, republicans, independents - everyone was allowed to vote. Many people who are not science denying morons led to believe covid is a Democrat hoax opted to vote safely by mail while trump screwed his own chances of winning by telling his followers not to vote by mail. That’s his own damned fault. Literally every eligible voter had the same opportunity to vote, though, so in the end it simply came down to who had 7 Million more votes than the other guy. Not sure why any of this is difficult for you to follow, either. :? :? Or did you mean to say you simply don’t like the results of the election because trump lost? :? :?

2020 was a highly unorthodox year. The better part of half a Million Americans died in a raging viral pandemic. Why wouldn’t you expect some accommodations to an election to keep people safe? :? :?

FYI We had a Provincial election here in October. Everyone had the option of voting by mail if we wanted to - over a longer period of time than normal. We decided to vote in person IF there were no lines/crowds - and the place was empty so mask 6’ vote leave np. I think I remember reading that around 30% of people voted by mail. No one complained about any of it. It went off without a hitch - in part because no one from any political party was spreading dangerous lies about the election process like trump did in the USA.


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