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cyberdad
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18 Jun 2021, 6:24 am

roronoa79 wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
thinkinginpictures wrote:
"You may be aware that "big tech" has been aggressively censoring conservatives on Twitter, Facebook, Google, Instagram, YouTube and other social media platforms. This is tyrannical and suppressive towards Christians and conservatives."[/i]

In general I feel like if Conservatives has hijacked Christianity, making the Conservative literal Bible-fundamentalism the standard Christianity and everything isn't even Christian, it is just "blasphemy" and "liberal censorship"...


Liberal censorship? freedom of religion is a pillarstone of progressive politics.

Silly liberal! Don't you know that 'religious freedom' just exists so Christians can discriminate against whoever they want? Liberals have these weird ideas where religious freedom means that non-christians deserve the same dignity and rights as christians, and that using religion to justify discrimination is wrong bc anyone can just unconsciously twist their religious beliefs into whatever they have to be to rationalize their pre-existing desire to discriminate.

For example, the gubermint for the last half century has forced segregationist Christians to violate their beliefs by offering goods and services to people who aren't part of the holy American white race. Sadly these days they have to settle for discriminating against queers, bc advocating segregation for Christian reasons gets you even more cancelled than discriminating against queers, but even that sacred right to discriminate is slowly being ripped away from them. They'll have to console themselves by using Christianity to justify their hatred of trans ppl, until those sick liberals take that away from them too.


:lol:



Mr Reynholm
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22 Jun 2021, 1:55 pm

Its not so much that conservatives "hijacked" Christianity as that more traditional types of people gravitate towards Christianity while the more left leaning persons tend to reject religion in general.
Leftists have traditionally been hostile to Christianity such as in comunist contries Christianity is usually outlawed because the government sees it as a threat. Can't have the population forming loyalties to something other than the state. When not outlawed it is usually gutted of all meaning with just the surface trappings being displayed.



uncommondenominator
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22 Jun 2021, 3:06 pm

Persecution complexes be like...



ArtsyFarsty
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22 Jun 2021, 3:25 pm

Mr Reynholm wrote:
Its not so much that conservatives "hijacked" Christianity as that more traditional types of people gravitate towards Christianity while the more left leaning persons tend to reject religion in general.
Leftists have traditionally been hostile to Christianity such as in comunist contries Christianity is usually outlawed because the government sees it as a threat. Can't have the population forming loyalties to something other than the state. When not outlawed it is usually gutted of all meaning with just the surface trappings being displayed.

Hmmm. I’d say a more accurate assessment would be that left-leaning individuals tend to reject conservative evangelical Christianity, not Christianity in general. Mainline Protestant and Historically Black denominations tend to lean left, while Evangelical denominations tend to lean right.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.pewres ... s/%3famp=1



PhosphorusDecree
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22 Jun 2021, 3:30 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
It's been all downhill ever since Constantine converted. Image


I've heard anticlerical Christians claim the rot set in with St Paul. As Saul of Tarsus, he persecuted Christians; as a Christian leader, he oversaw a move towards dogmatism, hierarchy and submission through fear of Hell. I'm not enough of an expert to say how true that is....


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22 Jun 2021, 3:33 pm

Basically, it sets in any time a religion or philosophic belief starts being used by a government to control its citizens.


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Kraichgauer
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22 Jun 2021, 3:41 pm

Mr Reynholm wrote:
Its not so much that conservatives "hijacked" Christianity as that more traditional types of people gravitate towards Christianity while the more left leaning persons tend to reject religion in general.
Leftists have traditionally been hostile to Christianity such as in comunist contries Christianity is usually outlawed because the government sees it as a threat. Can't have the population forming loyalties to something other than the state. When not outlawed it is usually gutted of all meaning with just the surface trappings being displayed.


If that's the case, then I shouldn't exist. I'm a member of the Lutheran Church - Missouri Synod, which can be described as conservative though hardly fundamentalist or evangelical. Yet, I'm pretty liberal, as are other members of my congregation. I even know a doctrinally conservative Missouri Synod pastor who's politically liberal.


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cyberdad
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22 Jun 2021, 4:44 pm

Even in Australia its rare to find "progressive christians", however many of the early missionary sects in the 19th century were progressive.

Kraichie is a unicorn :D



Mr Reynholm
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23 Jun 2021, 7:44 am

ArtsyFarsty wrote:
Mr Reynholm wrote:
Its not so much that conservatives "hijacked" Christianity as that more traditional types of people gravitate towards Christianity while the more left leaning persons tend to reject religion in general.
Leftists have traditionally been hostile to Christianity such as in comunist contries Christianity is usually outlawed because the government sees it as a threat. Can't have the population forming loyalties to something other than the state. When not outlawed it is usually gutted of all meaning with just the surface trappings being displayed.

Hmmm. I’d say a more accurate assessment would be that left-leaning individuals tend to reject conservative evangelical Christianity, not Christianity in general. Mainline Protestant and Historically Black denominations tend to lean left, while Evangelical denominations tend to lean right.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.pewres ... s/%3famp=1

The opposite has been my experience, but one cannot speak for every single church. Just generalities.
Most persons on the left whom I have spoken to have been proud atheists who think Christianity amounts to troglodyte superstition. Can't speak for everyone though.



Mr Reynholm
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23 Jun 2021, 7:44 am

cyberdad wrote:
Even in Australia its rare to find "progressive christians", however many of the early missionary sects in the 19th century were progressive.

Kraichie is a unicorn :D

Kind of depends on how you define progressive.



Mr Reynholm
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23 Jun 2021, 7:59 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
Mr Reynholm wrote:
Its not so much that conservatives "hijacked" Christianity as that more traditional types of people gravitate towards Christianity while the more left leaning persons tend to reject religion in general.
Leftists have traditionally been hostile to Christianity such as in comunist contries Christianity is usually outlawed because the government sees it as a threat. Can't have the population forming loyalties to something other than the state. When not outlawed it is usually gutted of all meaning with just the surface trappings being displayed.


If that's the case, then I shouldn't exist. I'm a member of the Lutheran Church - Missouri Synod, which can be described as conservative though hardly fundamentalist or evangelical. Yet, I'm pretty liberal, as are other members of my congregation. I even know a doctrinally conservative Missouri Synod pastor who's politically liberal.

I know people in my own church who are liberal too. There is no political requirement for membership. I'm talking about generalities. Progressives tend to eschew Christianity. But much of this can get tied up in personal definition. In 2020 65% of Americans identified as "Christian" but what they meant by that is up to their own definition as no parameters seem to have been given. I have my definition that I share with other like minded folks but not all would agree with the definition that I use.



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24 Jun 2021, 1:38 am

My church is predominantly Liberal, so maybe it just depends on the church, as well as the culture around where said church is located? I do find right-wing Christianity hilarious though, as Jesus was quite Liberal for his time, and so was Paul. In fact, the general message of the New Testament is for everyone to love one another regardless of things like gender or race. Maybe they should read the Bible more, because they're not showing a lot of love for people who are different from them. Also, some of their signs during the election were beyond interesting. They couldn't pick someone less Christ-like to back, and he certainly doesn't belong in the same sentence as Jesus, that's for sure.



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25 Jun 2021, 8:54 am

Tross wrote:
My church is predominantly Liberal, so maybe it just depends on the church, as well as the culture around where said church is located? I do find right-wing Christianity hilarious though, as Jesus was quite Liberal for his time, and so was Paul. In fact, the general message of the New Testament is for everyone to love one another regardless of things like gender or race. Maybe they should read the Bible more, because they're not showing a lot of love for people who are different from them. Also, some of their signs during the election were beyond interesting. They couldn't pick someone less Christ-like to back, and he certainly doesn't belong in the same sentence as Jesus, that's for sure.

You are viewing the caricature of conservatives rather than real people. The MSM would have you believe that conservatives are all Nazis, Skin heads and Klansmen. Visit a local baptist church and talk to some people there about their views. I think you might be surprised.



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25 Jun 2021, 9:03 am

Baptist churches are notorious for denying women their right to speak as pastors from the pulpit. citing the opinion of the apostle Paul when he said, "Women are to be silent in the churches. They are not permitted to speak, but must be in submission, as the law says."

These are not the words of Jesus.  In fact, the first people to proclaim the Gospel were women.  Jesus' first appearance after His resurrection was to Mary Magdalene.  She was in the garden near the tomb, stricken with grief.  The one who had accepted and forgiven her, the one whom she loved so deeply, was gone.  She saw a figure she thought was the gardener and said to him, "They have taken my Lord. Do you know where they have laid him?"

Then a familiar voice called her name, "Mary."

She looked up and recognized Him.  "Master!" she cried.  Her Lord had come back, and the heart of the woman who had been cleansed by his love leapt for joy.  Mary went straight to the disciples with a simple testimony, "I have seen the Lord".  Again, the male disciples hearing the greatest news in history and for the future of their lives from Mary was itself a powerful sign of the purposes of God.

If having a woman proclaim His resurrection to men was good enough for Jesus, then why is it not good enough for the Baptist church?  Why does the Baptist church deny God's own will in this matter?


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Mr Reynholm
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25 Jun 2021, 9:35 am

Fnord wrote:
Baptist churches are notorious for denying women their right to speak as pastors from the pulpit. citing the opinion of the apostle Paul when he said, "Women are to be silent in the churches. They are not permitted to speak, but must be in submission, as the law says."

These are not the words of Jesus.  In fact, the first people to proclaim the Gospel were women.  Jesus' first appearance after His resurrection was to Mary Magdalene.  She was in the garden near the tomb, stricken with grief.  The one who had accepted and forgiven her, the one whom she loved so deeply, was gone.  She saw a figure she thought was the gardener and said to him, "They have taken my Lord. Do you know where they have laid him?"

Then a familiar voice called her name, "Mary."

She looked up and recognized Him.  "Master!" she cried.  Her Lord had come back, and the heart of the woman who had been cleansed by his love leapt for joy.  Mary went straight to the disciples with a simple testimony, "I have seen the Lord".  Again, the male disciples hearing the greatest news in history and for the future of their lives from Mary was itself a powerful sign of the purposes of God.

If having a woman proclaim His resurrection to men was good enough for Jesus, then why is it not good enough for the Baptist church?  Why does the Baptist church deny God's own will in this matter?

So not having women pastors is the equivalent to being Nazis?



ArtsyFarsty
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25 Jun 2021, 11:25 am

Mr Reynholm wrote:
You are viewing the caricature of conservatives rather than real people. The MSM would have you believe that conservatives are all Nazis, Skin heads and Klansmen. Visit a local baptist church and talk to some people there about their views. I think you might be surprised.

Conservative Christians aren't exactly an obscure subculture; I've venture to say that the average American has a decent amount of first- and second-hand exposure to them. Amongst my family members and in-laws, who have been conservative Baptists for decades, many have some pretty abhorrent views and are not shy about sharing them... and the ones who don't share those views are conspicuously quiet about disavowing them. Other than that, sure, they are delightful company when they are with those who share both their doctrine and their political views.