Are we young people ignorant of history ?

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naturalplastic
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09 Jan 2022, 3:58 pm

Jakki wrote:
you seem to want very badly to insist on Slavery as a issue here. Which is not the case .
It is about the ignorance of younger people about history . And your previous point points that out quite well .. You wish to compare values of the 1800s to that of the 1900s and base your "trope"
On that and then wish to carry it further forward to things that make up our values maybe even today . Those people who settled this Country , had no other aspirations then to be able too worship their choice of religion and start a new life in the west . There concerns were just to have a successful family and a parcel of ground to call their own. And where willing to do hardwork to get that. If anything these are more likely the values the Country had back then . And even a great deal of people today . But please do go on about slavery , cause it does seem to be what you wish to talk about ..


Slavery was an issue then. That is a fact. You are repeating lies if you say otherwise. AND you are the one who deralied the thread to in order repeat the lie. That is also a fact. Stop derailing the thread please. Stop falsely accusing me.



naturalplastic
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09 Jan 2022, 4:39 pm

Jakki wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
chris1989 wrote:
I seem to think that for example if young people see a statue of a controversial historical figure, it must be torn down because it should be utterly condemned for the bad things they did and and just ignore and disregard any good things they did and will just shout down and refuse to listen or debate the good stuff because it seems like in their minds the bad things outweighed the good things.


Statues of questionable historical figures belong in a museum where they can be viewed educationally. There isn't really any need to have publicly placed statues to honor people who played a role in defending slavery or massacring Native Americans.


Auuugh, …. This is maddening … you have given substance to rumor …. Please read about the civil war ….
Slavery was not the dominant issue at the time for the war ! Although people want it that way cause it is convenient to their narrative. (The way they want the story told) The South did NOT want to industrialize … The South as a whole was rural farming business . This put the South at a great disadvantage … they did not have factories to manufacture anything but process farm products . No firearms , they had to be imported . Even shoes were in short supply . Uniforms were mainly rag tag stuff people put together .. There was a large entire battle over a SHOE factory . In occupied Southern territory . General Lee and General Grant were both trained at the same military College and both were Federal Officers . As the war took off Lee felt allegiance to the South to the State were he grew up .
Not allegiance to Slavery . Yet recently instead of putting his statue on horseback in a museum , it has been melted down for its bronze value . According to recent news blurbs . This man was giving up his position in the Federal forces to do what he felt was right ,in the war between the States . States rights was a import thing back then.
In spite of all the stuff that has been thrown at this younger generation , the idea of Slavery being the primary issue in the War between the States , Is just not right . Slavery actually helped build this nation,and was incidental to the Civil War.
If the USA Government as a whole actually thought that Slavery was the Big issue George Washington’s picture should have never ever been put on our basic unit of money, ‘ the dollar bill” he used Slaves on his plantation .
And this unit of money is used throughout the world to buy goods and do business .
And PLEASE DO NOT get the idea I am pro South or slavery . But people need to understand the facts that created our history.

Listen...we are talking about ignorance. And here you are spreading ignorance yourself. I couldnt find Shelby Foote explaining how "saying slavery had nothing to do with the civil war is just as ignorant as saying slavery had everything to do with the civil war". Both are simplistic blanket statements.

But I did find this interview (Shelby Foote was the main historian who helped Ken Burns in his Civil documentary). Pay attention to the first five minutes.



The elite of the South got the urge to bolt from the Union the moment Lincoln was elected because..."they didnt want to loose their property" (ie slaves). That is a fact. Get real.



Jakki
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09 Jan 2022, 4:47 pm

Obviously you appear to need this thread to be about Slavery . Rather than history in its entirety.
And that is your perrogative ... but after trying to write with you about history in general .
It did occur to me thst things had gone onto one topic , your topic of Slavery . And that is not why i have written to this thread . So carry on , it is obvious you can .


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naturalplastic
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09 Jan 2022, 7:53 pm

Jakki wrote:
Obviously you appear to need this thread to be about Slavery . Rather than history in its entirety.
And that is your perrogative ... but after trying to write with you about history in general .
It did occur to me thst things had gone onto one topic , your topic of Slavery . And that is not why i have written to this thread . So carry on , it is obvious you can .

YOU made it about slavery. Not I.

YOU derailed the thread not I.

But...okay...I was gonna say "lets agree to disagree about this historic issue and return to the original subject", but actually that cant work now.

Since we cant agree on the facts about this aspect of an important moment in American history-then- how can we even talk about the topic of "general ignorance"?

Kinda like having two people start to talk about "public math aptitude" and then the two people find that they themselves cant agree that "one plus one equals two". Kinda kills the conversation right there. :lol:



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09 Jan 2022, 9:09 pm

naturalplastic wrote:

I am not applying any of "today's thinking" to the past. Thats what you're doing.


No