Classified documents found in Pence’s home

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ASPartOfMe
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24 Jan 2023, 2:35 pm

Classified documents found at Pence’s Indiana home

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A lawyer for former Vice President Mike Pence discovered about a dozen documents marked as classified at Pence’s Indiana home last week, and he has turned those classified records over to the FBI, multiple sources familiar with the matter told CNN.

The FBI and the Justice Department’s National Security Division have launched a review of the documents and how they ended up in Pence’s house in Indiana.

The classified documents were discovered at Pence’s new home in Carmel, Indiana, by a lawyer for Pence in the wake of the revelations about classified material discovered in President Joe Biden’s private office and residence, the sources said. The discovery comes after Pence has repeatedly said he did not have any classified documents in his possession.

It is not yet clear what the documents are related to or their level of sensitivity or classification.

Pence’s team notified congressional leaders and relevant committees of the discovery on Tuesday

Pence asked his lawyer to conduct the search of his home out of an abundance of caution, and the attorney began going through four boxes stored at Pence’s house last week, finding a small number of documents with classified markings, the sources said.

Pence’s lawyer immediately alerted the National Archives, the sources said. In turn, the Archives informed the Justice Department.

A lawyer for Pence told CNN that the FBI requested to pick up the documents with classified markings that evening, and Pence agreed. Agents from the FBI’s field office in Indianapolis picked up the documents from Pence’s home, the lawyer said.

On Monday, Pence’s legal team drove the boxes back to Washington, DC, and handed them over to the Archives to review the rest of the material for compliance with the Presidential Records Act.

In a letter to the National Archives obtained by CNN, Pence’s representative to the Archives Greg Jacob wrote that a “small number of documents bearing classified markings” were inadvertently boxed and transported to the vice president’s home.

“Vice President Pence was unaware of the existence of sensitive or classified documents at his personal residence,” Jacob wrote. “Vice President Pence understands the high importance of protecting sensitive and classified information and stands ready and willing to cooperate fully with the National Archives and any appropriate inquiry.”

The classified material was stored in boxes that first went to Pence’s temporary home in Virginia before they were moved to Indiana, according to the sources. The boxes were not in a secure area, but they were taped up and were not believed to have been opened since they were packed, according to Pence’s attorney. Once the classified documents were discovered, the sources said they were placed inside a safe located in the house.

Pence’s Washington, DC, advocacy group office was also searched, Pence’s lawyer said, and no classified material or other records covered by the Presidential Records Act was discovered.

In November, Pence was asked by ABC News at his Indiana home whether he had taken any classified documents from the White House.

“I did not,” Pence responded.

“Well, there’d be no reason to have classified documents, particularly if they were in an unprotected area,” Pence continued. “But I will tell you that I believe there had to be many better ways to resolve that issue than executing a search warrant at the personal residence of a former president of the United States.”

While Pence’s vice presidential office in general did a rigorous job while he was leaving office of sorting through and turning over any classified material and unclassified material covered by the Presidential Records Act, these classified documents appear to have inadvertently slipped through the process because most of the materials were packed up separately from the vice president’s residence, along with Pence’s personal papers, the sources told ClNN.

The vice president’s residence at the US Naval Observatory in Washington has a secure facility for handling classified material along with other security, and it would be common for classified documents to be there for the vice president to review.

Some of the boxes at Pence’s Indiana home were packed up from the vice president’s residence, while some came from the White House in the final days of the Trump administration, which included last-minute things that did not go through the process the rest of Pence’s documents did.

Last week, Pence told Larry Kudlow in a Fox Business interview that he received the President’s Daily Brief at the vice president’s residence.

“I’d rise early. I’d go to the safe where my military aide would place those classified materials. I’d pull them out, review them,” Pence said. “I’d receive a presentation to them and then, frankly, more often than not Larry, I would simply return them back to the file that I’d received them in. They went in commonly into what was called a burn bag that my military aide would gather and then destroy those classified materials—same goes in materials that I would receive at the White House.”


There seems to be an epidemic of carelessness and recklessness among these politicians.

It is not going to happen but all involved should pay a legal consequence of some sort.


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funeralxempire
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24 Jan 2023, 2:43 pm

So, (a) how many of them have engaged in this sort of behaviour and (b) how many denied it, refused to cooperate, etc like Donnie did?

So far Pence and Biden appear to have been cooperative and like they recognize this as a serious matter, at least compared to Trump.


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24 Jan 2023, 3:41 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
So, (a) how many of them have engaged in this sort of behaviour and (b) how many denied it, refused to cooperate, etc like Donnie did?

So far Pence and Biden appear to have been cooperative and like they recognize this as a serious matter, at least compared to Trump.

Each case should be judged on an individual basis. Not all involved should be locked in jail and the key thrown away, but all should be held accountable.

Trump's individual situation means he deserves a long time in jail but politically how you can prosecute him now?

People covering their asses post Mar a Lago does not cut it with me. If Trump has not been so over the top these people would have kept what did not belong to them forever.


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funeralxempire
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24 Jan 2023, 7:43 pm

ASPartOfMe wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
So, (a) how many of them have engaged in this sort of behaviour and (b) how many denied it, refused to cooperate, etc like Donnie did?

So far Pence and Biden appear to have been cooperative and like they recognize this as a serious matter, at least compared to Trump.

Each case should be judged on an individual basis. Not all involved should be locked in jail and the key thrown away, but all should be held accountable.

Trump's individual situation means he deserves a long time in jail but politically how you can prosecute him now?

People covering their asses post Mar a Lago does not cut it with me. If Trump has not been so over the top these people would have kept what did not belong to them forever.


All quite reasonable. I agree that they're not all equal cases and that details of Trump's case make it unique.

You prosecute him because he's earned it, he can't receive special treatment because he's a wealthy politician otherwise the entirely legal system's legitimacy starts to become questionable. Every single instance that occurs contributes, but an especially public example only makes it worse.

He can run from prison like Eugene V. Debs had to.


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24 Jan 2023, 7:51 pm

"You get classified documents! You get classified documents! Everyone gets classified documents!"


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24 Jan 2023, 8:46 pm

Laeril wrote:
"You get classified documents! You get classified documents! Everyone gets classified documents!"


*checks under seat*

She's not kidding.


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24 Jan 2023, 8:55 pm

Laeril wrote:
"You get classified documents! You get classified documents! Everyone gets classified documents!"


I saw the title of this thread and immediately thought about making an Oprah meme about everyone getting classified documents. We clearly have a similar sense of humour :lol:


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24 Jan 2023, 9:01 pm

I'm going to order a red "CLASSIFIED" stamp from Amazon, and mark every piece of junk mail I throw away.


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24 Jan 2023, 9:46 pm

In all these discussions, as my favorite legal podcast pointed out, the correct verbiage is "marked as classified," given that there is no way to know without further review if the document actually IS classified. Documents are declassified all the time. Hopefully few of the documents found in any of those homes actually are classified at this point in time.

Hard to be sure just how sloppy our various vice presidents were without further review of the documents.

And we do still have the difference of documents known to exist, v documents more of the "oops" lineage.

I am curious exactly what Pence is thinking here. I don't buy the "abundance of caution" as a full and complete reason.


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24 Jan 2023, 9:51 pm

DW_a_mom wrote:
In all these discussions, as my favorite legal podcast pointed out, the correct verbiage is "marked as classified," given that there is no way to know without further review if the document actually IS classified. Documents are declassified all the time. Hopefully few of the documents found in any of those homes actually are classified at this point in time.

Hard to be sure just how sloppy our various vice presidents were without further review of the documents.

And we do still have the difference of documents known to exist, v documents more of the "oops" lineage.

I am curious exactly what Pence is thinking here. I don't buy the "abundance of caution" as a full and complete reason.


Time to check in on what exactly Cheney and Gore have stashed away. :lol:


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25 Jan 2023, 2:14 am

funeralxempire wrote:
So, (a) how many of them have engaged in this sort of behaviour and (b) how many denied it, refused to cooperate, etc like Donnie did?

So far Pence and Biden appear to have been cooperative and like they recognize this as a serious matter, at least compared to Trump.



Such a self-serving statement ( because you don't like Donald Trump his classifieds are soooooo much worse ). Joe Biden has reams of boxes, not reams of documents, but reams of boxes of documents. Do you realize how pathetic it sounds when you defend that by saying he 'complied?' He didn't comply, he's being fed to the wolves. THAT more than anything else should scare the crap out of all of us. They all do it, they aren't the ones running the show. We think that because we vote for them that they are in charge, they aren't. Something bigger is at play here and I honestly don't care about who turns up next with documents. We're being snake charmed.


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25 Jan 2023, 4:01 am

DW_a_mom wrote:
I
I am curious exactly what Pence is thinking here. I don't buy the "abundance of caution" as a full and complete reason.

He is thinking to get out front of the story in the hope it goes away as fast as possible, instead of it coming out in drips and drabs like with Biden.


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25 Jan 2023, 4:12 am

Laeril wrote:
"You get classified documents! You get classified documents! Everyone gets classified documents!"\\


Well...I packed a bunch of glassware, and china, in boxes when I moved. Packed in wads of paper to cushion them as packing material...lemme unfold some of the wads...

OMG! The President's secret nuclear codes are on this page! And I was about to use it with windex to wash the windows! :o



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25 Jan 2023, 7:53 am

Why not investigate anybody who potentially could have access to classified documents?

Why not emphasize the more blatant crimes which Trump committed?



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25 Jan 2023, 11:27 am

In the cases of Pence and Biden I suspect human error.
-They and their staff handled a lot of papers, some of which were classified.
-They were not careful to keep the classified stuff separated, it all got commingled.
-The piles of commingled papers proliferated and spread through the desks, cabinets, and closets.
-When it was time to leave office someone just grabbed piles of paper and packed them without checking them.

Criminal? Meriting punishment? Maybe...let the DOJ work it out.

Sloppiness? Meriting retraining on document handling? Seems likely.


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25 Jan 2023, 1:52 pm

Do you really believe that all of them aren't hedging their bets by having classified documents? Each political person has an ego, and each one has blood on their hands. For someone like Pence, maybe it's an oversight. But someone like both Trump and Biden were keeping those documents as a failsafe against political enemies. And accusations... In essence, blackmail. You tell on me, I tell on you.

I am just baffled by the blindness to human nature.


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