It’s Not a 2020 Rerun—It’s Much Worse

Page 1 of 2 [ 25 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

ASPartOfMe
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Aug 2013
Age: 67
Gender: Male
Posts: 37,906
Location: Long Island, New York

18 Aug 2023, 11:22 am

Abe Greenwald for Commentary

Quote:
Americans dread another Biden-Trump showdown in 2024. The New York Times reports that a puny 22 percent of Democrats would be “excited” about Joe Biden’s nomination and a 46-percent plurality of Republicans “would be open” to voting for someone other than Donald Trump.

In the last election, Trump voters of a certain type might have conceded that Trump’s conduct was as offensive as his ignorance was regrettable. But all told, they could have argued, Trump’s boorishness was outweighed by his sound economic policy, his forceful opposition to the identity-based left, and a results-oriented foreign policy in the Middle East and elsewhere. And the flop Russiagate investigation, they might have pointed out, only proved that the most obvious case against him had become too hysterical to take seriously.

What Trump voters didn’t have to do in 2020 was justify his undermining an American election because he hadn’t yet done that. They didn’t have to account for his being liable for battery and defamation against E. Jean Carroll because that finding was also in the future. There was no need to explain why he hoarded classified documents and reportedly showed them to others on a whim. And they didn’t have to weigh Trump’s perceived good points against convincing details of alleged criminality in a raft of indictments. It was a lot easier to hold your nose and vote for Trump in 2020.

Something similar held for Joe Biden. In 2020, few Biden voters found the former vice president stirring. But that was the point. After four years of Trump tumult, Biden represented an opportunity to make politics uneventful again. And for liberals, he had the added benefit of serving in the beloved Obama administration. Sure, he was clownish and getting on in age, and he had some plagiarism issues in his past. But compared to the day-to-day outlandishness of Trump, none of this even rose to the level of genuine drama.

What Biden voters didn’t have to do in 2020 was account for Hunter Biden’s incriminating laptop because the Biden campaign had temporarily conned them into believing it was Russian disinformation. And they didn’t yet have to deal with the brazenness of that deception. Nor did they have to justify Biden’s lies about being ignorant of Hunter’s foreign business dealings. They didn’t have to reject a growing body of testimony and documentation suggesting Joe Biden might have played a profitable role in his son’s influence-peddling scheme. They certainly didn’t have to reconcile their vote with corroborated whistleblower testimony about Justice Department wrongdoing in his son’s case. There was no need to explain why their man, too, had held on to secret documents after leaving office. Nor, finally, did they have to deny the daily evidence of their own senses, which suggested a president in striking cognitive decline. In 2020, it was a lot easier to cast Joe Biden as conventional.

Despite the names being the same, this election is shaping into something utterly new: a bipartisan devaluation of accountability and a moral compromise forced on the American voting public. No one championing either man can be said to have clean hands. No one here is righteous.


_________________
Professionally Identified and joined WP August 26, 2013
DSM 5: Autism Spectrum Disorder, DSM IV: Aspergers Moderate Severity.

“My autism is not a superpower. It also isn’t some kind of god-forsaken, endless fountain of suffering inflicted on my family. It’s just part of who I am as a person”. - Sara Luterman


swrider
Raven
Raven

Joined: 9 Aug 2023
Gender: Male
Posts: 120
Location: Arizona

18 Aug 2023, 11:41 am

I for one am hoping for a cross-party ticket. A moderate Democrat and a Moderate Republican. We need to pull the parties back towards the center where most Americans truly are. I also think it would be really cool if extra-terrestrials and unicorns were real and world peace was a thing... since I am listing unrealistic hopes.



funeralxempire
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 27 Oct 2014
Age: 40
Gender: Non-binary
Posts: 33,019
Location: Right over your left shoulder

18 Aug 2023, 7:56 pm

swrider wrote:
I for one am hoping for a cross-party ticket. A moderate Democrat and a Moderate Republican. We need to pull the parties back towards the center where most Americans truly are. I also think it would be really cool if extra-terrestrials and unicorns were real and world peace was a thing... since I am listing unrealistic hopes.


The only problem is a centrist ticket would almost certainly combine the worst aspects of both major parties, rather than only their redeeming qualities.


_________________
The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.
If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing. —Malcolm X
Real power is achieved when the ruling class controls the material essentials of life, granting and withholding them from the masses as if they were privileges.—George Orwell


Aspiegaming
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Sep 2012
Age: 33
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,993
Location: Hagerstown, MD

19 Aug 2023, 7:35 am

We could write-in a candidate, but the odds of him or her winning are the same as the odds of Americans developing a hive mind so they can all collectively vote such a candidate.


_________________
I am sick, and in so being I am the healthy one.
If my darkness or eccentricity offends you, I don't really care.
I will not apologize for being me.

There is no such thing as perfect. We are beautiful as we are. With all our imperfections, we can do anything.


swrider
Raven
Raven

Joined: 9 Aug 2023
Gender: Male
Posts: 120
Location: Arizona

19 Aug 2023, 10:09 am

funeralxempire wrote:
swrider wrote:
I for one am hoping for a cross-party ticket. A moderate Democrat and a Moderate Republican. We need to pull the parties back towards the center where most Americans truly are. I also think it would be really cool if extra-terrestrials and unicorns were real and world peace was a thing... since I am listing unrealistic hopes.


The only problem is a centrist ticket would almost certainly combine the worst aspects of both major parties, rather than only their redeeming qualities.


I'm not sure I follow your logic, as I see the worst qualities being on the extremes of both sides. I feel the redeeming qualities are in the middle and therefor a centrist ticket could be ideal... That being said no ticket will ever be ideal, but I feel it would be closer than current options are shaping up to be.



goldfish21
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Feb 2013
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 22,612
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada

23 Aug 2023, 2:14 pm

joe biden's no saint, but he's still the lesser evil and so as far as politicians go should get the vote over criminal defendant donald trump.


_________________
No :heart: for supporting trump. Because doing so is deplorable.


ASPartOfMe
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Aug 2013
Age: 67
Gender: Male
Posts: 37,906
Location: Long Island, New York

23 Aug 2023, 2:38 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
joe biden's no saint, but he's still the lesser evil and so as far as politicians go should get the vote over criminal defendant donald trump.

The lesser of two evils is still evil. That is the point. What the author is saying is that both candidates are more unqualified for the position than they were in the 2020 "lesser of two evils" election.


_________________
Professionally Identified and joined WP August 26, 2013
DSM 5: Autism Spectrum Disorder, DSM IV: Aspergers Moderate Severity.

“My autism is not a superpower. It also isn’t some kind of god-forsaken, endless fountain of suffering inflicted on my family. It’s just part of who I am as a person”. - Sara Luterman


funeralxempire
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 27 Oct 2014
Age: 40
Gender: Non-binary
Posts: 33,019
Location: Right over your left shoulder

23 Aug 2023, 2:48 pm

swrider wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
swrider wrote:
I for one am hoping for a cross-party ticket. A moderate Democrat and a Moderate Republican. We need to pull the parties back towards the center where most Americans truly are. I also think it would be really cool if extra-terrestrials and unicorns were real and world peace was a thing... since I am listing unrealistic hopes.


The only problem is a centrist ticket would almost certainly combine the worst aspects of both major parties, rather than only their redeeming qualities.


I'm not sure I follow your logic, as I see the worst qualities being on the extremes of both sides. I feel the redeeming qualities are in the middle and therefor a centrist ticket could be ideal... That being said no ticket will ever be ideal, but I feel it would be closer than current options are shaping up to be.


I disagree, much of the worst traits of both parties are found within their most centrist figures. Those are the people who've never encountered a military adventure they didn't approve of, the ones who are most likely to be in the pocket of different lobbying groups, etc.

I don't believe the most generic Republicrat imaginable would have anything positive to offer over existing Republicans or Democrats.


_________________
The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.
If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing. —Malcolm X
Real power is achieved when the ruling class controls the material essentials of life, granting and withholding them from the masses as if they were privileges.—George Orwell


TwilightPrincess
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 28 Sep 2016
Age: 40
Gender: Female
Posts: 31,955
Location: Hell

23 Aug 2023, 2:50 pm

I don't think much progress would be made if people stayed safely in the center and didn't make a stand for anything.


_________________
“Les grandes personnes ne comprennent jamais rien toutes seules, et c'est fatigant, pour les enfants, de toujours et toujours leur donner des explications.”
Le Petit Prince


funeralxempire
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 27 Oct 2014
Age: 40
Gender: Non-binary
Posts: 33,019
Location: Right over your left shoulder

23 Aug 2023, 3:06 pm

TwilightPrincess wrote:
I don't think much progress would be made if people stayed safely in the center and didn't make a stand for anything.


But, if we don't prioritize order over justice, positive change might actually occur. We can't have that. :skull:


_________________
The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.
If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing. —Malcolm X
Real power is achieved when the ruling class controls the material essentials of life, granting and withholding them from the masses as if they were privileges.—George Orwell


Dox47
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 28 Jan 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 13,670
Location: Seattle-ish

24 Aug 2023, 9:26 pm

I don't think I've ever felt so consciously accelerationist before, I just want to get through the burning it all down part and get to rebuilding.


_________________
Your boos mean nothing, I've seen what makes you cheer.

- Rick Sanchez


Mona Pereth
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 11 Sep 2018
Gender: Female
Posts: 8,601
Location: New York City (Queens)

25 Aug 2023, 10:39 am

Dox47 wrote:
I don't think I've ever felt so consciously accelerationist before, I just want to get through the burning it all down part and get to rebuilding.

Rebuilding as what?


_________________
- Autistic in NYC - Resources and new ideas for the autistic adult community in the New York City metro area.
- Autistic peer-led groups (via text-based chat, currently) led or facilitated by members of the Autistic Peer Leadership Group.


Misslizard
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 18 Jun 2012
Age: 60
Gender: Female
Posts: 20,484
Location: Aux Arcs

25 Aug 2023, 10:48 am

Will there be anything left to rebuild?


_________________
I am the dust that dances in the light. - Rumi


Mona Pereth
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 11 Sep 2018
Gender: Female
Posts: 8,601
Location: New York City (Queens)

25 Aug 2023, 12:12 pm

Unfortunately, according to Ballotpedia, the only alternatives to Biden on the Democratic side are Robert Kennedy Jr. and Marianne Williamson.

And, unfortunately, it looks like both these other candidates have anti-vax-ish views. Regarding Marianne Williamson, see this news story (admittedly, four years old).


_________________
- Autistic in NYC - Resources and new ideas for the autistic adult community in the New York City metro area.
- Autistic peer-led groups (via text-based chat, currently) led or facilitated by members of the Autistic Peer Leadership Group.


Dox47
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 28 Jan 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 13,670
Location: Seattle-ish

25 Aug 2023, 6:25 pm

Mona Pereth wrote:
Rebuilding as what?


Something closer to what the founders intended, particularly with regard to how much government exists and what they're allowed to do.


_________________
Your boos mean nothing, I've seen what makes you cheer.

- Rick Sanchez


goldfish21
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Feb 2013
Age: 42
Gender: Male
Posts: 22,612
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada

25 Aug 2023, 6:38 pm

Dox47 wrote:
Mona Pereth wrote:
Rebuilding as what?


Something closer to what the founders intended, particularly with regard to how much government exists and what they're allowed to do.

Somehow I doubt they envisioned governing ~400M people nor any of the complexities of modern society.


_________________
No :heart: for supporting trump. Because doing so is deplorable.