China most likely exploiting Uyghurs for forced labor

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They are closer than you think
https://thedriven.io/2023/05/22/teslas- ... ing-times/

That's like saying x is closer to Toyota than you think because they use Denso as a supplier.

^ Missing the point, potential buyers of Tesla are switching to BYD because they are cheaper, the manufacturer based the original concept/design on Tesla

That's not what your article says.

Your article describes Tesla switching to BYD batteries for European market Model Ys instead of CATL batteries.

Nothing in your article support the claim you're making now.



Do you have anything that supports this claim?

Sorry that's what I heard on the news

Interesting, because it's not a claim I've ever heard reported on in any car media or automotive industry news and I do consume quite a bit (understatement) of auto industry related media.

It seems like the sort of claim that would get widely reported if there was much credibility to it, although I'm open to being shown sources.

Warren Buffett owns a chunk of BYD. Should have bought shares when he did.

BYD designed their own mega car hauler for the ocean and have 4 or 6 of them in order. They’re far more fuel efficient than existing options, too. They’re gearing up to export a lot of cars.

Zero BYD’s here. Lots of Teslas, a few lucid airs, Nissan leaf some fords and gms etc.

Vinfast just opened a couple dealers here, but hard to say whether they will sink or swim. They’re not inexpensive and apparently have software issues. Cool story of a new company trying, though. IF they survive they’ll be a symbol of national pride for Vietnam no doubt.

BYD sells in Mexico and is looking to build a manufacturing facility there. Odds are, if BYDs arrive in Canada, they'll be made in Mexico just like most Fenders.

Sorry I'm not imagining what I saw on the news here

Ah, so it's clickbait, not news.

Scotty Kilmer makes a lot of baseless claims and doesn't cite a source here (which is typical of him).

I'm not saying he's definitely wrong, but I'd bet both of my kidneys and your spleen that he's exaggerating like he's prone to doing. It's like when people try to insist that China's jet fighters are copies of American ones when they're designed with different primary tasks in mind than the American fighters.

It's not unreasonable to suggest that the Chinese firms used information from American firms as shortcuts in developing their own products, that doesn't mean the end products are copies of the American products. The Chinese products are almost always designed with a different criteria than whatever they're claimed to be copies of. They typically use different components, are designed to different price points, they often have improvements in some ways while often having deficits in others, etc.

Tesla is largely an upmarket car company, BYD isn't. Tesla might have things to teach BYD that can be valuable, but that doesn't mean BYD are incapable of doing anything but imitating and copying Tesla.

It's reductionist nonsense to reduce what's actually occurring down to hurr durr China just copies. It's nonsense whether it's trolls discussing defence topics, or whether it's Scotty Kilmer, or it's you.

He's competent when discussing car maintenance, but I'd treat everything he talks about outside of that field with at least a few grains of salt.

and then again it's more than likely it's intellectual property espionage or to put it more crudely theft.

Again, using that sort of information doesn't mean a firm is directly copying.
BYD has proven capable of innovation even if they might also rely on spying. Spying can have more than just one end, it's not usually done with the goal of outright copying.

One of the first main tasks that needs to be done after reverse engineering something is figuring out what components can be sourced locally and how to accommodate differences in terms of spec. From there the design steadily starts to differ compared to the original as the engineers handling the project come to better understand what they're working with vs. what they seek to achieve.

In the case of BYD, they've hired a bunch of talent from established companies over the past 15 years, they also partnered with Mercedes-Benz and otherwise have done a bunch of their own work to get to where they are.

Even 100% accepting the idea that they've pilfered all sorts of IP, pilfered IP on it's own isn't very useful. Knowing how a Tesla is designed is only a very small part of the puzzle when it comes to building a Tesla, and once you can build a Tesla you're most of the way to being able to design your own electric car that suits your local market better; especially if you already have been building cars for awhile.

IP theft is much more useful for improving one's own products rather than cloning your competitor's product. You adapt (and ideally improve) whatever is suitable for your own product because doing so reduces the development cycle. Generally speaking, exact replication is something a firm would only do when they're just starting to get off the ground; BYD has been around for 20 years.

RFA and Forbes... great unbiased coverage of the non-Western world. Consider the propaganda you're being fed, from all sides, at all times. The US wants to start a new cold war with China, so OFC China is doing bad things. Get real.