Executive function?

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I'm having trouble understanding the concept of executive function, and lack thereof. It's described as being made up of working memory, cognitive flexibility, and impulse control, but those strike strike me as three very different things.

And the suggestions for handling executive dysfunction are to make to-do lists and plan ahead, which seem to me would only make it worse. If tasks are already overwhelming, having to do all that only adds to the work involved in carrying them out.

I find many things hard and overwhelming, and if they are things I simply have to do, the best I can do is to plow through them barely paying attention, just doing what I can to get through them. This causes mistakes and sloppiness and also causes me to put things off until I can no longer put them off, or just put them off forever, but if I had to plan it would be worse. Isn't the planning the very thing that is hard?

I have excellent working memory. I have very little cognitive flexibility. I have terrible emotional regulation and impulse control. But how does any of that relate to feeling so overwhelmed that I can't do a lot of things or find them so hard to do that I just don't do them? (Or if I really have to, grit my teeth and plow through.)

It makes me wonder why so many things are hard for me. Perhaps it has nothing to do with executive function after all?

In an article I read that describes what I wrote above, it ends with an example of a woman who "consistently couldn’t face making breakfast, which left her feeling drained and anxious." I can relate to that, but I don't see the connection to working memory, rigid thinking, and poor impulse control. Then it said, "By preparing breakfast in advance, she noticed a huge improvement in her day." How is preparing breakfast in advance any different than preparing it later?

This is the article: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog ... ple-autism

it probably varies a lot from individual to individual. Daughter struggles with depression too and anxiety so sometimes those get in the way. When she is ready to tackle a job, she has learned to break it down into small steps, Say she has to clean the living room : Since she likes to shop, we related it to shopping where we could. First she goes shopping for trash, and removes cans, bottles, waste paper, etc from the room. then she goes shopping for things that live elsewhere. Everything that belongs in the kitchen goes back to the kitchen. Then the things that belong in the bedroom, the bathroom... Now she has cleared the clutter. Each step after that is broken down too. Dust everything, vacuum everything. Done! Now she can move on to another room when she is ready. Only one step needs to be done at any time, she shops for trash all through the house more often than she dusts, for example. The trick is breaking each job down to little bits or steps. That way the whole thing is not hanging over her head and paralyzing her with the size of the project. Maybe something like that would work for you. If you can't do this on your own, its OK to ask others to help you see how you could break down any project into smaller bits and bites . Sometimes daughter sets a kitchen timer and only works until it goes off. Rewards herself with a break or a treat, and repeats. There are lots of "work arounds", and they can be designed for your own style and way of doing things and they can be designed to fit your needs.

I don't know if I have problems with executive function. I am an extreme planner and love lists and feel like I can't survive without those things.

I lack common sense and the ability to work out how to do tasks in the moment (often due to anxiety making it hard to think and act). If I preplan, then I have time to think about the steps needed to complete the task, even though most people wouldn't even need to think first. With a practised preplan I can also do things in autopilot despite anxiety.

The point of plans and to do lists is to break a big task down into small steps. So instead of thinking, I need to make breakfast, which can seem like an overwhelming large task, you think I need to:
1. Get a bowl out of the cupboard
2. Get a box of cereal
3. Pour the cereal into the bowl

Each of those steps probably seems doable, small and easy.

For tidying a room, a plan could be:
1. Look for rubbish to throw away, like empty wrappers
2. Look for recyclables like papers and sort into two piles, one for shredding and one for putting in recycle bin
3. Look for stuff that needs to be put away. Sort that stuff into piles of like things (clothes together, toys together, books together). Put each pile of like things away, one pile at a time, across several days if necessary.
4. Now the floor should be clear, so hover it.I

Things like depression, anxiety, fatigue, lack of motivation etc can also make tasks feel overwhelming.

Let's see... This seems to be the subtle kinds, unlike the seemingly actionable ones like planning, decide what to do, being cooled inside/motivated enough, and then just do it.

The overwhelm can be a source of a lot of things. It's not just the emotional aspects, but also the sensations and thoughts, too.


Overwhelm can happen if the steps are not broken down even more, and if there are steps in between that seems to be 'incomprehensible'.

Like, say, do the dishes.
But somewhere you're worried about either something else (either some form of perfectionism and the idea of what finish looked like in your head but it 'looked impossible' -- which could be say, all of it, or other task you'd rather do first -- which is related to cognitive flexibility 'but do X first! But finish Y first!' no matter how irrelevant -- or both of it) or not wanting to do the steps in between (something like you don't want to wet your hands or even go to the sink -- or even, the simplest seems steps too many; really, each step, no matter how subtle and very small, may count as 'a task switch') or the hypothetical future of the process itself (in which can quickly turn emotional, or, even, mental -- by being distracted or this off-thought of decision making that went to indecision, quickly reaching to any other coping mechanisms and became a trial of impulses).

It's a stupid, not being able to fill the blanks in between, and it's placeholder is replaced with the feeling of 'it is not possible'.
Despite being done before, despite that it can be shown, despite that it IS so damn simple -- just fricking 5 minutes or less.

As other people have suggested, break everything down into much smaller tasks. You can even mix it up a bit more by completing different mini tasks for two big tasks at the same time.

For example, if I have to empty the dishwasher and do the accounts, I'll open all the cupboards/drawers in the kitchen, just dry/return the plates in one shelf then mentally 'tick' that box in my head. Then go and complete one platform for my accounts and 'tick' that box. Then return to the kitchen and dry/return the cutlery and 'tick' that box, then go back to my office and complete another platform... Until both the dishwasher and accounts are done. If I try to do one boring (to me) big task in one go then it takes much longer and I'm in a bad mood at the end, as for me bored = very stressed.

Occasionally my brain cooperates and I can plough through the whole task in one go (usually on autopilot while in deep thought about something more interesting), but otherwise the above method works.

Another strategy is to introduce something you like as part of the process. Like when I commuted to an office, every Monday I would get a Cuban Roast at Wawa which I would then savor at my desk when I got to the office. Breaking a task done into individual, automatic steps, is good as well. I call this ritualizing.

The "executive function" concept has never been of much use to me either. It's probably not often explained in enough depth for me to understand it. And a lot of these ideas are only constructs, i.e. not necessarily all that real but just symbols that some people find useful. I get that my memory sometimes lets me down, but beyond that I don't see how this EF thing applies to me.

Creating written, detailed plans for everything can lead to problems. I tend to be afraid of not having such plans, but when I do have them they slow me down with too much detail. Instead of just getting on with the task, I'm reading through these long lists of sub-tasks and trying to figure out how the list relates to the actual job. I've also noticed that if I make the task list too specific, it becomes vulnerable to changes in the working conditions. As for creating less specific, less detailed lists, for some reason I'm not good at that. So sometimes I just wing it, without any written plans, and just hope it will work out. Many tasks aren't all that vital or urgent anyway, and if they go wrong it's not the end of the world.

When I'm feeling overwhelmed it is often because I have this feeling that there are so many things I need to do and I don't know where to start and it just feels like this huge pressure on me.

Personally I find it really useful to make a list. But I have to go through and work out priorities, as in which ones absolutley must be done that day and which are not so urgent. Then the things I have to do that day I number 1,2,3 etc.

Once that list is there and I'm no longer trying to hold all those tasks in my head, there's less overwhelm. Then I can just concentrate on doing task no. 1. When that's done I cross it off and start no. 2. Possibly with a tea break in between if I want.

Everything is so much easier that way. Without my list I'm paralysed.

Oh, and if something urgent comes up or there's a change of plan, taking the time to slot that into my list and re-arrange helps me to accept the change.

To understand the term "executive function", imagine there's a little guy (the executive) sitting in your head. When he's asleep, we just follow our instincts - we eat and sleep etc as we like. When he's awake, he reminds us of other things we need to be doing like washing the dishes straight after meals. When our mind wanders and we stop washing the dishes halfway through he reminds us to keep going. He also informs us of he steps needed in washing the dishes.

So if we have a problem with executive function it just means our brain is running on auto and the higher control centre is not doing its job properly.

Cognitive flexibility and impulse control are both looked after by the executive, who is located in the white matter of the frontal or prefrontal lobes of the brain. In autism we tend to have poor connectivity between different brain regions, so most of us have some degree of executive dysfunction. This means that we can be quite happily concentrating on one thing (monotropism), but the part of the brain that switches us between tasks does not kick in (cognitive flexibility issue) or we follow our impulse to do something different from the task we should be doing (impulse control issue). Because these are both higher order brain functions located in similar brain areas they both come under executive function, and it is common for autistics to have problems with both.

I'm not so sure about working memory and how that fits in to executive function - but I know I have issues with short term memory myself because when people give me instructions I have to write it down straight away or it will drop out of my mind.

I don't really have a problem with chores. I am paralyzed by more challenging things, like having to sort out a mistake on my property taxes, which I have been putting off for two years. I truly have no idea how to handle that and it is hanging over me like a dread.

Or more generally by things that require figuring out what to do and sorting it out. Another thing I need to do is ask for an extension on my IRS taxes for next year. When I told my sister there is no way I could do that, she scoffed that it was incredibly simple and of course I can do it. I plan to ask my tax accountant to do it, because I just don't think I can. I have the requisite intelligence, but it's just not possible, and I'm not completely sure why.

I first heard the term EF after my stroke, from my Speech-Language Pathologist.
Language plays a big role in EF because we use language to think and remember (lexicons).
We have to read and follow instructions like the cooking directions on a box, or completing taxes.
That's all language.

That was important to me, because the stroke caused me to have aphasia.

She said EF is all about planning, starting, doing, finishing, and learning from / scaffolding tasks.
That means there are lots of steps in every "little" thing that people do.

Sometimes I can't get to step 1 (planning) because the whole task is too overwhelming.
Sometimes I'll start something impulsively, but never finish.
Sometimes I'll stay on the planning stage because I get too obsessed with the details.

Very seldom do I learn how to transfer skills from task to task over time.

Anxiety is often the problem for people, especially autistics.
Other people see the task as "one thing", but autistics see the task as "hundreds of things".
That's because we focus so much on details, and the steps overwhelm us.
We don't want to get any of the steps wrong.
We worry we'll lose motivation.
We worry we won't be able to self-advocate if we need help.

She also showed me something like this:



I don't know if any of that helps, but I thought I'd share anyway.

One of my EF assessment tasks was to tell her all the steps involved in washing a car.

I asked her if that meant a drive-thru car wash, or manual.
She said manual.

I remember saying you use a sponge and "wash the car".
I made it sound like one step.

She pointed out that it would actually involve -

Deciding to wash the car
Brainstorming all the equipment you'd need
Deciding if you had all the stuff
Finding a place to do it (not in your living room)
Probably changing your clothes
Gathering the pail, the hose, etc.
Shutting the car windows
Filling the pail
Washing the car (where do you start?)
Possibly washing some parts twice
Rinsing the car
Waxing the car (optional lol)
Hosing off the driveway
Putting all the supplies away
Changing your wet clothes

etc etc

I was pretty shocked at all the steps.


No wonder I don't wash my car lol

Was this 'uncertainty' "gap", like, 'something is missing, and won't do it until it's found' kind of overwhelm?

Often happens at paperwork.


I have the same problem.

That is, if, I forgot to switch between thinking in monologues and enter the wordless world.

It became a habit to be in the former. Likely since teenage years when I started to read more fluently.
And I kept being stuck at that side for so many reasons that cannot be avoided.

Last edited by Edna3362 on 07 Jan 2024, 12:33 am, edited 1 time in total.

Ah yeah, OK. This may not be an executive function issue. It is more of an anxiety and avoidance issue, that is, putting off doing something we feel really anxious about. I have that problem to some extent also.

Some of us have difficulties with forms - which may be related to not being sure we are understanding the intent of the questions or whether we are filling them in correctly and being afraid of getting it wrong, plus a good deal of frustration around any questions we can't answer or don't have the supporting paperwork for, and for online forms there is the whole problem of remembering passwords and so on. So even though I'm supposedly smart with a Masters degree having to complete an important form can certainly induce a meltdown. It's not surprising that we develop an aversion to such activities.

With me I think it's more pessimism and fear that holds me back. I usually manage to get my act together in the nick of time when I know I have to, I guess that's because as the deadline looms I'm more scared of the consequences of not getting it done than I am of tackling it. But I go through a lot of anguish in the meantime, thinking that I'm not clever enough to sort it out and that my life is going to collapse as a result.

If only the prescribed methods for these things would stay the same, I'd have a lot less of a problem. I was doing quite well with financial tasks on the Web back in the day when it was easier to log into most websites and they weren't forever moving the goalposts. But these days they're always monkeying about with these things so that the experience is never the same twice, and I often hit a brick wall which wouldn't have been there if they'd just left the damn thing alone.

I do a lot better with household chores because the conditions are much more under my control so I've often been able to establish repeatable routines. I think the only things that slow me down there are that a lot of the time those tasks aren't really urgent, there's no clear-cut deadline, and the work itself is rather boring.