Zionists Did TERRIBLE Things To Establish A Jewish State

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funeralxempire
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27 Jun 2024, 3:18 pm


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funeralxempire
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27 Jun 2024, 4:14 pm



Israel was founded on terrorism and war crimes and continues that tradition to this day.


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cyberdad
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29 Jun 2024, 8:13 pm

There seems to be two narratives in the foundation of the Jewish state of Israel.
One is the role of British colonial administration and Zionist movement who permitted atrocities in the name of creating a Jewish state in Palestine.
The other is the story of 1-2 million Jewish civilians who escaped "real" persecution to create a new life in what they were told was a Jewish homeland where they could live in peace.

A difference between European settlers (like some of your own ancestors FE) is they were largely economic migrants who took advantage of the dispossession of indigenous populations and the promise of wealth and prosperity. In contrast most of the Jews were escaping centuries of persecution for choosing to adhere to their faith and Israel was their ancestors original homeland and they (Zionist belief) legitimately believed they were returning to the place of their cultural birth.



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30 Jun 2024, 5:13 pm

^ Whatever their reasons were, it doesn’t excuse the atrocities that they committed. Just because other groups also committed atrocities doesn’t nullify their own.


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funeralxempire
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30 Jun 2024, 5:17 pm

cyberdad wrote:
There seems to be two narratives in the foundation of the Jewish state of Israel.
One is the role of British colonial administration and Zionist movement who permitted atrocities in the name of creating a Jewish state in Palestine.
The other is the story of 1-2 million Jewish civilians who escaped "real" persecution to create a new life in what they were told was a Jewish homeland where they could live in peace.

A difference between European settlers (like some of your own ancestors FE) is they were largely economic migrants who took advantage of the dispossession of indigenous populations and the promise of wealth and prosperity. In contrast most of the Jews were escaping centuries of persecution for choosing to adhere to their faith and Israel was their ancestors original homeland and they (Zionist belief) legitimately believed they were returning to the place of their cultural birth.


Whatever lies they told themselves to justify their behaviour doesn't ultimately justify their behaviour. Telling yourself you're more entitled to someone's homeland than the people actually living there doesn't make your violence used to take that land more justified.


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The core principle of conservatism is "Rules protect, but do not bind me. They bind, but do not protect you."


cyberdad
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01 Jul 2024, 3:53 am

I'm not excusing Netenyahu's decisions.
I thought this thread's purpose was terrible things done to establish a Jewish state in 1948?



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01 Jul 2024, 6:05 am

cyberdad wrote:
There seems to be two narratives in the foundation of the Jewish state of Israel.
One is the role of British colonial administration and Zionist movement who permitted atrocities in the name of creating a Jewish state in Palestine.
The other is the story of 1-2 million Jewish civilians who escaped "real" persecution to create a new life in what they were told was a Jewish homeland where they could live in peace.


What dishonest phrasing you use. When writing about the atrocities committed “in the name of creating a Jewish state in Palestine” you can’t even bring yourself to state who carried them out (i.e., Jewish Zionists), and yet you can blame the “British colonial administration” for allowing them.

Actually, many early Jewish Zionists hated the British for not allowing them to dispossess the Palestinian Arabs more quickly, and some of them carried out terrorist attacks against the British as a result.

cyberdad wrote:
I'm not excusing Netenyahu's decisions.
I thought this thread's purpose was terrible things done to establish a Jewish state in 1948?


Huh? Nobody on this thread is accusing you of excusing Netanyahu’s decisions*. Coming out with non-sequiturs like this doesn’t help your case, you know.

(*IMO, what you are doing though is excusing the Zionist terrorists of the 1940s.)



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01 Jul 2024, 6:09 am

Seriously, cyberdad, what is with all this special-pleading and what-aboutism you come out on the subject of Israel? I suppose I could understand it if you had Jewish ancestry. So do you? (I see you have made reference to FE's ancestry on this thread, so I should be able to ask you about yours.)



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01 Jul 2024, 9:47 am

Lenin famously sad you have to break eggs in order to make an omelet.


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funeralxempire
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01 Jul 2024, 1:03 pm

MaxE wrote:
Lenin famously sad you have to break eggs in order to make an omelet.


And Lenin is widely recognized as an absolute monster, much like those who orchestrated and participated in the Nakba should be recognized.


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“Anyone who wants to thwart the establishment of a Palestinian state has to support bolstering Hamas and transferring money to Hamas, this is part of our strategy” —Netanyahu
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The core principle of conservatism is "Rules protect, but do not bind me. They bind, but do not protect you."


funeralxempire
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01 Jul 2024, 1:32 pm



This is part one of two, part two hasn't been released yet.


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“Anyone who wants to thwart the establishment of a Palestinian state has to support bolstering Hamas and transferring money to Hamas, this is part of our strategy” —Netanyahu
戦争ではなく戦争と戦う
The core principle of conservatism is "Rules protect, but do not bind me. They bind, but do not protect you."


cyberdad
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01 Jul 2024, 4:02 pm

slam_thunderhide wrote:
What dishonest phrasing you use. When writing about the atrocities committed “in the name of creating a Jewish state in Palestine” you can’t even bring yourself to state who carried them out (i.e., Jewish Zionists), and yet you can blame the “British colonial administration” for allowing them.


If you read my post I included the zionist movement - One is the role of British colonial administration and Zionist movement who permitted atrocities in the name of creating a Jewish state in Palestine.



cyberdad
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01 Jul 2024, 4:26 pm

slam_thunderhide wrote:
Seriously, cyberdad, what is with all this special-pleading and what-aboutism you come out on the subject of Israel? I suppose I could understand it if you had Jewish ancestry. So do you? (I see you have made reference to FE's ancestry on this thread, so I should be able to ask you about yours.)


I am not Jewish and have no personal stake in the state of Israel. I am, however, a little perplexed at the wanton anti-Israeli sentiment on WP. Much of the tone of posts insinuates (at best) or directly alleges that Jewish civilians are "accomplices" to genocide.

I posted in another thread that 44% of Americans support trump which ironically is the exact percentage of Jews who support Netanyahu and percentage of Palestinians who support HAMAS. Seems we all have a lot in common.

Why do I keep going on about this? If I remember correctly the US was founded on genocide and enslavement. I could also create a thread called "Canada did terrible things to establish a colony". Being anti-Israeli and talking about giving back land to Palestinians has an endgame when you support HAMAS which is no more Jews from the "River to the sea". HAMAS made their intentions clear on Oct 7th and still hold Jewish civilians hostage after raping women and murdering children. two wrongs still don't make a right, but how is it middle class college students in Ivy league colleges in the US think HAMAS's actions constitutes retaliatory action? why do 44% of Palestinians endorse HAMAS even after committing criminal acts on thousands of Jewish civilians.

Realistically reasonable people should support negotiated release of hostages, getting out of Gaza might be a solution but let's not swallow a "stupid pill", everyone knows HAMAS was being manipulated by Iran and they haven't finished with plans to destroy the State of Israel. Israelis also have long memories and hey know when you pay off HAMAS, it's like a protection racket. they will be back for more payment later. HAMAS can't exist without Palestine being in a state of war. Perhaps you should consider that.



funeralxempire
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01 Jul 2024, 4:28 pm

cyberdad wrote:
...however, a little perplexed at the wanton anti-Israeli sentiment on WP...


It's almost like decades of behaving in a morally repugnant way has given Israel a reputation for behaving in a morally repugnant way.

How dare anyone notice. :roll:


cyberdad wrote:
...why do 44% of Palestinians endorse HAMAS even after committing criminal acts on thousands of Jewish civilians.

Realistically reasonable people should support negotiated release of hostages, getting out of Gaza might be a solution but let's not swallow a "stupid pill", everyone knows HAMAS was being manipulated by Iran and they haven't finished with plans to destroy the State of Israel. Israelis also have long memories and hey know when you pay off HAMAS, it's like a protection racket. they will be back for more payment later. HAMAS can't exist without Palestine being in a state of war. Perhaps you should consider that.


Because Hamas is one of the few entities that fights against the entity that's stolen and occupied their land and murdered, raped and tortured their loved ones.

Israel needs to stop being the aggressor if Hamas is to become irrelevant.


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“Anyone who wants to thwart the establishment of a Palestinian state has to support bolstering Hamas and transferring money to Hamas, this is part of our strategy” —Netanyahu
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The core principle of conservatism is "Rules protect, but do not bind me. They bind, but do not protect you."


cyberdad
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01 Jul 2024, 5:10 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
Because Hamas is one of the few entities that fights against the entity that's stolen and occupied their land and murdered, raped and tortured their loved ones.

Israel needs to stop being the aggressor if Hamas is to become irrelevant.


We seem to be crossing old roads again. I posed the question last year how should Israel have responded to Oct 7th? What we got was "It was Israel's fault! Netanyahu created HAMAS". If Mexican drug cartels decided to move into Cancun and murder and rape 2000 American teenagers on spring break in retaliation for US anti-drug wars, and then take 200 kids as hostages and livestream their torture I suspect the US army would do exactly the same as Israel until every teen was returned home. the American public would not care about collateral damage until every hostage was returned.



funeralxempire
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01 Jul 2024, 5:15 pm

cyberdad wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Because Hamas is one of the few entities that fights against the entity that's stolen and occupied their land and murdered, raped and tortured their loved ones.

Israel needs to stop being the aggressor if Hamas is to become irrelevant.


We seem to be crossing old roads again. I posed the question last year how should Israel have responded to Oct 7th? What we got was "It was Israel's fault! Netanyahu created HAMAS". If Mexican drug cartels decided to move into Cancun and murder and rape 2000 American teenagers on spring break in retaliation for US anti-drug wars, and then take 200 kids as hostages and livestream their torture I suspect the US army would do exactly the same as Israel until every teen was returned home. the American public would not care about collateral damage until every hostage was returned.


And reasonable people would condemn America's overreaction.

They'd also question who was actually responsible for the deaths if the US was open about having a policy like the Hannibal directive.

Not that a group that resists occupation can fairly be compared to a group that only exists to profit off of criminal activities, although that sort of dishonesty should be expected from someone who simps for a terrorist state.


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“Anyone who wants to thwart the establishment of a Palestinian state has to support bolstering Hamas and transferring money to Hamas, this is part of our strategy” —Netanyahu
戦争ではなく戦争と戦う
The core principle of conservatism is "Rules protect, but do not bind me. They bind, but do not protect you."