Do NT/AS relationships fair better then AS/AS relationships?

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Kitsy
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29 Dec 2007, 4:01 am

braveheartlion wrote:
I think earlier diagnoses for people would help Aspies to know what they're working with so that they know what their weaknesses are and have the tools to counteract them.


I agree. It would be nice to know such things early on. Speech classes help alot too.


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29 Dec 2007, 4:40 am

Agreed. I seriously wonder how different things could have been had I known about the Asperger's when I was 15 or 18 or even 25, instead of later still.


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01 Jan 2008, 12:41 pm

Just going from personal experience.... I'd say for a "fling" relationship, where you want excitement, energy, and a lot of physical contact, an NT. For a long term relationship, you need to find another Aspie. I had two long term and ulitmately heartbreaking relationships with NT's. I got hurt, they got hurt, because ultimately we just did NOT understand the way each other thought. I could not understand what they wanted, when they wanted it and react appropriately. Granted this was 15 years before mention of Asperger's ever reached America in any large scale way. If I'd known WHY I am the way I am, at the time, and they had known, it may have made a difference. I think if you look around, you may find more AS women than you think. For one thing, we seem to tend to attract each other, by what I don't know. Maybe we DO pick up on subtle signals, but only from other Aspie's, or maybe it's pheromones. I do know, if I find a sudden attraction to a woman I may not have even "met" yet, she often turns out to be bright, quirky, have a track record of awful relationships with NT's and maybe displays some OCD tendancies.... Sound familiar?? My wife is definitely an Aspie, and while it's not easy, it's easier now that we know about Asperger's. Both our son's are Aspie's as well. In some ways it's easier with another Aspie. But you MUST get in the habit of talking, about emotions and about what you expect, and what she expects from you. We DON'T usually "pick up" on that, and without it, any relationship is going to probably fail.


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02 Jan 2008, 3:35 am

knowing what men and women have in common.
i see NT(male) & AS(female) being a more successful relationship than NT(female) & AS(male).
women tend to quit faster, have less patience, and demand more affection(sometimes confused by them with "attention") than men.

AS/AS relationships sound like a perfect thing, yet i haven't experienced it or seen it with my eyes.


i would recommend people to be serious and marry, not just pick out lovers. AS men are not good at trying to seduce women, and if you are it's probably because you're getting women that are cornier than you.
marriage pushes you to be mature in a relationship.



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02 Jan 2008, 6:25 am

mmaestro wrote:
woodsman25 wrote:
Statistics show that AS/NT relationships fail more often then NT/NT, thats all I know.

Anyway, in answer to the OP's question, I think trying to find any rules or guidelines to follow is probably a mistake. All relationships are unique, and pose their own challenges. While knowing whether AS/AS or AS/NT relationships are more successful might be an interesting academic exercise, I think that trying to judge and form individual relationships you have based on your own preferences and those relationships' merits would be more productive for you. If you can figure out what's going wrong, and why, in previous relationships you may also have more success in working out the later ones. FWIW, I was well into my 20s before I had a relationship I'd consider healthy and equitable. It takes a long time to find the right one, for everyone, not just aspergians.


I liked this reply. Put in my own words, "You don't judge specifics by statistics. But statistics are determined by the sum of specifics." For example, a doctor shouldn't decide what condition you have based upon accumulated statistics -- even if they are 99% vs 1%. They should judge your condition on the basis of results and the theories of explanation that remain. In other words, by sound reasoning about the situation. Once a diagnosis is determined, that specific situation can amend the statistics. I completely agree that one shouldn't decide a potential relationship on the basis of statistics that have nothing whatever to do with the specifics in play. They might help you think about questions to consider in context, perhaps. But that's about all.

Another poster here and I are married. We are both AS. She is imaginative far beyond my skills and scans across so many areas of thought so quickly I can scarsely keep up and I am deep into math and physics and theoretical. She cannot stay focused on a tree, but sees the forest immediately. I easily stay focused on a subject for years and cannot seem to raise myself beyond that tree to see a forest. But I fell in love with her at 8, or so. She's 2 years older than I am. She is my first _and_ only. I've known her more than 40 years, now. She is without a doubt my best friend. As I sit here next to her sleeping, it is hard to express the love I feel for her or my sincere gratitude as she continues to permit me to stick around for a bit longer.

Together, we have three children. Of those, one is profoundly autistic (with grand mal seizures) and another is higher functioning, much as I was at his age but with more support and understanding (I hope I can fairly say.) We've been through a lot more than most, I think. Our marriage not only works, but I also feel such exceptional luck in life about it, too. So I know that sometimes an AS/AS marriage works for at least some extended period of time, from personal experience. I've no idea how likely it might be, though. Just that I've been lucky.

Finally, I think that the OP (or someone) mentioned their own experience where they haven't yet met an AS woman. I remember from early discussions with genetic counceling staff at a local hospital, that profound autism shows about a 1:4 ratio of female to male, for profound levels. Males being 4 times as likely. I know we aren't talking about that case here, but perhaps if it extends a little that may help explain the experience. But that could be all wrong, too, since that data was from before 1990, was only about profound cases, and I really have no idea at all what current statistics might say about Aspergers or higher functioning cases. It would be interesting to read how categories are drawn today and what the numbers fall out as -- though I've no idea how I'd apply any of it if I read it.

Jon



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02 Jan 2008, 6:38 am

AspieDave wrote:
For one thing, we seem to tend to attract each other, by what I don't know. Maybe we DO pick up on subtle signals, but only from other Aspie's, or maybe it's pheromones. I do know, if I find a sudden attraction to a woman I may not have even "met" yet, she often turns out to be bright, quirky, have a track record of awful relationships with NT's and maybe displays some OCD tendancies....

My wife and I feel an almost "family" feeling when we meet another "of our kind." Many, many years ago when we saw Rudolf the Red-Nosed Reindeer, we connected with the idea presented by the "Island of Misfit Toys." There wasn't anything wrong with the toys, at all. They weren't broken. But they were 'different' -- they didn't fit some narrow, NT pattern. In that sense, we kind of identified. We aren't broken. But we are do not entirely fit in, either. But more than that, I find we can recognize each other, in some way I'm unclear on. And feel right at home.

Jon



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20 Jan 2008, 1:38 am

I agree that aspies are definitely drawn to each other. My fiance and I had no idea we were aspies when we first started talking. Upon the discovery it helped us put the pieces together and finally see what was going on. It's a struggle with the misunderstandings and rigidity but I have never had anyone get me the way he does. I think an AS/AS relationship is just so pure and beautiful. There are blunders but if there is love and dedication to learning how to work with each other then it can be quite the utopia ^.^


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20 Jan 2008, 1:45 am

ASPER wrote:
knowing what men and women have in common.
i see NT(male) & AS(female) being a more successful relationship than NT(female) & AS(male).
women tend to quit faster, have less patience, and demand more affection(sometimes confused by them with "attention") than men.

I think this is very true. Even being on here, I hear all the time about women here in successful relationships with NTs, but a looooot less from the male AS side.



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20 Jan 2008, 2:27 am

I am currently dating another aspie. In most ways, I am finding it more rewarding than dating an NT. The difficulty in reading each other's body language is not that much of an issue. We just talk about most things. We talk to the point that it would exasperate most other couples. However, it does appear to work for us.

When my GF does something that does annoy me, I must remember for the most part it is due to her AS, and that it is not intentional. She must suffer through my annoying tendencies in this respect as well. Therefore, perservere. She can sometimes be a little hot and cold. However, that is a price that must be paid.

It is also very rewarding. She understands many of my odd traits and quirks. Nay, she is even delighted by a great deal of them. We make jokes based on wierd and obscure topics. I can have a meaningful conversation about comics or SF with her. Also, since she can understand where I am coming from, I have been able to be more open and honest with her than I have ever been with anyone in my life. In my mind, the benefits far outweigh the drawbacks. :D


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09 Apr 2012, 6:10 pm

not t0 be blunt but i dont really care if its to perceived to be a bad or good idea for aspies to date. i just want as much info/relationship advice as humanly possible.

i cant help it i like aspie girls and guys i feel like i resonate on the same frequency and we cna understand one another better.

my first relationship was with an aspie guy and he pushed me away because he has a hard time letting go of past relationships and letting love and he is going through a difficult tiem in his life.it just wasnt a healthy relationship. im just having a really really hard time getting over him even though i know i deserve better.
there is another aspie guy tha ti kind of like now but i just broke up 2 weeks ago with my last bf and i got really depressed hanging out with the new guy and comparing it to my last relationship.
i dont want my feelings for my ex to get in the way forever or ill become even more suicidal.
i also have a crush on this girl who funny enough dosent have aspergers.

i just want to know what to do! i want a relationship book for as-as or for someone who has as not for the partner who has as(normally a guy)



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09 Apr 2012, 7:24 pm

Regarding there being more men with *diagnosed* autism than women, autism presents differently in girls and is often undetected. It can often be difficult to obtain a diagnoses because the criteria are developed from observing male patients. If you removed the disparity in difficulty being identified and being diagnosed there is likely a much more even population of male and female autistics. Who knows, you may have met an AS girl already without even knowing it.
As for as Autistic vs. Allistic partners, neither are monolithic groups so it's difficult to say overall which would be a better match. There is a tremendous amount of human variation in people of all neurotypes.
As an autistic person you may have a shared background with another autistic person in dealing with things related to autism. But you could also share a lot with an allistic person from a similar background or with similar interests.
I recently started dating another Autistic person and it's been the same in many ways to my relationships with allistic people. It's nice to be with someone who can relate to that aspect of myself but it's also a little aggravating to have someone be inside my head so much when I'm not used to it.
My advice would be to focus on personality and connection not diagnoses. However I do think there is something to said for the fellowship of autistic people, as a marginalized group there are some aspects of ourselves that someone with allistic privilege may never be able to understand (just as a white person there are some aspects of being a POC I can never fully understand) but I don't think that's the only, or even the most important, factor in a relationship.



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09 Apr 2012, 8:05 pm

Kitsy wrote:
braveheartlion wrote:
I think earlier diagnoses for people would help Aspies to know what they're working with so that they know what their weaknesses are and have the tools to counteract them.


I agree. It would be nice to know such things early on. Speech classes help alot too.


They helped me a lot as for the thread I would say I could stay in a AS/AS relationship longer then a AS/NT one.



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09 Apr 2012, 8:08 pm

I would rather have an AS/AS relationship than AS/NT. During my life I've found most NT's to be more judgmental and less understanding people. I would prefer the company of someone with Autism like myself, sure there might be communication problems. But at least you will better understand how the other person is feeling. I firmly believe Autism can never truly be sympathized with unless you have it yourself.



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09 Apr 2012, 8:18 pm

A necrothread? Really??

I don't normally consider neurology a deal breaker. Add to the fact that all allistics are different and all Aspies are different. How can there be one answer to this question with so many variables to account for? :?



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09 Apr 2012, 9:56 pm

For a possible answer, find out what your MBTI type is.

Two aspie INTPs with substantial overlap in their special interests can become almost instant soulmates, and remain passive low-maintenance friends for decades afterwards (meaning, neither one of you really has to DO anything to regard each other as friends forever, besides not actively harm each other. You might go for weeks or months, maybe even a few years without contact, but can instantly slip back into comfortable "friend" mode for a day or two at a time as circumstances bring you back together in a moment of common interests.

Two aspie INTPs without substantial mutual special interests are likely to get bored of each other within days, if not minutes. No fighting or anything, just boredom and going their own ways. When a pair of INTPs break up, we don't go away mad... we just get distracted by something else, and kind of notice a few weeks later when somebody points it out. With an INTP pair, the attraction or disinterest is almost always equal and mutual.

An aspie who's strongly INTP is unlikely to easily get along with an aspie who's strongly INTJ. It happens, but generally speaking, you'll start annoying the hell out of each other after about 5 minutes. You might put up with each other long enough to have a day or two of explosive sex, but long-term, it's unlikely to happen. Note that I'm talking here about aspies who are STRONGLY "P" and "J". A strong INTP and weak INTJ, or a weak INTP and strong INTJ might get along well *if* they have substantial overlap in their special interests. A moderate P/J couple will be kind of like my cats... clawing at each other with fur flying one minute, curled up and best friends the next.

I honestly don't know about two INTJs. From what I remember, INTJs can get along, but the instant magic two INTPs can have doesn't have an INTJ analogue.

That said, there's something else to consider: sex. I've slept with two Aspies, and was kind of disappointed both times. The problem is, it's hard *enough* to deal with your *own* sensory issues, let alone deal with yours, be aware of & respectful of a totally different set belonging to someone else, and get lucky enough to have THEM pull off both sets of demands perfectly, too. In INTP land, at least, I've kind of concluded that there are people you become friends with (mostly, other INTPs), people you have sex with (non-INTPs), and minimal overlap between the two.

The nice thing is, two INTPs can have sex, be mutually disappointed, and transition seamlessly into friends anyway. Likewise, an INTP & INTJ who have disappointing sex will decide they don't actually *like* each other and solve the problem, too. The problems come when you make the mistake of sleeping with a crazy-hot (hystrionic & clingy) ESFJ who'll never let you forget about the "priceless gift" they gave you (and will go totally nuclear on you when you yawn & calmly itemize and list all your friends that you know they've slept with, & force them to confront the reality that they're really as slu*ty as you are... ESFJs aren't very good at compartmentalizing and systematizing moral calculus as INTPs, and can *really* freak out when you calmly shatter their illusions of being an innocent, virginal Catholic schoolgirl in a snow-white dress...)


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10 Apr 2012, 4:28 am

From my point of view, an AS/AS relationship can be just as problematique as an AS/NT relationship.
It depends on compatibility alone, regardless of anyone with Asperger Syndrome.


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