Vermont Secession
I'm currently neutral (undecided) on the issue, though I'm interested to see whether this movement will continue to gain support or fade out after the 2008 U.S. elections. The following article appeared in The Boston Globe in June 2007.
MONTPELIER, Vt. -- At Riverwalk Records, the all-vinyl record store just down the street from the state Capitol, the black "US Out of Vt.!" T-shirts are among the hottest sellers.
But to some people in Vermont, the idea is bigger than a $20 novelty. They want Vermont to secede from the United States -- peacefully, of course.
Disillusioned by what they call an empire about to fall, a small cadre of writers and academics is plotting political strategy and planting the seeds of separatism.
They've published a "Green Mountain Manifesto" subtitled "Why and How Tiny Vermont Might Help Save America From Itself by Seceding from the Union." They hope to put the question before citizens at Town Meeting Day next March, eventually persuading the state Legislature to declare independence, returning Vermont to the status it held from 1777 to 1791.
Whether it's likely is another question.
But the idea has found plenty of sympathetic ears in Vermont, a left-leaning state that said yes to civil unions, no to slavery (before any other) and last year elected a socialist to the U.S. Senate.
About 300 people turned out for a 2005 secession convention in the Statehouse, and plans for a second one are in the works. A poll this year by the University of Vermont's Center for Rural Studies found that 13 percent of those surveyed support secession, up from 8 percent a year before.
(Article is continued here)
Related links:
The Once and Future Republic of Vermont - Washington Post
A Vision of a Nation no Longer in the U.S. - New York Times
Free Vermont - The American Conservative
http://www.vermontrepublic.org/
http://www.vtcommons.org/
http://freevermont.net/
New England Secession
And there is a group of Libertarians that want to move to New Hampshire, and secede and turn it into a Libertarian utopia.
When the DEA put up road blocks around Key West to try to crimp drug smugglers, this caused traffic problems, and the Conch Republic secession movement was formed.
Other news on the secession front: this month, Lakota Indian Groups announce nullification of treaties, withdraw from US.
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don't forget the Alaskan Independence Party or various Texan groups.
These ideas have been around for quite a while, although I never heard of anyone other than Texans and Alaskans wanting to return to being on their own.
Interesting!
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First, the recent Vermont move to secede is partly driven by nutjob racist groups (namely the "Association for Research on Ethnicity & Nationalism in the Americas"; nothing to be proud of here: http://www.vermontsecession.blogspot.com/ .
Second, within the last 100 years, nearly every US state has tried to secede ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U. ... _proposals ). It ain't gonna happen.
Third, even if successful in seceding, how would Vermont survive economically? They'd have to trade with somebody, and don't think for a minute the US government wouldn't set up a trade embargo with a state that decided to go solo. And Vermont currently runs a hefty deficit re: federal taxes v. federal spending. Operating capital's gotta come from somewhere (despite popular belief to the contrary)...
Not so hefty, I think. I remember reading that the southern states that are so up in arms about welfare and highway pork and such are actually the biggest beneficiaries. This source shows a slight loss would occur.
http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/topic/62.html
Alabama gets back $1.66 for every dollar they send to D.C.
I'm sure Vermont could trade with Quebec.
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UncleBeer
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Not so hefty, I think. I remember reading that the southern states that are so up in arms about welfare and highway pork and such are actually the biggest beneficiaries. This source shows a slight loss would occur.
http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/topic/62.html
Alabama gets back $1.66 for every dollar they send to D.C.
I'm sure Vermont could trade with Quebec.
![Wink :wink:](./images/smilies/icon_wink.gif)
Trade what exactly? Maple syrup?
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Vermont is currently 50th out of 50 in Gross State Product. It's the only state in the Union not to have a state balanced budget requirement. And according to Wikipedia,Vermont's leading industry is . . . Government.
![Rolling Eyes :roll:](./images/smilies/icon_rolleyes.gif)
Again, hard to take this seriously.
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Vermont is currently 50th out of 50 in Gross State Product. It's the only state in the Union not to have a state balanced budget requirement. And according to Wikipedia,Vermont's leading industry is . . . Government.
![Rolling Eyes :roll:](./images/smilies/icon_rolleyes.gif)
Yes, and it is 49th out of 50 in terms of population. The fact that it gets beat by Wyoming (50th in numbers) is not surprising - Wyoming does have significant mineral resources. While it does have the smallest Gross State Product, the per capita Gross State Product is closer to the middle - 38th. And government is the largest employer across the US, I believe.
Again, hard to take this seriously
Mostly a curiosity, I agree. But Vermont would be more populous than many existing nations. Tuvalu gets most of their income from the .tv domain names (and a con man stole most of that a few years ago).
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Not every state lists "government" as their top 'industry'; some states are home to companies that actually produce goods and services.
It would snatch 160th place away from Comoros. Hardly "many".
Not every state lists "government" as their top 'industry'; some states are home to companies that actually produce goods and services.
It would snatch 160th place away from Comoros. Hardly "many".
Believe it or not, they actually do produce goods and services outside of the government sphere! It may be a bit heavy on the government sector, but seems fairly diverse:
* Real Estate, Rental and Leasing - $2,667 million (11.6%)
* Durable goods manufacturing - $2,210 million (9.6%)
* Health Care - $2,170 million (9.4%)
* Retail trade - $1,934 million (8.4%)
* Finance and Insurance - $1,369 million (5.9%)
* Professional and technical services - $1,276 million (5.5%)
* Construction - $1,258 million (5.5%)
* Wholesale trade - $1,175 million (5.1%)
* Accommodations and Food Services - $1,035 million (4.5%)
* Information - $958 million (4.2%)
* Non-durable goods manufacturing - $711 million (3.1%)
* Other Services - $563 million (2.4%)
* Utilities - $553 million (2.4%)
* Transportation and Warehousing - $484 million (2.1%)
* Educational Services - $478 million (2.1%)
* Administrative and Waste Services - $436 million (1.9%)
* Agriculture, forestry, fishing, and hunting - $375 million (1.6%)
* Arts, Entertainment, and Recreation - $194 million (.8%)
* Mining - $100 million (.4%)
* Management of Companies - $35 million (.2%)
from Wikipedia
And I think they would be more populous than about 70 other existing countries or territories. I think anything larger than Monaco has a shot at independent existence. Not that I am pushing for Vermont (or any other state) to break away.
UncleBeer
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No. Most recent US census places Vermont's population at 623,908. This puts Vermont in 160th place (out of 206 countries) in your hypothetical "many" comparison. http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/peo_p ... population
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My list of 206 is already over-generous. Since when can Greenland (a Danish province) or Puerto Rico (a US commonwealth) be considered autonomous or sovereign? A fair counting of independent countries shakes out closer to 192.
And now this thread has devolved into Aspie minutiae
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