I'm fed up....

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Hateful ideology? The only person here who has a hateful ideology is you, RobertN. I'm not going to beat around the bush and be an apologist like the others here. Quite frankly, you dont deserve that since you've been so disrespectful and such an as*hole to everyone around here. You belittle those you hate, along with those that are are technically on your side.

You are so blind in your hatred that you fail to realize that half of the "pro-american replies" (those with flag wavings or some country song about America) come out from people mocking to get a rise out of you. I mean, come on RobertN, its not that hard to figure out.

I resent being called arrogant. And I resent being told that I deserve to die over something out of my control! Let me tell you something RobertN. I was born in Romania and for 6 years of my life I lived under ceausescu. My mother and father died under that bastard's rule. I consider myself extremely lucky that 2 kind and caring Americans adopted my sister and I to give us another chance. I have met many other people like my American mother and father and they deserve just as much respect! These arnt the evil, arrogant, self-serving people that you keep referring them to be.

If you want to know what America is really like, stop looking at inane polls and fly your ass over here to see for yourself. You'll find very much a mixed bag of people who sometimes fit your descriptions, and sometimes not. Most of us do not fit under any one catagory that you organize us under. Polls mean jack s**t, RobertN. Anyone who's takin' economics class will attest to it. They are often times schewed by people who have just as much as an agenda. If you live your life keeping tabs on polls then you will never get a clear answer, and you will never accomplish anything.

Here, Here, and Amen!

I told you i was looking forward to reading more from you.

I am sorry about your parents.

Then we had better carry on without him.

And FYI, i never directly asked for sanctions against RobertN. I felt i was doing a decent job of holding him accountable for his words.

RobertN was the one who called attention to hisself with his little Wah, Wah, act.
His banning shows that the moderators are consistent in their rulings. I also received my first official warning.

I am sorry to have wasted the time of some very good, hardworking people (moderators){smooch}. But RobertN begged the question to be raised.
By his words, by his signature (which read the biggot will be reprimanded), which is now defunct. and by his inability to take what he gives.

It is unfair of me to continue, since he has (lucky) 13 days in which he cannot respond.

To be fair i will dig this off the third page in two weeks time.

ASCAN, do not stop being who you are from fear of retribution. keep up the good fight. just caution, when it is time to walk away. And know that if sometimes you may have not technically won, that you have, yoy were able to voice your opinion. Your opinion is a very valuable source. wink, wink:]

I'm disappointed that RobertN was banned. He is going to feel vindicated for what he percieves is a biased attack on him. I guess I am a firm believer in, "you have a right to say whatever you want to say, no matter how much I disagree with it."

Just a reminder and a clarification: In debates, everyone has a right to say and fight for his or her opinion, but personal attacks are unacceptable. Opinions are good; attacks are bad.

I do not see how this thread is a reason to ban Robertn. Can I ask why he was banned?
(Or is this a joke?)

i believe that is inflammatory words.

I also received an official warning, which i accept.

Vindication is not warranted, he knew that he had 2 warnings already.

Sometimes its better to accept your situation, walk away, and live to fight another day.

because i was warned also, he has no grounds to feel justified.

and
i also believe in the right to freedom of speech and expression, absolutely.

but i am a visitor in someone elses home, for which they pay the mortgage.

I would have no right taking a crap in the middle on their den, as a form of expression.

He who pays the bills makes the rules.

Sometimes I am glad I miss things.

I think the decision to ban RobertN was wrong. I've lost confidence in the moderators here because of this.

it's left me feeling very uncomfortable about posting here. I've seen what happened to RobertN and the goading and intimidation he got after every post he made where he tried to express a view. it's inevitable that someone would be driven to making personal attacks after such treatment. yet the forum rules favour the groups and cliques who get off on taunting individuals like that. it means they can stay on the right side of the fuzzy line of 'personal attacks' whilst provoking their victim to cross it, making sure it is the victim who is punished.

it's no different to the playground bullying many of us got at school, how it was us who got into trouble while the bullies got away with it, and I am sickened that I see exactly the same thing happening here. I feel intimidated into silence (which again is exactly the same as how I felt at school), I haven't managed to make a serious post in a long time. anything more than a silly post in the game threads is too much of a risk in this environment, and now I don't even feel in the mood for making the game posts anymore.

Its just that you got it backwards.
RobertN was the one doing the goading.
His comments begged for a reply.

You cannot reasonably expect to lump a large group of people into a generalized category and expect those people not to defend themselves.
Also after two prior warnings i would assume that he would have backed off. But there he was everytime he had the chance. Whenever the topic was even margionally close he would begin his campaign of goading. Even when he was not specifically named.

And the redundancy by which he would stand by an ignoratnt position was further flamming. By ignorant position and i clarify, he was makeing statement, which are hurtful to honest people. He was lumping many people into a generalized narrow point of view. A point of view, as it happens, he had no idea about.
Imagine if you went to a KKK rally and heard what they had to say. Without even knowing the people for which their venom is directed. You naive to those people form an opinion, based wholly on someone elses words, then you go out and regurgitate what you have just been told. Those statements by you would then be statements based on ignorance.

By you offering your support for his cause, you then are offering support to those opinions. You have the opportunity to support your opinions. And i suspect you may, with better arguments based on reason.

It is the consistency be which he would make the statements, and clearly have little capacity for backing them up. That was why they were inflamatory. If had the ability to back up his generalized statements with fact, or even first hand knowledge then one could not consider them as inflammatory. they would then be opinions (which are welcome) backed either by first hand accounts or facts. He offered niether.

Do you have first hand knowledge about how this whole episode came to the point that it did. Have you given yourself the opportunity to read the back and forth dialogue. Do you fully know the history?

Even if your answer is no, your situation is different than RobertN's. because you are not flaming. You are simply standing UP for a cause. While RobertN solicited a campaign which brought others DOWN.

Respectfully
SB²

I admire a person who believes. Don't be afraid. Don't live in fear of retribution. If you do, then are you truly living?

i'm sorry that people feel uncomfortable about the decision - truly. it was made after lengthy discussion amongst the moderators. we have a policy that issues regarding individual members are not discussed in public, and so i have to say that the story isn't necessarily as simple as it may appear, and much goes on "behind the scenes".

there is a difference between censorship - in which case, this thread would have been removed - and allowing personal attacks or incitement, which are unacceptable on WP. members are never given warnings or banned without a lot of discussion, and each case is examined, and previous stuff taken into account, whether positive or negative.

obviously, i understand that it may look as though the mods are making arbitrary decisions, or are biased, or heavy handed, at times. the alternatives are to make everything public - which would compromise the dignity of members - or to do far less in what has been called "police work", which would lead to many members becoming alienated, feeling threatened, umpteen flame wars... you get the picture. as far as i am aware, no moderator here actually enjoys the more "police-y" jobs we have to do.

WP is set up as a support forum - as far as is possible - not as a flame forum. anything does not go here, for that reason.

i hope that makes things a little clearer.

Vivi
(as Admin)

This wasn't directed at me, but I'll add a comment:

You SB2, do not know the full history yourself, as you've only been here a matter of weeks. RobertN's views, and the way he transmits them, are well known to those who've been here a while. He's said a lot worse about me than he has about you Americans; but despite that, I wouldn't wish to see him banned. He's part of the furniture here.

I've read that robertN is being reinstated after a few weeks: that's good; I can see there is reason to that, and that the ruling elite could be justified in that course of action.

One other thing:



Bad analogy. The owner of this site purports it to be a "community". That would imply (to my way of thinking) that the members of that community actually make it such — the community cannot exist without us; we provided tangible input. Practically, and morally, that gives us a say in what happens — of course the practical aspects of that are a little tricky. Moreover, financial input from members has been requested, and has been given. Whose "home" is it?

I'm not suprised that he got suspended. I think the writing was on the wall there. This may come as a suprise to some people, but I do not wish to see RobertN permanently banned either. He may hate my guts, but the feeling is not mutual.

he's on aspietalk.co.uk whining about the ban.

I would imagine that he is raising hell about it wherever he goes.