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shrox
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07 Mar 2012, 8:45 pm

If you want the giant hand to reach down and feed you, then do you want the giant hand to reach down and stop evil?



wornlight
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07 Mar 2012, 8:45 pm

edit.



Last edited by wornlight on 08 Mar 2012, 9:07 am, edited 3 times in total.

abacacus
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07 Mar 2012, 8:47 pm

Alexender wrote:
Because lots of times scientists are very arrogant and find joy in disproving other peoples beliefs? I don't know, science isn't really demonized.


I'd find joy in finding evidence in supporting any truth. Why wouldn't I? I would have set out with an experiment and learned something new. I have helped further our understanding of the universe in some way shape or form.


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abacacus
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07 Mar 2012, 8:48 pm

shrox wrote:
If you want the giant hand to reach down and feed you, then do you want the giant hand to reach down and stop evil?

Uh... yes! What sane being WANTS people to starve, suffer natural disasters, get raped, etc?


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shrox
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07 Mar 2012, 8:57 pm

abacacus wrote:
shrox wrote:
If you want the giant hand to reach down and feed you, then do you want the giant hand to reach down and stop evil?

Uh... yes! What sane being WANTS people to starve, suffer natural disasters, get raped, etc?


So, if you want to break the law, you want something to control you and make you not do it.



abacacus
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07 Mar 2012, 8:59 pm

shrox wrote:
abacacus wrote:
shrox wrote:
If you want the giant hand to reach down and feed you, then do you want the giant hand to reach down and stop evil?

Uh... yes! What sane being WANTS people to starve, suffer natural disasters, get raped, etc?


So, if you want to break the law, you want something to control you and make you not do it.


For a being such as the christian god (who is acclaimed to have infinite power over everything) would it really be that difficult to just remove the urge to do such things from peoples minds?

To say nothing of easily an infinitely powerful being could stabilise our planets ecosystem and make much larger areas of land habitable to humans instead the measly sliver of the planets surface we can currently survive on.


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08 Mar 2012, 6:42 am

To play devil's advocate, what would the world look like if humans had no ability to think?

If this was case, there would be no science, there would be no technology, there would be no politics. In some ways the world would be better off - it would be a simpler life, but more humane.

It is not science that does harm, it is intelligence. False intelligence, rather than wisdom, that is ripping our world to shreds.

Factories polluting, the artificial engineering of anthrax, the creating of nuclear weapons, the depersonalization due to the internet, the dumbing down of the population due to television and media. All this s**t is out of hand.

Personally, I don't see what is so intrinsically good about science. Yes, it has done some good things, it has increased the lifespan of humans, but intrinsically, science is neither good or bad. But to ignore the evils that have come about due to science and technology and human "intelligence" is nothing more than naive.

End of rant.



Stargazer43
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08 Mar 2012, 12:17 pm

Quote:
If this was case, there would be no science, there would be no technology, there would be no politics. In some ways the world would be better off - it would be a simpler life, but more humane.


Would it? Life was pretty brutal several thousand years ago. Of course in some places it still is, but that has little to do with science or technology in my opinion.



shrox
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08 Mar 2012, 12:55 pm

abacacus wrote:
shrox wrote:
abacacus wrote:
shrox wrote:
If you want the giant hand to reach down and feed you, then do you want the giant hand to reach down and stop evil?

Uh... yes! What sane being WANTS people to starve, suffer natural disasters, get raped, etc?


So, if you want to break the law, you want something to control you and make you not do it.


For a being such as the christian god (who is acclaimed to have infinite power over everything) would it really be that difficult to just remove the urge to do such things from peoples minds?

To say nothing of easily an infinitely powerful being could stabilise our planets ecosystem and make much larger areas of land habitable to humans instead the measly sliver of the planets surface we can currently survive on.


That's what the other animals do. We think...too much.



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09 Mar 2012, 1:26 am

Fnord wrote:
Why is science demonized in people's minds? Not just in their minds, but in both secular and religious institutions?

I mean, the body of science doesn't start wars, cause famine, or create natural disasters. Nor does it raise taxes, foreclose on homes, or addict children to crack cocaine. It is the politicians, business people, nature, and criminals that do these things.

So why is science given such a bum rap?

Or why do they not believe in the existence of certain diseases? I think it's quite easy to answer. Because science is about logic rather than belief. Scientists discover the world. Maybe some people are scared that it will turn people from their faith. ^^ Some people don't want that. Religion has already lost some of its former value. Which is not a bad thing, in my opinion, as it will mean that people will actually use their minds and have authority over their own lives.


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Fnord
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09 Mar 2012, 1:33 am

TheHouseholdCat wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Why is science demonized in people's minds? Not just in their minds, but in both secular and religious institutions?

I mean, the body of science doesn't start wars, cause famine, or create natural disasters. Nor does it raise taxes, foreclose on homes, or addict children to crack cocaine. It is the politicians, business people, nature, and criminals that do these things.

So why is science given such a bum rap?

Or why do they not believe in the existence of certain diseases? I think it's quite easy to answer. Because science is about logic rather than belief. Scientists discover the world. Maybe some people are scared that it will turn people from their faith. ^^ Some people don't want that. Religion has already lost some of its former value. Which is not a bad thing, in my opinion, as it will mean that people will actually use their minds and have authority over their own lives.

No, science is about demonstrable evidence. Philosophy is about logic. Religion is about belief.

Religious people worship. Philosophical people speculate. Scientific people discover.



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09 Mar 2012, 1:34 am

heavenlyabyss wrote:
To play devil's advocate, what would the world look like if humans had no ability to think?

If this was case, there would be no science, there would be no technology, there would be no politics. In some ways the world would be better off - it would be a simpler life, but more humane.

It is not science that does harm, it is intelligence. False intelligence, rather than wisdom, that is ripping our world to shreds.

Factories polluting, the artificial engineering of anthrax, the creating of nuclear weapons, the depersonalization due to the internet, the dumbing down of the population due to television and media. All this sh** is out of hand.

Personally, I don't see what is so intrinsically good about science. Yes, it has done some good things, it has increased the lifespan of humans, but intrinsically, science is neither good or bad. But to ignore the evils that have come about due to science and technology and human "intelligence" is nothing more than naive.

End of rant.

We have to make a difference between science and people who take advantage of it. I would agree that science can also do a lot of harm, but I don't think the media has much to do with science. The media is just another representation of a system that is based on the principles of increasing money for a minority. The "media" exists so that those in power can get even more money. It's perverse.

I sometimes wonder if I should support computers and the internet, but then I couldn't be here talking about this. And, ironically, the internet is increasingly used to reach out to other people in the world. It has become an instrument for politics even... Which is why there's so much going on in the US at the moment. Those people who create these new laws about the internet and freedom of speech, etc. are simply scared that people will actually change things. The house of cards would be tumbling down. And they don't want that. It would mean they wouldn't be in control anymore.

So, science means that these things can be done, too.

Personally, what I like best about science is that it enables us to think outside of our own little world.


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09 Mar 2012, 1:36 am

Fnord wrote:
No, science is about demonstrable evidence. Philosophy is about logic. Religion is about belief.

Religious people worship. Philosophical people speculate. Scientific people discover.

But then there is a lot of Philosophy in science, too. It would show that these things cannot always be clearly separated.


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09 Mar 2012, 9:27 am

Atheistic science denies the fundamental truth of Christ's awesome, redeeming love, the only cure for such illnesses as "teh ghey." Science wants to lead man astray; it is the devil's handiwork.



shrox
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09 Mar 2012, 12:32 pm

Quakers are scientists. We believe all the temporal is explainable and knowable.



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09 Mar 2012, 1:08 pm

NeantHumain wrote:
Atheistic science denies the fundamental truth of Christ's awesome, redeeming love, the only cure for such illnesses as "teh ghey." Science wants to lead man astray; it is the devil's handiwork.

:lmao:

Good one!

You almost had me going there, for a second!

:lol: