Page 2 of 2 [ 28 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 18 Jun 2008
Gender: Female
Posts: 12,265

04 Dec 2014, 3:21 am

If you put it that way, I'd say what humans have is species selection. Humans help other humans survive and members of certain other domesticated species because it benefits our species.



trollcatman
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 21 Dec 2012
Age: 44
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,919

04 Dec 2014, 3:44 am

I was reading the wiki article on kin selection ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kin_selection ) and it says that Darwin even wrote about it in his book. He noticed the sterile worker bees.
Apparently is also another concept called group selection which is slightly different.
If any aliens manage to travel to earth they are probably social creatures of some sort. At that point they will be far more advanced than we are, so all we can do is hope they are friendly. Or maybe they will just keep us alive to study us. Or... maybe they already are and we don't know it yet?



Dillogic
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 24 Nov 2011
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,339

04 Dec 2014, 7:04 am

It's impossible to apply our subjective thoughts on how a species alien to our planet would behave.

We'd be ants to whomever got here though, that's for certain.



progaspie
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 22 Jul 2011
Age: 71
Gender: Male
Posts: 673
Location: Australia

04 Dec 2014, 7:57 am

People are mentioning Darwin here, but a more apt theory to apply here is Chaos theory. After the initial disorder created by humans encountering an alien species for the first time, there would have to be some sort of accommodation between the two species to restore order. This would entail one of the species wiping the other out, or the two species learning to live with each other.



ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 18 Jun 2008
Gender: Female
Posts: 12,265

04 Dec 2014, 1:58 pm

Dillogic wrote:
It's impossible to apply our subjective thoughts on how a species alien to our planet would behave.

We'd be ants to whomever got here though, that's for certain.



I have a difficult time believing they would think of us as ants. If anything, they would just see us as backwards but if they observed us, they would recognize we are striving unless they are so far gone they have completely lost that side of themselves and it is meaningless to them. In that case they might think of us as ants.



Rollo
Raven
Raven

User avatar

Joined: 26 Mar 2014
Age: 43
Gender: Male
Posts: 119

04 Dec 2014, 2:51 pm

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
slenkar wrote:
we exploit a lot of other species already, I dont see why someone who saw us in the same way we see cows wouldnt treat us in the same way



When we think of aliens landing on our planet the immediate thought isn't we should eat them for dinner so if they possess the advanced skills needed to navigate space, they would have grown past the desire to eat species they see as having potential.


Maybe. Maybe not.
Have you ever seen the film The Day The Earth Stood Still? Without wishing to give too much away, one might say it's about aliens who turn against humans because of our capacity for invention and technology etc.



Magneto
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 12 Jun 2009
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,086
Location: Blighty

04 Dec 2014, 3:15 pm

I don't know where people get this notion that you need to be Sufficient Advanced in order to achieve starflight. We already have some near-term options on the table, ranging from beamed propulsion to nuclear pulse propulsion. Both of these could get us to 5-10% of the speed of light, with a magsail for slowing down. To a species with a lifespan measured in millenia (which is entirely plausible), that might be sufficient, but they could always go faster, or use hibernation. A 200ly journey could be a minor thing for them, and their colonisation wave could quickly reach Terra from the other side of the galaxy, a few million years at most.

Why is it that when people think "interstellar travel", they typically think "faster than light"?



superpentil
Sea Gull
Sea Gull

User avatar

Joined: 22 Sep 2014
Gender: Female
Posts: 203

04 Dec 2014, 5:12 pm

Quote:
I don't know where people get this notion that you need to be Sufficient Advanced in order to achieve starflight. We already have some near-term options on the table, ranging from beamed propulsion to nuclear pulse propulsion. Both of these could get us to 5-10% of the speed of light, with a magsail for slowing down. To a species with a lifespan measured in millennia (which is entirely plausible), that might be sufficient, but they could always go faster, or use hibernation. A 200ly journey could be a minor thing for them, and their colonization wave could quickly reach Terra from the other side of the galaxy, a few million years at most.

Why is it that when people think "interstellar travel", they typically think "faster than light"?


Pragmatism. Space is vast and virtually has no end. It would take a long long time and while in the grand scheme of things you'd be correct, in the short order of things like exploration or war, time is of the essence. Unless of course the aliens were smug, but I would not expect a smug view from a militaristic society of beings. I could see it from some non-militaristic ones, but those aren't ones we'd need to worry about.

For example humans live quite a while, though we're not immortal. We live for decades when nature I guess takes it's course. However, it's quite expendable to journey like people do. If things didn't need be done faster, cars, flight, and other technologies that accommodate (including animal husbandry) wouldn't have been utilized they way they were.



Magneto
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 12 Jun 2009
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,086
Location: Blighty

04 Dec 2014, 5:30 pm

Oh, so you don't mean we'd be primitive compared to everyone who might have interstellar travel, only primitive to ones that would want to wipe us out... :?



Dillogic
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 24 Nov 2011
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,339

05 Dec 2014, 5:37 am

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
I have a difficult time believing they would think of us as ants.


The furthest we've put a boot is the moon.

Going to another star is no less impressive than an ant would think of the moon trip.



ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 18 Jun 2008
Gender: Female
Posts: 12,265

06 Dec 2014, 1:25 pm

Dillogic wrote:

The furthest we've put a boot is the moon.

Going to another star is no less impressive than an ant would think of the moon trip.


They will be attracted by such small steps from man. This is what will cause them to take notice of us.



Dillogic
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 24 Nov 2011
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,339

07 Dec 2014, 4:03 am

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
They will be attracted by such small steps from man. This is what will cause them to take notice of us.


That'd be impossible to say.

An alien's motivation could be entirely out of hunger (planet eating, for example). Or it could be something existential. The possibilities are only limited by our own thoughts, which aliens aren't limited to; so who knows.