Why is the US letting so many people over the border?

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funeralxempire
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16 Mar 2021, 1:06 pm

ironpony wrote:

Those are good points, thanks. So the US doesn't have a border crisis then, and it's just propaganda?

Not quite, but sorta. There's certainly an issue, but I believe portraying it as a crisis isn't accurate. Among things it's not as though it's a new issue; heavy migration to the US border has been occurring at least since George W Bush was in office. Dubya, Obama, Trump and Biden have all taken different approaches but the issue never ceased to exist.

ironpony
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16 Mar 2021, 10:39 pm

Oh okay I see. Is Fox News correct in the statement that a lot more people are being let over the border now, and allowed to go where they want, compared to last year?

Pepe
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16 Mar 2021, 11:48 pm

ironpony wrote:

Well it seems that when it comes to the news involving white house decisions, often seems to have good news about the white house where as Fox News has bad news more often, so I feel that the one that has bad news is probably the more accurate one on the given subject maybe?

Left-wing outlets will favour the left.
Right-wing outlets will favour the right.
Impartiality is dead and buried.
Nothing new.

Nothing to see here.
Move along people.

Pepe
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16 Mar 2021, 11:50 pm

ironpony wrote:

shlaifu wrote:

ironpony wrote:

Yes they report on a lot of negative things they do, but since democrats are in the white house, I always prefer hearing on bad news in the white house. If republicans were in the white house, than I guess CNN would do better reporting on the bad news? It seems that way last year.

So I guess when deciding on which news source is better on white house reporting, it depends on who is in the white house?

No. All you are doing is setting yourself up to get everything that's going on presented by someone who thinks it's a catastrophe.

I suggest reading books about the complexities of the modern world, and look for as mildly biased news sources as you can find.
Yes, they are all biased, but they're not all biased to the same extent. And then there's crazy propaganda like FOX NEWS and Breitbart and RP. Their job in the information war is to confuse and create emotional reactions, not to inform, not even to inform with bias.

Noam Chomsky wrote an awful lot about the news media. The recommendation I took away from it was to read newspapers that are providing information to rich and powerful people, like the financial times.
You'll find, an awful lot of things most news outlets and especially propaganda chaneels are concerned with aren't even talked about by the financial times. Is it because rich people don't need to know about the "massive influx of immigrants" - or is that because the influx of immigrants isn't as "massive" and/or problematic as FOX NEWS pretends it is?

You will also find there are a lot of news on FT that don't show up on FOX. But who do you think is more likely to ignore really important things, FT, the newspaper of the rulers of the world, or FOX, the tv channel that occasionally veers into QAnon territory?

Oh okay. I am not sure if Fox veers into QAnon or not, they didn't do anything for me to suspect that. I can't watch CNN a lot because they often don't seem to talk about events, so much as get into arguments with each other over race, and gender, and it feels scripted and fake, and gets on my nerves sometimes. Fox News doesn't have near as much in house fighting, but I do acknowledge that they seem to leave things out of their stories.

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16 Mar 2021, 11:53 pm

ironpony wrote:

Those are good points, thanks. So the US doesn't have a border crisis then, and it's just propaganda?

America is being 'flooded' with unaccompanied children, and it is getting worse, now that "The Coyotes' are spruiking the idea that the Democrats are soft on border control.

The same thing happened here in Australia with 'The Boat People'.

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16 Mar 2021, 11:54 pm

Oh okay, I see. But if they are criticizing the government for being soft on border control, how does that make it worse? If the government is being criticized then wouldn't they more likely up their game on the border control?

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17 Mar 2021, 12:00 am

ironpony wrote:

It depends on the politics of the day.

Mr Reynholm
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17 Mar 2021, 9:53 am

Lots of constituents for the political elite to exploit. Thats why the border is wide open.

ironpony
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17 Mar 2021, 9:57 am

Well how would they exploit them?

funeralxempire
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17 Mar 2021, 10:18 am

ironpony wrote:

Well how would they exploit them?

When people enter illegally or overstay visas they can be deported if caught. This means their employers, landlords, etc can mistreat them and threaten to expose their status if they don't cooperate.

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17 Mar 2021, 10:21 am

So Biden is allowing more immigrants come in than usual because he wants landlords to get more perks, when it comes to people obeying them? But also, I thought that immigrants wanted to come to America to escape being under control from authority more so. If they are being blackmailed for deportation, than is life really an improvement for them coming here? Also landlords cannot rat out illegally immigrants who are living under them, without ratting themselves out since the landlords would be guilty of harboring illegal immigrants. So wouldn't the landlords just be ratting themselves out in the process?

funeralxempire
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17 Mar 2021, 10:32 am

ironpony wrote:

So Biden is allowing more immigrants come in than usual because he wants landlords to get more perks, when it comes to people obeying them?

That's both inaccurate and an oversimplification.

It's not exclusively Biden's issue considering the issue predates him and no president would be able to solve it on their own. Biden reversing Trump's failed attempts at stricter enforcement likely is just politics, just like Trump reversing things Obama did. Biden is just appeasing people who want to see Trump's policies ended.

Allowing people to enter and apply as refugees shouldn't contribute to undocumented workers being exploited. Refugees are documented and can't be exploited in the way I described. Making it easier for people to have some sort of immigration status will reduce the problem of undocumented workers being exploited.

Generally speaking some Democrats are the ones who favour allowing people to legally immigrate.

Meanwhile the Republicans have been split between a nationalist bloc who don't want any immigration, legal or otherwise and a pro-business bloc that doesn't care if the border is enforced well but don't want anyone who gets in to actually have any rights v. their employer.

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17 Mar 2021, 1:02 pm

funeralxempire wrote:

ironpony wrote:

Well how would they exploit them?

When people enter illegally or overstay visas they can be deported if caught. This means their employers, landlords, etc can mistreat them and threaten to expose their status if they don't cooperate.

I believe statistically that most of the people who overstay their visas are Canadians and Europeans, but we dont hear that statistic because usually "white" and it doesnt foment the "durty brown people" narrative so popular with racist propaganda outlets and the politicians that gain power from discontent

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17 Mar 2021, 1:05 pm

There is also this viewpoint: that BP is manufacturing a "crisis" intentionally.

From my experiences with US BP, i would not be surprised at all, but that is admittedly anecdotal

https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/bo ... 18116.html

kraftiekortie
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17 Mar 2021, 1:08 pm

Bottom line is:

There are 4,000 or so unaccompanied children living under prison-like conditions. We have to do something about that. They don't deserve to live under these conditions; they didn't commit a crime.

This has nothing to do with liberalism, conservatism, Democratic, Republican, whatever. It's a manner of being humanitarian.

People want to come to the United States to escape their situations in their own countries.

What would you do if you were a Salvadorean who's been threatened with death by a drug cartel? And can't obtain employment? And can't feed your family? Look at it from their viewpoints, too.

Sinister Biscuit
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17 Mar 2021, 1:17 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:

...snip
This has nothing to do with liberalism, conservatism, Democratic, Republican, whatever. It's a manner of being humanitarian.
...snip

That seems so un American to avoid politicising a current event

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