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I wish people would stop demonizing vaping...

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MaxE
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19 Dec 2021, 1:50 pm

Fnord wrote:
Any substance as addictive as nicotine should be avoided altogether.

What about caffeine? I used to smoke but had little trouble giving it up. When I've tried giving up caffeine voluntarilytemporarily, I have gotten the distinct impression that I would be very hard-pressed to give it up permanently.


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19 Dec 2021, 3:07 pm

ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
Nothing is burned, there's no lingering smell, you can vape anytime, anywhere, without notice as long as no one sees you.

Indeed, as most schoolboys find out very quickly, there's no such thing as effective stealth-smoking. And I suspect that the feasibility of stealth-vaping is one of the reasons why vaping is frowned upon. Then there's this strange theory that vaping THC is a major cause of lethal lung damage. For all I know there could be some truth in it, but I can see why they might have made it up, and it does seem a tad strange, considering that people have smoked reefers for decades without coming to much harm. Big Brother gets angry when he can't watch you.



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19 Dec 2021, 4:41 pm

It’s safer when driving, no fumbling for lighter or cigarette pack and no burn holes in upholstery.
Definitely safer for bedridden people who want a nicotine fix and tend to fall asleep with a cig in hand.


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ToughDiamond
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19 Dec 2021, 6:17 pm

^ Yes. Nicotine gum is even less of a fire risk, but I suspect it's possible to fall asleep and choke on that. I've heard people express concern about vaping pens exploding, and they probably can, but so can a lot of devices that use lithium batteries, yet very few people advocate banning smartphones. It seems to me that the risks associated with vaping are marginal (so far, at any rate), and we accept all kinds of other things in our lives without half the fuss.



SabbraCadabra
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19 Dec 2021, 10:04 pm

ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
...there's no lingering smell...

That's not true ;) My brother's house smells like a salted caramel factory (or whatever flavor he's into at the time).

ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
Smokers using "cigarette break" as an excuse to disappear.

None of these are a problem with vaping...

??
I don't know of any place around here that lets you vape indoors, all of my co-workers who vaped still had to slip outside to get their fix.

There was one guy who snuck chew inside the building though, that was super gross. He'd just spit it in the garbage can.


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ToughDiamond
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19 Dec 2021, 10:48 pm

SabbraCadabra wrote:
I don't know of any place around here that lets you vape indoors, all of my co-workers who vaped still had to slip outside to get their fix.

There was one guy who snuck chew inside the building though, that was super gross. He'd just spit it in the garbage can.

I must confess I took to stealth vaping at work. Not that I'm sure there was a specific rule against it. I didn't want to find out there was, so I just kept it very quiet. Nobody else was vaping, so the question never came up.



Texasmoneyman300
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20 Dec 2021, 4:08 am

Sweetleaf wrote:
ToughDiamond wrote:
SabbraCadabra wrote:
On one hand, I suppose it does get people to stop smoking tobacco, but they've only replaced one vice with another.

And all of the friends/family I know who vape, they modify theirs with hotter coils so they can get a lot more nicotine out of them, and they vape very, very frequently. It seems like that would negate any health benefits.

But it is nice to not have everyones' houses turn yellow and stink of stale old smoke. My brother always smelled terrible, and got the smell on everything he touched, and now he just smells like candy.


I think they'd have to try extremely hard to subject themselves to the same risk of death from vaping as they'd get from tobacco smoking. The worst I know of that can happen with vaping is lung damage, which can lead to death but it's happened in relatively few cases. Tobacco on the other hand carries a pretty high risk of lung cancer - one estimate I saw put the risk at 50% for a lifelong smoker. The case mortality rates for lung cancer are pretty high, and the treatments are horrific. And that's only one cause of smoking-related death. Of course it's asking for trouble to use untested modifications to a vaping device, but if somebody does that then the question is about the relative risk of irresponsible vaping versus smoking. The notion of responsible smoking is almost meaningless, but responsible vaping seems a more realistic concept. More research is probably needed to find out exactly how to control any risks. I'd like to see a range of medically certified vaping devices and liquids.


Well that is why I wish there wasn't a smear campaign against vaping, that probably prevent some of the better research that can be done. Also, its the cigarette industry that benefits the most from that, like the anti vaping stuff out isn't about health it's about Marlboro not liking the competition with their product, they want people to keep smoking the cancer sticks.

Most vape shops don't even sell cigarettes, its more common to see pipes or bongs for smoking weed in a vape shop than it is to see cigarettes in one. By now signs that say smoke and vape shop mean things to smoke weed out of and vaping supplies but no cigarettes at least around here.

Well I can see why Marlboro would want to kill compeition as cigarettes are very lucrative business model.I still remember when you could smoke cigars,pipes and cigarettes at IHOP indoors.I read that Phillip Morris International is going to stop selling Marlboro in the UK at some point soon.



naturalplastic
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20 Dec 2021, 5:28 am

How does "vaping" work exactly?

Instead of smoking tobacco leaves rolled up into a cylinder of paper, you ...put something into an electric device that vaporizes the something into vapor that you inhale like steam.

Isnt the stuff you feed into a vaping device also made from tobacco? And isnt that stuff made by the same tobacco companies that sell cigarettes?



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20 Dec 2021, 5:39 am

:cry:

naturalplastic wrote:
How does "vaping" work exactly?

Instead of smoking tobacco leaves rolled up into a cylinder of paper, you ...put something into an electric device that vaporizes the something into vapor that you inhale like steam.

Isnt the stuff you feed into a vaping device also made from tobacco? And isnt that stuff made by the same tobacco companies that sell cigarettes?

Juul is owned or was owned by Altria who is the maker for Marlboro in the states.Juul was Altria's attempt to diversify away from cigarettes into smokeless products.My family is in the industry so I stay on top of these things.Juul is a Altria and Phillip Morris product I think.Phillip Morris sells it outside the US.



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20 Dec 2021, 5:51 am

ToughDiamond wrote:
ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
Nothing is burned, there's no lingering smell, you can vape anytime, anywhere, without notice as long as no one sees you.

Indeed, as most schoolboys find out very quickly, there's no such thing as effective stealth-smoking. And I suspect that the feasibility of stealth-vaping is one of the reasons why vaping is frowned upon. Then there's this strange theory that vaping THC is a major cause of lethal lung damage. For all I know there could be some truth in it, but I can see why they might have made it up, and it does seem a tad strange, considering that people have smoked reefers for decades without coming to much harm. Big Brother gets angry when he can't watch you.


Oh that, turns out it wasn't even THC it was people getting hash oil carts on the street that had vitamin e liquid in them with the hash oil. Yeah, I'd say if you cannot confirm there is only flavors and either vegtable glycerin or propylene glycol along with the nicotine or thc probably don't vape it. I mean get a pack of vitamin e capsules and crack one open and you can probably see and feel why it would be a terrible idea to put that into a vaping product.


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20 Dec 2021, 6:10 am

naturalplastic wrote:
How does "vaping" work exactly?

Instead of smoking tobacco leaves rolled up into a cylinder of paper, you ...put something into an electric device that vaporizes the something into vapor that you inhale like steam.

Isnt the stuff you feed into a vaping device also made from tobacco? And isnt that stuff made by the same tobacco companies that sell cigarettes?


well yeah it heats the liquid usually with a cotton and metal coil, and that gives the vapor.

Also, well I mean I suppose it is, at least for now on a little google search I came across a mention of synthetic nicotine but apparently for now that is very costly to produce. But yeah I suppose I have not really looked into where the tobacco used for vape liquid comes from.

That said though malboro for instance owns some of the sort of vape devices you find at the gas station and so like for those it's probably just the same tobacco they put in their cigerettes. But outside of that not sure where or how they grow the tobacco or if it is like separate than the tobacco grown for cigarettes. So idk you do raise an interesting point but still I'd rather keep on vaping and give that up someday than go back to smoking cigarettes.


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20 Dec 2021, 7:16 am

Sweetleaf wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
How does "vaping" work exactly?

Instead of smoking tobacco leaves rolled up into a cylinder of paper, you ...put something into an electric device that vaporizes the something into vapor that you inhale like steam.

Isnt the stuff you feed into a vaping device also made from tobacco? And isnt that stuff made by the same tobacco companies that sell cigarettes?


well yeah it heats the liquid usually with a cotton and metal coil, and that gives the vapor.

Also, well I mean I suppose it is, at least for now on a little google search I came across a mention of synthetic nicotine but apparently for now that is very costly to produce. But yeah I suppose I have not really looked into where the tobacco used for vape liquid comes from.

That said though malboro for instance owns some of the sort of vape devices you find at the gas station and so like for those it's probably just the same tobacco they put in their cigerettes. But outside of that not sure where or how they grow the tobacco or if it is like separate than the tobacco grown for cigarettes. So idk you do raise an interesting point but still I'd rather keep on vaping and give that up someday than go back to smoking cigarettes.

Ya as someone in the industry I think Altria and Big Tobacco would prefer to be big into cigarettes if they coould but they have to go towards healthier options to make keep on raising those dividends to keep and retain investors.I see lots of smokes at gas station I go to.I would be certain that Altria would be 100 percent into cigarettes instead of vaping if there was not a need for healthier options.



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20 Dec 2021, 8:02 am

Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
How does "vaping" work exactly?

Instead of smoking tobacco leaves rolled up into a cylinder of paper, you ...put something into an electric device that vaporizes the something into vapor that you inhale like steam.

Isnt the stuff you feed into a vaping device also made from tobacco? And isnt that stuff made by the same tobacco companies that sell cigarettes?


well yeah it heats the liquid usually with a cotton and metal coil, and that gives the vapor.

Also, well I mean I suppose it is, at least for now on a little google search I came across a mention of synthetic nicotine but apparently for now that is very costly to produce. But yeah I suppose I have not really looked into where the tobacco used for vape liquid comes from.

That said though malboro for instance owns some of the sort of vape devices you find at the gas station and so like for those it's probably just the same tobacco they put in their cigerettes. But outside of that not sure where or how they grow the tobacco or if it is like separate than the tobacco grown for cigarettes. So idk you do raise an interesting point but still I'd rather keep on vaping and give that up someday than go back to smoking cigarettes.

Ya as someone in the industry I think Altria and Big Tobacco would prefer to be big into cigarettes if they coould but they have to go towards healthier options to make keep on raising those dividends to keep and retain investors.I see lots of smokes at gas station I go to.I would be certain that Altria would be 100 percent into cigarettes instead of vaping if there was not a need for healthier options.


Yes. Though tobacco is still big money it is also a slowly dying industry- in a WAY.
Or thats the impression I get from working in, and around, the retail industry.

Even back in the Nineties when I was a store clerk at a drugstore- they had to periodically remodel that cigarette pack display behind me (the place I would stand behind the front counter while manning cash register number one), because they were continually making more spaces for more brands (and new variations on existing brands). Regular, light, regular mentol, light menthol, light menthol 100s,etc. Because each cigarette brand became desperate to steal market share from the shrinking market. Now I work at an inventory company. As we completed the count on a Seven-Eleven store I overheard the client's district manager talking to the brown skinned immigrant store manager, and saying "in past years you could always rely on cigarette sales to pull you through figures like this, but nowadays with tobacco sales steadily shrinking you cant rely on tobacco anymore". Poor guy. Only a few years ago he could rely on nicotine addicted Americans to float him financially. But apparently now those cushy days of being "legal drug dealers" are over for convenience store operators.



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20 Dec 2021, 8:20 am

naturalplastic wrote:
Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
How does "vaping" work exactly?

Instead of smoking tobacco leaves rolled up into a cylinder of paper, you ...put something into an electric device that vaporizes the something into vapor that you inhale like steam.

Isnt the stuff you feed into a vaping device also made from tobacco? And isnt that stuff made by the same tobacco companies that sell cigarettes?


well yeah it heats the liquid usually with a cotton and metal coil, and that gives the vapor.

Also, well I mean I suppose it is, at least for now on a little google search I came across a mention of synthetic nicotine but apparently for now that is very costly to produce. But yeah I suppose I have not really looked into where the tobacco used for vape liquid comes from.

That said though malboro for instance owns some of the sort of vape devices you find at the gas station and so like for those it's probably just the same tobacco they put in their cigerettes. But outside of that not sure where or how they grow the tobacco or if it is like separate than the tobacco grown for cigarettes. So idk you do raise an interesting point but still I'd rather keep on vaping and give that up someday than go back to smoking cigarettes.

Ya as someone in the industry I think Altria and Big Tobacco would prefer to be big into cigarettes if they coould but they have to go towards healthier options to make keep on raising those dividends to keep and retain investors.I see lots of smokes at gas station I go to.I would be certain that Altria would be 100 percent into cigarettes instead of vaping if there was not a need for healthier options.


Yes. Though tobacco is still big money it is also a slowly dying industry- in a WAY.
Or thats the impression I get from working in, and around, the retail industry.

Even back in the Nineties when I was a store clerk at a drugstore- they had to periodically remodel that cigarette pack display behind me (the place I would stand behind the front counter while manning cash register number one), because they were continually making more spaces for more brands (and new variations on existing brands). Regular, light, regular mentol, light menthol, light menthol 100s,etc. Because each cigarette brand became desperate to steal market share from the shrinking market. Now I work at an inventory company. As we completed the count on a Seven-Eleven store I overheard the client's district manager talking to the brown skinned immigrant store manager, and saying "in past years you could always rely on cigarette sales to pull you through figures like this, but nowadays with tobacco sales steadily shrinking you cant rely on tobacco anymore". Poor guy. Only a few years ago he could rely on nicotine addicted Americans to float him financially. But apparently now those cushy days of being "legal drug dealers" are over for convenience store operators.

I heard the gas station business is dying.I think a lot of it depends on location and various factors though.Maybe gas stations should diversigy their offerings and services like some have to stay in business.People buy lots of cigarettes where I live.One time i saw a person by 4 pack at a time in Oklahoma.I think the tobacco industry will always be around in form but I think eventually Altria wont be able to keep up their dividend.Walmart is the biggest seller of smokes so its kind of hard to compete with them for gas station tobacco business I would think.Maybe the gas station can diversify into more legal drugs like caffeine pills if they have not already.And they could really sell lots of CBD.



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20 Dec 2021, 8:46 am

Vaping, supposedly, was an alternative way of trying to stop smoking. Sort of like methadone for heroin.

It didn't seem to have turned out that way, actually....it turned into an alternative mode of smoking, instead.



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20 Dec 2021, 9:52 am

Whether it is tobacco, marijuana, or vaping chemicals, you are still inhaling concentrated crap into your lungs.