Good Genes: An Argument for Eugenics

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Doubtful

Is there too little known about the composition and function of genes?

I agree. That's the last thing society needs.

There's already too much hatred of disabled people already. We don't need to amplify it by any means. I thought that eugenics was already adopted by most people, though and I don't like the direction things are going in.

It is a finely tuned mechanism that is impossible to reproduce because it occurred to billions of completely random events.

We know what makes it up and many funations but it is reproducible unless there is a guse (and already existing genome). Even our own bodies get it wrong which is why people get cancer.

Even if it were even possible it would be stupidly expensive and require decades of training. Not to mention the ethical completions as they technically would not be human

The fun thing about the overview of this topic - we know that nature murders the weak and that's the fundamental structure from the ground up. Really it murders all of us in the end. It has no scruples or compulsions otherwise.

Our society is a layer of nature, and the compulsion - when the going gets tough - will always be (at least at a governmental level) to eliminate the infirmed.

Western civilization is really in a nutcracker on this one. It can live by its morals and have an increasingly larger class of people who can't live on their own or it can start tampering with genes or advising abortion in certain cases, which tends to disgust us based on our memory of how that was done not just in 1930/40's Germany but in the US in mental institutions, homes for the disabled, etc.. with involuntary sterilization. What will we do if our standards of living go from 1st world to 3rd world? I don't know, but I know this would be one of several aspects of our culture which would be horrifying to watch in the process of breaking/melting down.

The fixity of genes and the hopelessness of outcome that goes along with them seems to be one our greatest assurances of barbarism until we're able to find some way to resolve the permanence of how a person is born. Without that we'll likely be falling on the wrong side of center on this issue indefinitely.

The other thing - I really don't like the idea that it's hilarious or insane for a person with disability to talk about eugenics.

It reminds me of the episode of Pen Gilette's podcast where he chewed out Ben Affleck for suggesting that only rich people could vote against their best interest for a perceived greater good and that poor people were incapable of such intellection. Similarly there probably are a lot of people on the spectrum who really do believe things would have been better if they weren't born - for their own happiness, for the distribution of labor and funds to take care of them, or both. For all I know in their own case at least for their own happiness they could very well be right; I haven't lived everyone's life and I don't feel qualified to judge other people's evaluations of their existence.

Eugenics is crap...pure and simple.

I know, eh? Am I not supposed to think about something that would be relevant to my experience?
I think something that has been missed in this discussion is that there is a difference between the worth of a person and the worth of a potential person. If one had to choose between a foetus and a full-grown man, I think the choice would be clear; so the difference should be as well.

I wholeheartedly agree. It's the worst thing that's ever happened to mankind.

The trouble with it though - mankind didn't invent it insofar as it's an attempt of natural selection to reassert itself in an environment where it isn't happening in an efficient manner anymore. It's definitely a thing we have to struggle out of, and struggle out of *successfully* might I add otherwise we find ourselves lapsing back into it (as in the case of Fascism, Communism, or third world dictatorships) in the worst manner.

Where I might say I am along this spectrum of belief or persuasion - I'm really hoping for technology to bring us to a point of genetic liberation, ie. a time where we get to master our genome at first with medicine and after that being able to change ourselves epigenetically more at will.

I tend to see the fixity of genes as really the ultimate inequality and the source of the most of what one might consider grim necessities whether it's economic inequality, reproductive caste systems, inability of a person to be able to keep up with their environment, societies that need to be run on stigmas for the sake of forcing people to do what they can't do without damaging themselves (ie. functioning above level for the sake of a roof and three meals), etc.. The whole game of human hierarchy is largely needed because of permanent functional superiority of some members vs. relative inferiority of others. It keeps us locked in a place where real progress is extremely difficult.

how can anybody know what kind of world would result if genetic perfection were democratized? we humans have so much overconfidence in our ability to stay ahead of things. but chances are such a power [should it ever be developed] would NEVER be democratized. it IMHO will likely remain an option just for the wealthy. human nature always seems to gravitate to having a few elect groups.

Clear?

The fault is not ours for failing to be psychics who can read your mind.
The fault is yours for not being clear, and upfront.

A Black guy I worked with years ago years ago mentioned to me and another White coworker that "crime has gotten worse where I live.... since...a lot of Blacks have moved into my neighborhood...I am sorry to say...."as he rolled his eyes for a moment. That little "im sorry to say" and eye roll were the vital disclaimer needed to acknowledge the irony of what he was saying( that here you are seeing a Black guy complaining about Blacks). It was the equivalent of what you failed to do.

At the start of the thread you seemed to be saying "I wish there was a Hitler around who would exterminate me", but at the same time you seemed to UNAWARE that that was what you were saying.

And then after pulling your teeth we got you to state that you were indeed aware that you had an inborn disablity that would make you a target of Eugenics extermination. But then we all had to coax more stuff out of you before you actually explained what you're saying now: that you didnt want a dictator to kill you- you just meant that ....you wish you had been aborted before you were born...I suppose. You are STILL being rather coy, and ambiguous as to what exactly you're talking about. And you're still blaming us for your own ambiguity.

Also if this thread of yours is really just a rant about how aspergers has made life hard for you then you should have taken it to the Haven, and not here to the PPR forum.

That's not what I said. Have you read this thread?


How am I blaming anyone?


Again, I think you should read the thread again. You seem to be reading a lot into my motives.

And the superior normalize themselves by saying that anyone could do it if they try, (which is total b.s.) Leaving the inferior to blame themselves for not trying hard enough and then to try even harder to hide what they are. All the time knowing that the playing field is not equal. As if belief trumps reality.