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'Right to work' kills, those who pass such are murderers

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Jacoby
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14 Dec 2012, 5:02 pm

Giving people the freedom to join a union or not is such a punishment



Kraichgauer
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14 Dec 2012, 5:53 pm

Jacoby wrote:
Giving people the freedom to join a union or not is such a punishment


The "choice" not to join unions is actually a sly means of driving unions out of existence.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



Jacoby
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14 Dec 2012, 6:10 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
Giving people the freedom to join a union or not is such a punishment


The "choice" not to join unions is actually a sly means of driving unions out of existence.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


Unions that don't truly represent the interests of their workers. If they did then they will have no problem collecting dues voluntarily. Unions still exist in RTW states, now they are accountable to their membership.



Fnord
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14 Dec 2012, 6:33 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
The "choice" not to join unions is actually a sly means of driving unions out of existence.

The "choice" not to vote is actually a sly means of driving voters out of existence - so we should have mandatory voting.

The "choice" not to join the military is actually a sly means of driving military forces out of existence - so we should have mandatory military service.

The "choice" not to eat organic foods is actually a sly means of driving organic food producers out of existence - so we should have mandatory organic food use.

The "choice" not to have children is actually a sly means of driving people out of existence - so we should have mandatory childbirth.

Right?

:lol:



xenon13
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14 Dec 2012, 7:51 pm

Jacoby wrote:
Giving people the freedom to join a union or not is such a punishment


The punishment is the extra poverty and harsh working conditions that would follow such a policy. People must be punished for not winning these cutthroat competitions, they must be also kept at lash point at the workplace itself and trade unions get in the way of the boss wielding the cat o' nine tails.



xenon13
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14 Dec 2012, 7:54 pm

Fnord wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
The "choice" not to join unions is actually a sly means of driving unions out of existence.

The "choice" not to vote is actually a sly means of driving voters out of existence - so we should have mandatory voting.

The "choice" not to join the military is actually a sly means of driving military forces out of existence - so we should have mandatory military service.

The "choice" not to eat organic foods is actually a sly means of driving organic food producers out of existence - so we should have mandatory organic food use.

The "choice" not to have children is actually a sly means of driving people out of existence - so we should have mandatory childbirth.

Right?

:lol:


So-called Right to Work is about legalising freeloading - having people benefit from union contracts without paying union dues - and they surmise that such will in time cause the union to collapse. That's the plan. The result is no one would benefit from union contracts. I thought the Right frowned on freeloading as a matter of principles. Seems that this principle is secondary to more important ones to them, such as the mania for punishments.



ruveyn
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14 Dec 2012, 9:05 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
Giving people the freedom to join a union or not is such a punishment


The "choice" not to join unions is actually a sly means of driving unions out of existence.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


you have just won the gold in the Absurdity Olympics.

If few people wish to join unions, that is because unions are not useful to them. What do you propose. Forcing people to join unions so they won't disappear?

The choice not to buy an Edsel is a sly means of putting Edsels out of production.

ruveyn



Jacoby
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14 Dec 2012, 9:09 pm

xenon13 wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
Giving people the freedom to join a union or not is such a punishment


The punishment is the extra poverty and harsh working conditions that would follow such a policy. People must be punished for not winning these cutthroat competitions, they must be also kept at lash point at the workplace itself and trade unions get in the way of the boss wielding the cat o' nine tails.


Lower cost of living and lower unemployment. If workers feel they will benefit from union representation then they will pay their dues. Maybe these unions would be better served keeping their advocacy to issues actually pertinent to their industry instead of trying to influence electoral politics.



ruveyn
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14 Dec 2012, 9:31 pm

xenon13 wrote:

So-called Right to Work is about legalising freeloading - having people benefit from union contracts without paying union dues - and they surmise that such will in time cause the union to collapse. That's the plan. The result is no one would benefit from union contracts. I thought the Right frowned on freeloading as a matter of principles. Seems that this principle is secondary to more important ones to them, such as the mania for punishments.


Then the Unions should only be bargaining for their members.

The workers who do not belong to the union are not adding one penny of cost to the operation of the union.

There is nothing wrong with a windfall benefit.

ruveyn



Kraichgauer
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15 Dec 2012, 1:36 am

Fnord wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
The "choice" not to join unions is actually a sly means of driving unions out of existence.

The "choice" not to vote is actually a sly means of driving voters out of existence - so we should have mandatory voting.

The "choice" not to join the military is actually a sly means of driving military forces out of existence - so we should have mandatory military service.

The "choice" not to eat organic foods is actually a sly means of driving organic food producers out of existence - so we should have mandatory organic food use.

The "choice" not to have children is actually a sly means of driving people out of existence - so we should have mandatory childbirth.

Right?

:lol:


As a matter of fact, unions have become an endangered species in right to work states. And that was always the intent of right to work laws.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



Kraichgauer
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15 Dec 2012, 1:40 am

ruveyn wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
Giving people the freedom to join a union or not is such a punishment


The "choice" not to join unions is actually a sly means of driving unions out of existence.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


you have just won the gold in the Absurdity Olympics.

If few people wish to join unions, that is because unions are not useful to them. What do you propose. Forcing people to join unions so they won't disappear?

The choice not to buy an Edsel is a sly means of putting Edsels out of production.

ruveyn


It's not that people wouldn't want to join unions, but under right to work laws, businesses have been able to more easily break organized labor and fire union members. So actually, requiring employees to join the union is a means of survival.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



ruveyn
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15 Dec 2012, 8:25 am

Kraichgauer wrote:

It's not that people wouldn't want to join unions, but under right to work laws, businesses have been able to more easily break organized labor and fire union members. So actually, requiring employees to join the union is a means of survival.



-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


Then why do so few people in the private sector belong to unions?

Of course there is the government sector. There the Unions provide a way for government workers to rob the tax payers blind.

ruveyn



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15 Dec 2012, 3:40 pm

ruveyn wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:

It's not that people wouldn't want to join unions, but under right to work laws, businesses have been able to more easily break organized labor and fire union members. So actually, requiring employees to join the union is a means of survival.



-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


Then why do so few people in the private sector belong to unions?

Of course there is the government sector. There the Unions provide a way for government workers to rob the tax payers blind.

ruveyn


In a sense, unions have been a victim of their own success. Workers feel they have no need to pay union dues since they already had good wages and benefits. But as those gains by labor have been going by the wayside in recent decades, the unavailability of unions is a contributing factor. In order to keep success, you ought to stick with what had brought you that success.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer