Aspergers and the Church

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Well, I don't really mean this to be a debate per se, as in, like a debate about God's existence or similar sort of thread. I guess I want this thread to just ask if anyone else has gone through something or thought similar to me. So as such, if mods would like to move it out of this board to a general discussion or similar board, I'd prefer that, but if not it's OK.

Anyway, to make this short, I'm considering converting to Orthodoxy. To me it all sort of makes more sense, both in technical theological differences and practical ones. In the technical realms, Orthodoxy's view of Christ's atonement (Christus Victor) makes much more sense than the Protestant and Catholic theological theory of Satisfaction. That, and also CS Lewis, one of my favorite theologians had quite the Orthodox/Catholic streak in him. But really, my attraction wasn't quite so much the technical differences, those seem almost more icing on the cake, but my old church just was too social, and too based on "fellowship" (Christianese for mingling.) I feel like it got to the point of like, "hanging out" in the name of God? It just got to be too much, and it was part of my melt down this summer. Basically, it equated being a good Christian with a good social extrovert.

It seems like that sort of church model is good for someone who is as this board calls it, "NT" but it just was like, a rollercoaster for me. Not stable at all. I see this in some of my friends, they're really awesome, lapse, really awesome, lapse, and it goes in this cycle almost monthly. Also, one really sad thing I see, my pastor's own son doesn't go to his church and lives under his roof. My pastor's son, like me, actually is diagnosed NVLD. He used to go to church, then I'm assuming it got to be too much for him, and he stopped, and called himself agnostic. It is just sort of chaotic, the theology of Protestantism, which after reading of Orthodoxy, just seems like they're at best trying to reinvent the wheel, and then there's the almost overemphasis of people that I see.

So Orthodoxy on the other hand, I've been to two services so far. It's entirely a worship service, the "sermon" is like 15-20 minutes. The service is so much different, it's an entire worship service. I really like it. But in the social aspect, too, there's the whole tradition of monasticism. I mean, Orthodoxy has it's issues with evangelism, as in, it sort of doesn't evangelize very well at all anymore, but the church is at the same time more concerned with the authenticity of it's converts, not just getting tons of people in the door on Sundays. One guy at the church even told me "hey, if you're searching, you know, check out other churches and stuff, too, and just see." I mean, they were all reasonably nice to me and everything in coffee hour, but it wasn't like...suspiciously nice. Also, it's the general practice of the priests to take a couple months with people and have a big discussion or two before someone "converts" to Orthodoxy. They don't try to like, bait and switch evangelize. But the big thing too is, there's a lot of emphasis on inner peace, holiness, etc, they really do realize that you can't be an effective witness unless you yourself are working right. But like, there seems to be a bigger cultural thing, of, it seems introverts/Aspies/whatever are actually appreciated in Orthodoxy and Catholicism, and there's even institutions like monasticism to cultivate those gifts, whereas in Evangelical Protestantism, it seems those traits are looked down upon, or at best are just used when convenient for the church and rebuked as sinful when not.

Anyway, I guess the main point of my thread is, if you are/were a Christian, how was church for you? Any of the same sort of experiences I mentioned? Also, one thing I'm really interested in, has anyone else gone through a similar transition period as me, from Protestant to Orthodox, or to Catholicism? Both Orthodoxy and Catholicism seem to be much more suitable for people with Aspergers or similar, and I'm just wondering if anyone else has experience to support what I'm saying or not. Anyone got advice, too?

Thanks and God bless, and sorry if this thread seems sort of disorganized or just a random collection of thoughts, it's like 3AM and I should get to bed.

I have many good friends who are orthodox, paired with their indian background makes them very strict and anal about a great many things, especially when it comes to religion and tradition. Which is fine. Another Indian friend of mine has a psychotic disorder himself and has found solace in catholocism so I agree, I think there is some truth to your observation.

In Judaism, the three branches (orthodox, conservative, and reform) are all organs of the same organism, and the three play distinctive but inter-dependent roles in keeping a check on the other(not say daily, but over the course of Jewish History). The Orthodox uphold the religion in its more purer forms, the reform ask questions and push boundaries, and the conservative is the compromise between the two.

All I care about is an amazing service where the pastor or rabbi was able to tell me about how scripture applies and can better my life. If I'm with family or friends, I'll stay the entire service. If I'm visiting by myself, I'll most likely leave early.

I am a Catholic but I work with a lot of Protestants. In general, I like the music in evangelical churches but I feel far more socially comfortable in a Catholic Mass. I found evangelical youth groups almost impossible to deal with socially.

I am a Methodist I have worked with some Catholics in the past I have found youth group meetings at a baptist church to be stressful while at my Methodist church I feel more likely to socialize with my peers.

The only major concern is a bunch of meat-heads just saying "GOD DOESN'T EXIST!!!1", instead of trying to engage you in the conversation you would want.


To be fair, Satisfaction/Penal Substitution isn't a required belief of being a Protestant. I'm pretty sure it isn't required for Catholics either. However, I would agree with you on the philosophical issue, and the historical issue, simply because Satisfaction/Penal Sub is outright absurd and was not the dominant belief of the early church.


I don't understand your point. It is not equivalent to any technical theological issue. This isn't to say it is invalid as you're likely referring to valid points that you just haven't made explicit, but as expressed it isn't a technical issue.


It is reasonable to consider Protestant theology more chaotic. However, I think part of that is because Protestantism was in some sense are trying to promote method above organization. So, the Reformation was the view that the organizations of the past had theologically failed, and because of that failure, a renewed focus on proper method(which most Protestants at the time had viewed as the proper interpretation of the Holy Scripture) was needed. Protestants today are not necessarily as strict to Sola Scriptura, and a few Protestant groups will include other methodological planks at this point.

Frankly, there are some elements that are more easily expressed in Protestantism than other theological beliefs, they're apparently just not the ones you emphasize or consider valid. For instance, Soren Kierkegaard's philosophy is not a reinvention of the wheel but rather it's a Protestant development. There are other things including Calvinist presuppositional theology/apologetics, open theism(which is mostly a Protestant movement), Emergent Christianity(which, by being eclectic is pretty much de facto Protestant), etc. I'd actually say that "reinventing" is unfair UNLESS you have already declared Catholic/Orthodox beliefs correct.


Hard to say. I mean, in many ways you are right in the major tendencies, however, I would see many organizations as more flexible about it. I don't see monasticism as really an honoring of introversion though, if only because I'd believe most introverts also have desires for intimate sexual relations and families and all of that.


It was mostly alright. There was some social behavior, but I had friends.


Yes, I spent some time working with the BSU, and they are very evangelism oriented. I am not cut out for talking to random strangers....


I have not. I would not likely be tempted on the aesthetic level, and that makes some difference. Instead, I identified more with conservative Protestantism and some elements of Emergent Christianity. Of course now I am an atheist. We have the least social requirements.


I think it depends on the Aspie and the expression of those faiths. After all, some people will inevitably dig into scripture warring, and that's probably better served by Evangelical Protestant faiths. Others will have aversions to some of the more questionable doctrines, and be more keen on a more liberal faith. For instance, the perpetual virginity of Mary may be too much of a bullet for an aspie to swallow. An aspie might also never feel comfortable with Aquinas for whatever reason, or with Orthodox mysticism and instead desire a more analytical theology, or one based more upon modern philosophical movements.

I mean, I have AS, but I cannot see myself in a Catholic or Orthodox service ever, simply because I would not ever be able to fit into any of the theological tendencies of those groups by disposition.


Eh, it's better than a good half of the other threads, if not more of them.

It's a little more complex, but not much. There are the rare Reconstuctionist Jews, but that's a new offshoot and there are few people in it. It is significant enough where many people will mention it. However, yes, it is true that most Jews have good interrelations and admit each other as part of the same community.

I am not surprised. Denomination matters a lot. For instance, Presbyterians actually do tend to be more reserved than Baptists, and Baptists while potentially being very theological(not always as there are some anti-theological Baptists) also tend to be harder to deal with in just how they are.

I grew up babtist and hated it the judgement they put on me and that some said I was possessed for having AS which is wrong:x

I am happy being a methodist we contribute a lot to my community my church is quite popular with lower and middel class familys we do a lot of community work and help clean up the mess mother nature tends to live after a tornado hurricane ect.

People only look at the negitive about christians or religious people in general instead of the good some of us do.

it affirms godliness but it does not affirm God, and it does not affirm the chosen-ness of the Jewish People to spread ethical monotheism, so I don't consider it an authentic movement of Judaism. A movement, but not an authentic movement, just as there is Humanistic Judaism but that is just Secular Humanism with Jewish congregates. God is just as important as peoplehood, and God is not a part of those movements.

What I speaking more of is that the three branches I mentioned act as a counter-balance and it is dangerous for Judaism if one were to prevail, or if one was the only popular alternative available. The three need to coexist together as they evolve each other within reason, and if Reform were to exist in the absence of orthodox, or orthodox were to exist in the absence of reform, that is almost a gurantee the death of Judaism amongst a generation and drive people away from the faith.

I grew up in a church-going family and I didn't find a church that accepted me without strings until I was 25. It's an independent church that branched off from the Baptists. It's huge, but I fit in. It's in an upper class neighborhood, but doesn't shun other demographic groups. They have all kinds of support groups including mood disorders and substance abuse, which attracts a lot of ex-cons to the church and they don't have a problem with it. They even have special needs children's (~3-21) and adult ministries. What has impressed me most is that I wasn't alienated when some people started to figure out for themselves that I'm bipolar!

Good churches that will accept invisible disabilities exist, but unfortunately (for us and for the general state of Christianity) they are very hard to find.

Sounds like a good support system. I like that.

Yes, definitely. "Church", at least as I knew it, was a place where people patted themselves and/or each other on the back for "being right" or whatever, and then people with "problems" were essentially expected to "leave them at the door" and "join in" ...

... but "joining in" is something I have never been any good at doing unless I first understand what something is all about, and nobody there could ever seem to explain things very well at all. Like in Scripture, it seems, "They know not what they do."

I have never been involved with any organized "orthodoxy", as such, but I can definitely comprehend and appreciate what you are saying now that I have come to embrace the essence/principles of Torah.

My old church actually had "evangelical" in its name, yet in practice it wasn't evangelical at all. When I found out what actual evangelical churches were like, I knew immediately I could never attend a church like that.
Not all Protestant denominations are evangelical, and not all have laid-back, hanging-out type services. I think you should pick a faith based on your religious beliefs, and then find a church that operates in a way that fits your personality.

I went to a orthodox church for a few years. (HTOC in Boston). Honestly, I see no difference between a orthodox church and a protestant church when it comes to fellowship/socializing. The big difference to me is in the service. The orthodox service is more structured and liturgical. I see this as a matter of preference. I personally got very bored in the orthodox service. I prefer the protestant service.

Thats how my church is we have a special needs program that I was in when I was little

Hmmm...

Well, I was raised in a family of atheists. My grandfather actually was responsible for one of the first pieces of research in our country of indoctrination of the church. I rebelled a bit as a teenager though, and started attending a very modern Christian church for a while. I enjoyed it, as it didn't have the dreary atmosphere of some of the more traditional churches. However, I grew to not like the atmosphere. I didn't like the fact that everything was related to the bible, but certain crucial parts were omitted. I read it under my covers to see what it was all about, and was shocked at some of the scriptures. When I brought it up next mass I was treated as a demon for daring to question the word of god. I settled back into being agnostic, mainly because organised religion was too narrow minded for me. The people that went wanted me to behave to their social ideals, and I just couldn't. I had too know reasons why.