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leafplant
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27 Nov 2013, 12:03 pm

Who_Am_I wrote:
leafplant wrote:
Who_Am_I wrote:
leafplant wrote:
I have to say, my mind is really struggling with this concept - someone doesn't want to have children, but wants to have sex, so they think it's unfair that someone else refuses to cut into their body and mutilate them to the point of being unable to have children - rather than them abstaining from sex or practicing safe sex with option of morning after pill or even another, more commonly performed mutilation (abortion) instead?

I hasten to add - I don't have children & I knew early on that I didn't want to have them (much like OP).


Condoms fail.
The pill fails.
Can YOU think of a fail-safe form of contraception?
The pill makes me violently ill.

It's easy to sit there smugly going "well just keep your legs closed", when it's not you being told "either pop one out, then we'll spay you, or never have sex again".


I am not being smug at all. I don't see why you find it an unacceptable proposition. All actions have consequences.

What if you were asking for a medical procedure that would stop you from getting wet when you go out in the rain without you having to take an umbrella or a raincoat or a hat or any other form of protection - none of which are 100% proof?

Sex isn't basic human need unless it's for procreation. I don't understand why people behave like it's as important as food or something.


Getting wet in the rain won't ruin your life like unwanted children. That is a ridiculous comparison.

Procreation isn't a basic human need either; you can survive as an individual without breeding.
Sex is a major source of pleasure, and it's a major part of most relationships, and most people are not thinking "let's make a baby" every time they have sex. They do it for pleasure and to bond with their partner.

Also, your earlier comment about "mutilation to the point where you can't have children" makes it sound like they brutally stab your womb until your ovaries disintegrate. It's a surgery that's so simple it can be done on an outpatient, same-day basis.


But you make it sound like hysterectomy is some sort of minor procedure like removing a mole. Even abortion is an out patient procedure and we all know that can result in a lot of complications. Removing your uterus affects not only your ability to conceive and give birth but your whole hormonal profile. Plus people do change their minds. I can completely see why some medical professionals would choose not to perform the procedure on request. Having sex may be about bonding and pleasure but neither of those things are essential for survival of either individual or the species. When medical practitioners make regulations it is with the long term and big picture view, and individual cases are still given due consideration. If they are refusing to perform a procedure in a country where it's not even free to the patient, than I'd say they have a very good reason. It's because it's dangerous and un-reversible.

To an individual it may seem like having the option of having unprotected sex without worry of conception is worth taking that kind of risk, I guess they really must like sex then, because most people wouldn't go so far even when they know they don't want children.

Like I said in the beginning - I don't have children and don't want any and have not found myself pregnant at any point and I'm edging ever closer to menopause.



Who_Am_I
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27 Nov 2013, 9:11 pm

I see where you're coming from now.
I focused more on the "or alternatives" part, so I was thinking of getting one's tubes tied rather than hysterectomy.


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bearsandsyrup
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28 Nov 2013, 1:05 am

I agree with waiting until you're in your 20s, simply because you grow up SO much between 17 and 25. I'm almost 24 and I am a completely different person with completely different goals, motivations, and values than I was when I was 17. At 17, I didn't know if I ever wanted kids and I certainly didn't want to get married until I was around 30. Then I met the right person, got married right after I turned 21, and now we have a 2 year old daughter.

That said, after I have number two, my husband is getting snipped and I'm getting tied and cauterized. After seeing how much energy, time, and effort a child takes (not to mention money and other resources-- plus we're a military family, so moving around internationally with a large family can be a nightmare), we don't want more than two, ever.



Shebakoby
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29 Nov 2013, 5:40 am

I have noticed something interesting.

Many people who are absolutely dead certain they will never want kids, tend to either be autistic, or have autistic qualities to them (not diagnosed).

Usually it's the Neurotypicals that change their minds at some point. Whereas we autistic folk tend to hang onto an idea forever and almost never change it.

Someone needs to study this. If only to provide the rest of the world with "See, there ARE people who NEVER want kids, AND YOU SHOULD LISTEN TO THEM WHEN THEY SAY THEY WILL NOT CHANGE THEIR MINDS."

That said, by all means, birth control of some kind, tube tying if you can get it. Tube tying sorta renders hysterectomy moot, and hysterectomy is a major surgery. Like, seriously major. You're better off tying the tubes because at least that can be reversed, should you ever change your mind. (not saying you will, but saying that will appease those who are afraid you WILL change your mind).



muna
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23 Feb 2014, 2:04 am

It's a long way from you, but I think Lovejoy Surgicenter in Portland, OR, USA would do a tubal ligation for an 18 year old. They are awesome. I had mine done six years ago before I left Oregon. They offered me a next day appointment when I called, but I had something to do so I scheduled a week out. They were very professional and did a great job. I asked why they didn't require six months of counseling first like some places. They said they mostly do abortions, and when a woman is sure she doesn't want kids they believe her. I think was $2500 if you don't have insurance. It would be expensive, but is an option.



corvuscorax
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24 Feb 2014, 12:41 am

I would highly recommend getting a temporary option since your opinion can change. Also, I know this sounds ignorant, but I think it's a little strange that you're worried about passing on your condition as a primary reason why you don't want children. It's not that I'm underestimating your troubles, but it just seems like... well, that's your existence, that's a part of who you are, and there's no way in knowing that things will improve in the external world for you and a child.

I mean, I have this big thing against using that as a reason to not have children. I'm not someone who thinks you should exist solely for that reason or anything (quite the opposite), but it's just like... well, you don't know where they will be, what their life will be like, or even if they will have it or not. It's just... kind of a strange reason for me personally. You have every right to have that as a reason it's just... that's just me.

But yeah. Your opinion could change. You could realize that you definitely have something you're amazing at, or realize that it's not the end all be all, or just want to have kids. So a permanent solution at 17 is NOT a good idea. Wait until 25 like someone else said. Cuz you'll never know.


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