Rant: Topics on how great ASD people are bothers me

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What happened in those societies and which ones tried it?

well I learnt a bit about it while doing history on the cold war, I think Russia was communist, Cuba is still communist and also China. communism on paper is a good idea because its based on having equality for everyone, the idea was to have no one in poverty no one being treated differently in society, the problem is that some people are inherently greedy and anyone with power in the country is able to corrupt things so you end up with the government deciding that's its going to be a certain way for everyone, which is not always a good thing, also instead of businesses and industry everything is controlled by the state.

I don't really know the ins and outs about what happened to the communist countries but China is still managing and Cuba but communism is very much disliked by the American government and other democratic governments.

..except martial arts or a competitive sport are typically going to be good forms of exercise that keep people in shape, improve their health, fitness, focus and general overall well being. Video games? Not so much.

I made no comments about the greatness of your ASD. You made comments about being bothered by other autistic people saying they're great, so I pointed out this doesn't make you all that great either. It's okay for you to say these things but not for anyone to say them to you? How egotistical is that?

How is your commentary about "squandering lives" not insulting?



As someone who was classified as gifted due to my IQ scores, and who failed miserably at EQ, what's your point exactly? You seem to be tearing people down because you want some explanations from them that they aren't simply automatically providing. Perhaps they, like everyone else, don't need to be self-narrating zoo exhibits.



The current level cap in World of Warcraft (that's one word, there, at the end) is 85. The next expansion will bring it up to 90. No one is ever going to get to level 5000 in WoW because it will never exist.

You're entitled to your own opinion, but you're not entitled to your own facts. And "people playing video games are squandering their life" is not an actual fact. It's just judgment. Playing video games is one form of recreation that many people of all neurologies do. It's not a sign of a squandered life, it's a thing people do for entertainment, like anything else people do for entertaininment.

There are many reasons an autistic person will not be in a position to compete for those jobs. While you're sitting in judgment of autistic people - some of whom are statistically speaking going to be gifted - you seem to forget that autism is a disorder that presents with severe impairments in all areas of life. Being gifted is not a means to get out of impairments, although many people incorrectly believe that it is. Being gifted does not make me not disabled. And being disabled doesn't mean I've never done any work to demonstrate that I am gifted - although much of it falls into categories you might wrongly consider "squandering your life" because I used it for purposes other than "getting rich" and "being successful in business." Plus I play video games, which you have indicated significant animus toward.



Considering that I wrote that "gifted" is a category with certain criteria, and those criteria do not include having multiple degrees, then I do not see how you couple possibly conclude that I suggested anything of the sort. I have a lot of issues with the concept of "gifted" as something one can just apply to a person and then expect them to excel at everything. That's not what the real world is like. I was labeled as gifted and because of that label I was left to sink or swim in the education system, which is how I ended up with a GED and no high school diploma.

You also seem to be confusing issues of puritan worth ethic, with one's merit as a human being, and what "gifted" actually means with each other, producing an incoherent argument about successful immigrants, video games, and anger at autistic people for daring to say they might be good at something without proving it to your satisfaction.

Your argument is rubbish and seems to serve little more purpose than to say that autistic people shouldn't talk about how great they are or can be, and I think this makes you very much not a great person. It makes your argument rather mediocre. And if you can't cope with being told that you're not all that great or that your argument is mediocre, consider what you're saying to other people and how you'd feel if you were told you were squandering your life based on a minimal amount of information that person had about other people who are not you.

And my advice about autistic people doing something you disapprove of is to "get over it."

Last edited by Verdandi on 11 Nov 2013, 6:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

^^^^^^ x1000

Helping autistic people have opportunities is a good thing, and infinitely better than this thread's premise.

I think, however, that people have an extremely limited and capitalist definition of "productive activities." We need a broader definition that includes those who are not able to or find it very difficult to do these things, yet who still live worthwhile lives.

I'm the OP of the thread the OP of this thread is complaining about. I am not an "ASD supremacist". I was just asking people why they think it's a good thing to be an Aspie. I really hate being an Aspie. I would cure myself if I could. I was disappointed with the replies I got because no one gave me the answers I was looking for. Some of the replies were not serious and some of the replies were to vague.

I do not want to be treated like a "lower functioning NT person". This is why I hate telling people about my diagnosis. I was diagnosed at a young age and I've always had to deal with people treating me like I'm lower functioning. I'd rather die than deal with that BS. Sometimes I consider suicide just because of this. I don't think life is worth living if I have to be treated like I'm lower functioning.

Productive activity... to me, means doing anything more than nothing at all. Idealists would see it as 'what can I do to improve x, y, z' as "productive". I think the real issue here is, why and in what ways are people with autism LIMITED in pursuing even society's narrowminded view of productivity... what can we do to improve..... AAHAH Yeah, I guess I'm an idealist...

And quit bashing World of Warcraft...[OP] the game has made an entertainment company MILLIONS if not more, has been maintained and expanded for going on TEN years and currently has over 7 million subscribers. Now I find that to be an exemplar of productivity.

I sit here typing this wondering why we can't just be accommodated, everyone, no matter what difference they have.... what would it take?

I think that each person has their own definition of productive activity.

Mine is what I said, but also includes other things like reading books, drawing pictures, going for a walk, etc.

For me, playing computer games is not productive activity, so I don't do that unless it helps me do one of my productive activities.

Playing bejeweled blitz when I have screwed up my code ackshuly helps me figure out how I screwed up my code and fix it.

Last edited by btbnnyr on 11 Nov 2013, 8:00 pm, edited 2 times in total.

^^^^^

This is what I was trying to get at and probably explained poorly in my previous post.

Your exact words were when writing to me was that "my autism is not so great". Are you going to make stuff up every time you write? I did not take offense as it was meaningless to call "my autism not so great".



You are making stuff up again. I never said that. Where did I say that "autistic people are not so great"? Why would I say ASD people are not so great as that would contradict what I wrote initially that they can achieve "stratospheric levels of intelligence and success".



I said ASD people that play video games all the time. Your position is that playing video games all the time is not squandering your life ? Really ?? Because several other people that posted here did say it was a problem. I think you are defending a ridiculous position. I don't know why you would defend that unless you are very young, and play video games all the time.

I don't have a problem is ASD people want to play video games. I do challenge anyone playing video games all the time, and claiming "giftedness" or "high intelligence". I also think it is a disservice to these people to tell them that playing video games all the time is OK. Video games do no enhance intelligence or success.

There are numerous threads here of ASD people claiming to have unemployment problems. The last thing these people should be doing is playing video games all the time.




Finally, at last, here is something related to "giftedness". I finally got someone to say it. So you discount the EQ apparently. Wouldn't intelligence would be EQ + IQ = intelligence?

You are selectively using the results of what? A written test? And can you specify what particular traits of your ASD enabled your to score so well ? What is the score you need to cross the threshold into "giftedness"? I have gone several doctors concerning my ASD. I took the all day test where they show you the flashcards, and the audio recordings, and you replicate the drawings. Is this the test you refer to ?

This is what I questioned in the very first post. We have ASD people here claiming "giftedness" or "high intelligence" on these threads and no one will say how that was determined.




Ok. Playing video games all the time is OK. I get it. I fail to see how anyone who plays video games all the time matures to anything other than possible a low wage clerk at a gas station or such type of occupation, and definitely would never be confused with someone "gifted". However, that is just my opinion and most likely the opinion of 99% of the world's population. However, for the sake of keeping a purely logical argument clean of judgemental statements then I am required to say that playing video games all the time is OK.




Please state what you do to be labeled "gifted" ? It must be more than just a label?




What do you mean ? Above you said your "giftedness" is based on IQ?? 20% of NT would score very high on an IQ test. Doesn't that mean 20% of NT are "gifted" if they scored above the threshold on an IQ test ? Now "giftedness" is not based on IQ?



I never made an argument. It is you that consistently fails to define "giftedness" and yet you label yourself "gifteded". I am thinking it is a made up label that is used as defense mechanism to make people feel better (as was stated earlier by someone else)? You have to be able to define it. You logic is all over the place. You just keep arguing and never explaining and your arguments keep making stuff up about what I said.

Last edited by LoveNotHate on 11 Nov 2013, 10:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

If you're going to make claims about exact words, then you should actually fact check yourself before doing so:



That's what I wrote. You can go back and look yourself.

I'm done.

Here is what your wrote ...

Verdandi wrote:

After reading this paragraph, I think I've decided that you're not so great as autistic people go.
Your argument is downright mediocre

I told you I was not offended. Yet you endlessly deny saying, "you're not so great as autistic people go". That is an silly, stupid, offensive thing to say to someone. But according to you, you never said it.



Thank goodness.

I simply ask how these ASD people are supposedly "gifted" and "high intelligence" determine their "giftedness" and "high intelligence" since they don't say.

You claim to be "gifted", and after all these posts you cannot answer that simple question.

I seriously fail to see how you can possibly be "gifted" if you cannot answer the simple question of how you determined you are gifted. Unless it is like the Matrix, where the Oracle tells Neo something like, "no one can tell you are the One, you just know it".

If it is made-up it is OK. If it is spiritual feeling i.e., "I feel gifted" then it is OK. I am just trying to figure it out. I have an ASD. I work around the most brilliant people that come from foreign cultures where education is stressed. I don't feel gifted. These people don't claim to be gifted. Or maybe "giftedness" is relative. If I work around less intelligent people, then I am gifted.

You answer to the question of "how is your giftedness determined", is to say something about "fitting into NT society". I never asked about NT society and don't know why that is a possible answer.

In school, gifted children are usually identified on basis of scores on tests specifically made to identify gifted children into gifted education programs with cutoff like top scoring 2% or score 130 on IQ test like wechsler or stanford-binet.

This is rather restrictive definition, in my opinion, as there are people who are gifted in specific areas but not scoring so high overall on these tests, but teachers may also nominate these children into gifted programs.

I like this conception of giftedness bester than just IQ scores:


Here is article by originator of this idear: LINK

This model does not require super high IQ score, but emphasizes importance of creativity (not necessarily high in super high IQ people) and task commitment (verry merry berry important for developing intellectual abilities in chosen field and ackshuly pursuing whatever the person wants to pursue).

Task commitment can be impaired due to executive dysfunction and that should perhaps be considered when judging what someone is potentially capable of.

Or rather, using that as a criteria to exclude someone from the category would be sort of like excluding an autistic person because of how autism and creativity intersect (that is, less likely to be spontaneously creative, but not necessarily lacking creativity).

Were I not autistic, I probably would have been able to get sex reassignment surgery already.