Help with writing an autistic character in my next novel?

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Awiddershinlife
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03 Aug 2014, 3:29 pm

ClaireBridgeman wrote:
I have read that some people on the autistic spectrum have very detailed knowledge on niche interests. I wonder if you have any input on what kind of interest I could give to my main character?


Niche interests are one of the great joys to being autistic and they can be anything.

ClaireBridgeman wrote:
I don't want to be completely stereotypical and give my main character a talent in maths, so I was thinking of making him an exceptionally talented artist. I wonder what your thoughts are on this?


Is there a reason this character is going to be talented other than this is a stereotype of autism?


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03 Aug 2014, 4:21 pm

Were you bullied at high school? Can you tell me about how you reacted to it? If you had to write a diary about what happened at the time, what would you have written?
I was frequently teased and sometimes bullied during primary school. In my early teens (12-14) I was mostly excluded/ignored. I would seem weird to them and they would say I was crazy. Then they would leave me alone till I became isolated and friendless. Back then, I didn't have diagnosis so I didn't understand what parts of my behaviour was weird.

Have you contemplated suicide? (I know this is very personal so feel free to totally not answer this one.) Can you tell me more about what you went through?
Yes. I had a depression (after the events I just described) which lead to me staying home from school for months and losing my will to live. I thought about it constantly for a couple of months, but never attempted it. I think a lot of Aspies get suicidal, but not many actually attempt it. Just because we want do die, doesn't mean we can't see how illogical it would be.

I have read that some people on the autistic spectrum have very detailed knowledge on niche interests. I wonder if you have any input on what kind of interest I could give to my main character?
Special interest is more correct :) A special interest and profound knowledge on a certain topic is essential, but does NOT equal savant-like abilities. Mine include: Teaching myself Japanese, animals/biology and numerous tv-series. Aspies are usually good at/knows a lot about the special interest. Not because of some autistic savant gift, but because they work extremely hard at it, love doing it and is highly concentrated while doing it. I'm not naturally talented at biology: I find it really hard! But I love the subject and could spent hours and hours researching it without getting slightly bored :) There do exists some savant aspies, but they take up 90% of all autistic media representation, so doing that would be extremely dull.

I don't want to be completely stereotypical and give my main character a talent in maths, so I was thinking of making him an exceptionally talented artist. I wonder what your thoughts are on this?
That would certainly be a first! I like the idea but be careful: He can be an amazing painter/writer/photographer/whatever, but make sure to highlight he is good because: He spends all his free time on it, he can't think about anything else and he works hard on it. Not (exclusively) because he's autistic.

And really, what general help can you give me with the way in which he should communicate? I'm thinking I need to avoid making him use sarcasm and figurative language - would that be an accurate reflection of how many or most of those on the autistic spectrum communicate?
Don't make him a robot. Aspies do have emotions and we can see others emotions, but we just have a really hard time comprehending them. Some aspies can also have weird mannerisms and/or stims. I have mannerisms (hand flapping and pulling my fingers) that I do when I'm excited, I rock back and forth when I'm concentrating (like now) and I flap my legs/any body part when I'm anxious and having a meltdown. Also eye contact is unpleasant. I can do it with close friends and family when I'm feeling okay. If I'm feeling slightly uncomfortable or bad, all my social skills disappears including being able to make some eye contact -.-


Really, anything you can tell me that will help me make this kid a believable character and avoid hitting too many cliches or coming across like an incredibly stupid person who has no idea about autism, that would be great. I really want to be sensitive to the condition.
I'm on the higher end of the spectrum. This means that I can decently blend in with people, but it completely drains me. After school I go home immediately to stare at my computer for a couple of hours to recharge. I also have friends that I actually enjoy being with but the day after is like a hangover.
Another important thing: Most autistic people are not in anyway spontaneous. I personally plan out my days to the detail and have a hard time hanging out with people after school. Not because I don't want to, but because I didn't plan it, and my brain can't adjust that quickly.

Good luck! I would love to read the first chapters when you're ready :D



ClaireBridgeman
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03 Aug 2014, 4:28 pm

Hey again everyone.

I thought I would give you all an update on how the character is developing. I have had so many new ideas based on the information you have all provided (as well as some more research online, particularly on the sensory problems that some or most Aspies and Auties have (thanks thumbhole for those terms ;) ). But first I want to say a massive thank you for bothering to reply, to share your experiences and just to debate amongst yourselves the questions I was asking. It's been so interesting, enlightening and educating to read and though I don't feel just yet that I have enough to go on, I really do feel like I'm getting there. Thank you.

The first thing you have to understand (if you didn't already!) is that whereas I am clearly trying to create a character who is believable and that I want to present him in a way that is sensitive, I also need him to be likeable and appealing to readers of young adult fiction. Of course, there is nothing about any of you that is unappealing; what I mean by that is, if I choose a special interest or talent for him, it needs to be one that my readers will understand - or at least, I need to be able to present it in a way that makes it appealing or easy to understand. It can't be anything that will bore my readers or leave them completely disinterested in the character. Therefore, some of my choices about this character might just be based on my need to make him likeable and appealing.

Speaking of special interests, I have not yet decided on one, and that's where I could use more advice... however, I do plan on hanging around these forums and doing some more research, too. I thought about making him a talented artist, but something that Awiddershinlife said struck me - is there any reason for this character to have a special talent? Well, no, actually, there isn't. I suppose I initially thought that it would make him more interesting, but that's not true. It's also not very accurate, since only 10% of those on the spectrum are considered to be specially talented in some way. So I've decided to leave that and just focus on the special interest instead. The best way to do this, I feel, would be to give him an interest that the two of us share; I can be slightly obsessive about the things I'm interested in. I love looking up facts and gaining lots of knowledge on a particular subject. As a result, I know a fair bit about Star Trek (Voyager in particular), Lord of the Rings, Muse (the band), Disney and certain Final Fantasy titles (video game). I think I'm right in thinking my character's interest could be any of these - though I probably won't go with Disney...

My question is really about how he would communicate using this special interest. From what I've read here, babbling about a certain topic regardless of whether or not someone is listening seems to be a trait... and one that I admit I share!! I often bore my husband to death with my Disney facts. So would it be fair to say that he might babble on about a certain aspect of the subject if the opportunity/need should arise? My second question would be, would it be appropriate for him to liken certain things he's going through to events in, say, Lord of the Rings? Would he compare himself to Frodo, for example? Would some kind of analysis of an event in his life and an episode of Voyager be something he might be likely to do? And lastly - if I were to make him an avid Muse fan, might he regularly refer to song lyrics that relate to whatever he might be going through?

I have also thought about those 'useless' quirks that were mentioned, and am considering what they might be (if any) as I develop the character.

I did some research on sensory stimulation and I'm thinking I might make him sensitive to touch. I think this might be a good angle to take from a bullying perspective; it makes the situation of being pushed or shoved one that would cause him stress and anxiety, a reason for his classmates to pick on him. I've read that some reactions to over stimulation might be withdrawal, vomiting, lashing out, running away, getting tired, panic attacks, engaging in a comforting ritual/routine, headaches, trying to focus on one thing at a time. Of course, I won't get him to do ALL of those things. To be honest, I will probably get him to do whatever suits the story at the time; for example, if he is being picked on in the playground and I need him to get out of there for some reason, then he might just run away. Would it be fair to assume that this is a consistent thing? That he would do this pretty much every time he found himself in that situation? Is this behaviour likely to be this ritualistic? If he is a 'runner', as it were, is it unrealistic to say that he would lash out instead of run away the next time he found himself in the same or a similar situation? With the reactions I listed above, are any of them likely to clash?

There are a few other bits and bobs I have thought about... please do let me know your thoughts. Nothing, of course, is set in stone as yet.

- I decided to change his age and make him slightly older. He was initially 11, just starting high school, but now I'm thinking that he will be 14/15, home schooled up until now as he must attend high school to sit his GCSEs. Of course I need to consider his social experiences up until then, but the idea is that he doesn't want to go to school because he doesn't like change and he doesn't like the idea of being close to people, say, in a classroom. I felt that making him older would force him to deal with hormones, therefore highlighting more difficulties for him, but it also fits in with my audience, who I anticipate will be around the same age. I feel it might be a little more educational for them. I'm not trying to be horrible to my main character, mind, but I do want him to go through some horrible things, or else he won't be pushed to consider suicide.

- I've thought about the situations he might find himself in whilst he is being bullied, and considered many of the things you guys have told me. As you might have read above, I have thought of the ways he might react to stressful situations (since the bullying and the sensitivity to touch seem to be going hand in hand at the moment) but I've thought of a couple of others things, too. I thought that, whereas I need to avoid making him analyse the things his bullies have said and done, I need to focus on his lack of understanding of why it's happening. He can't understand that they don't understand him. He can't understand why the way he is makes him a target. For the most part, he will be invisible to his classmates (as most of you actually said you felt/were invisible) but to a certain group, he is going to be a target. He might have only heard half of what was said to him; he might take a long time to process what someone said. He might not have been able to process the faces of those who are picking on him; he might focus on certain parts of their face without really putting it together. I understand that certain elements of what I've said kind of cross over into different areas of difficulty coping with sensory stimulation, so it would be interesting to know your thoughts here.

- On a slightly different note, I felt the bully would be better being a girl. This actually highlights a separate issue - that girls can be bullies too. Bullies are often characterised and stereotyped as big, strong boys who punch their victims about a bit. But in my experience as a teacher - and my own experience at school!! - it's the girls who often have the long lasting effect. I also thought of making her a year younger than the autistic character. I'd love to know your thoughts on this.

- I want/need to give him emotions and not keep him too serious. Since I know he's going to have a tough time, it's easy to make him really sad, depressed and serious all the time. I need to make him laugh and get him happy once in a while!! Oh and he can't be a robot, not that I was planning on making him so. ;)

- Gradual buildup. From what I've read online and here, it's my understanding things don't boil over suddenly. Things build up over a period of time. For example, the character is unlikely to run away / lash out / whatever I decide to make him do the first time he is picked on. It's more likely to be the fifth or sixth, say. The same goes for considering suicide. I read somewhere that it's unlikely to be a rash decision. It's more like something that is planned logically, the pros and cons weighed out etc. Hoping I have that generally accurate.

- Comorbidities - I hadn't thought of these at all until it was suggested. Would the sensory problems count or are there likely to be more? The reason I ask is because I don't want to give him a disability or issue unnecessarily. I just want to be true / accurate. And, of course, the more I give him, the more likely I am to get it wrong, since I don't have any myself (that I know of!!)

Okay... I think I have put most of my notes on here now. It would really be great to know how you think I'm getting on!!



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03 Aug 2014, 5:02 pm

One of the problems I've seen with autistic characters in fiction is that the autism becomes their major defining trait. They become walking stereotypes. One example I can think of is "The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Night-Time"; the autistic protagonist of that book is a good example of a stereotypical autistic--someone who actually wouldn't exist in real life, whose personality is essentially absent except for the autism. Don't do that; it's bad writing. Yes, I know the book has been praised; it's still bad writing.

Here's an exercise I want you to try. Remove the autism. Remove the autistic traits. What's left? If you can't make a well-rounded character out of that, then you've failed and you need to re-write.

What I'd like to see most of all is a person who simply happens to be autistic. They live their lives; they have their plot; they link to other characters and to the world around them. They have opinions about things. They've learned things from their home culture, like a Southerner would be more likely to enjoy eating grits. They don't have every single autistic trait out of a textbook; rather, they have a personality that's theirs alone, and it's colored by the autism, by the fact that they think differently from most people. They might have some unique viewpoints, and at the same time do and think things that are very normal for a teen their age. Maybe your autistic teenager is a huge fan of Lady GaGa and has memorized every one of her songs. Maybe he loves cars and wants to be a mechanic. Maybe he's an expert Call of Duty player.

Your autistic character is a human being first and foremost--most of their traits will come from their being human, not from being autistic.

And remember that for them, autism is their everyday normal. They live this life and they have never lived any other. Just like someone who was born in Japan wouldn't think of Japan as an exotic vacation destination, someone who's autistic doesn't think of autism as something foreign.

On to your questions.
Were you bullied at high school? Can you tell me about how you reacted to it? If you had to write a diary about what happened at the time, what would you have written?Yes, I was, but it wasn't a major part of my life. Socializing was irrelevant when I was that age, and being mostly rejected by everyone around me was something I had grown used to. My diaries during that time--I kept diaries religiously during high school and thereafter--are mostly about what I enjoyed doing and thinking about; for example, my special interests--at the time, astronomy. There would also have been a lot of thinking about philosophy, about what good and evil meant, and about how I could become a truly good person. I remember at least one incident in which I minutely novelized my favorite movie, "The Brave Little Toaster".

Have you contemplated suicide? (I know this is very personal so feel free to totally not answer this one.) Can you tell me more about what you went through?Yes, I have. I've had episodic depression since I was fourteen, and when I was in college I became suicidal for the first time. Being suicidal isn't like you'd think it is--it's not being really sad and emo. It's just feeling really tired. You want to get out of your situation, and you can't see any way out but death. Most of the time, you don't even want to die--you just want to go to sleep and not wake up again. I was hospitalized twice for depression, and both times the major feature of the hospital was: A.) it's utterly boring, and B.) they treat you like a child.

Quote:
I have read that some people on the autistic spectrum have very detailed knowledge on niche interests. I wonder if you have any input on what kind of interest I could give to my main character?
Depends on his personality. My interests tend to be things that make me think hard, such as science; or things that I care about, such as social justice issues. That's because I'm a very logical and altruistic person. What is your character like? What things would draw him in, fascinate him, or preoccupy him?

Quote:
I don't want to be completely stereotypical and give my main character a talent in maths, so I was thinking of making him an exceptionally talented artist. I wonder what your thoughts are on this?
Unfortunately, that's also stereotypical, but it (just like math) can be done well. He doesn't have to be exceptionally talented, by the way--most autistics are not savants, and most splinter skills are rather minor. Most of his talent will have come from persistently practicing the skill, and from being very interested in it.

And really, what general help can you give me with the way in which he should communicate? I'm thinking I need to avoid making him use sarcasm and figurative language - would that be an accurate reflection of how many or most of those on the autistic spectrum communicate?I can use both, and have been using figurative language since I was very young. For example: "Assuming that an autistic person can't learn to use sarcasm is like assuming that no one can ever learn a second language." If your character's autism is mild, he may sound very much like a typical person, if a little awkward or "nerdy". On the other hand, he may be shy, or almost poetic in the way he talks. Some autistic people have memorized large libraries of useful phrases and get them out when they need to communicate. One possible style of communication is to be very precise--to use "big words" because these have very specific meanings, rather than being brief and leaving most of the message to connotations. That was the way I was in high school, and I still am in many cases. Many of us have favorite topics, things we are very good at talking about, and will constantly return to those. The autism criteria only require communication impairment; there are many ways that can express itself, and it's as individual as the person is.


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03 Aug 2014, 5:27 pm

A - anxiety
S - socially excluded
P - pattern perceptive
E - empathetic especially to underdogs
R - reserved
G - good memory
E - emotional reaction to stress overload
R - real in communication
S - stigmatised by most NTs

Not all of these will apply to all of us, but most of them apply to most of us.



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03 Aug 2014, 5:54 pm

Only one bully? That would be a first. NTs' are herd members. The alphas tend to rule and decide what type and how much torture to administer.

Autistics ussually have more than one sensory issue, but as far as touch goes, please keep in mind that he can only handle certain fabric textures against his skin.

And odds are good that he desperately wants friends. I don;t know how many times I wondered why I hadn't died of loneliness.

Please make him awesome, because, we are.



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03 Aug 2014, 8:54 pm

Speaking of special interests I have not yet decided on one, and that's where I could use more advice... however, I do plan on hanging around these forums and doing some more research, too. I thought about making him a talented artist, but something that Awiddershinlife said struck me - is there any reason for this character to have a special talent? Well, no, actually, there isn't. I suppose I initially thought that it would make him more interesting, but that's not true. It's also not very accurate, since only 10% of those on the spectrum are considered to be specially talented in some way. So I've decided to leave that and just focus on the special interest instead. The best way to do this, I feel, would be to give him an interest that the two of us share; I can be slightly obsessive about the things I'm interested in. I love looking up facts and gaining lots of knowledge on a particular subject. As a result, I know a fair bit about Star Trek (Voyager in particular), Lord of the Rings, Muse (the band), Disney and certain Final Fantasy titles (video game). I think I'm right in thinking my character's interest could be any of these - though I probably won't go with Disney...

That sounds good to me. He could also have a general sci-fi/fantasy interest and Star Trek or LotR could be his favorites. Sort of how animals were my general special interest when I was younger, but cats were my favorite and the species that I knew the most about. I still think having him be a talented artist would be okay if you make sure to avoid making it a savant skill and instead make it something he got good at through years of practice, but I see your point of not including a skill like that at all.

My question is really about how he would communicate using this special interest. From what I've read here, babbling about a certain topic regardless of whether or not someone is listening seems to be a trait... and one that I admit I share!! I often bore my husband to death with my Disney facts. So would it be fair to say that he might babble on about a certain aspect of the subject if the opportunity/need should arise?

Yes, but be careful about this and don't go overboard. I'm not sure about other people, but I rarely ever discussed my special interest in school unless it came up somehow. However, I can definitely go on and on about things to my family and friend (basically people I feel comfortable talking to in general) until they eventually tell me to stop. I try to stop when they ask, but it annoys me a little because I don't feel like I've said everything I need to say. I also tend to get stuck on things I'm worried about and talk and talk about them too, as a way to prepare myself and help me deal with it.

My second question would be, would it be appropriate for him to liken certain things he's going through to events in, say, Lord of the Rings? Would he compare himself to Frodo, for example? Would some kind of analysis of an event in his life and an episode of Voyager be something he might be likely to do? And lastly - if I were to make him an avid Muse fan, might he regularly refer to song lyrics that relate to whatever he might be going through?

I can really relate to this as it is something that I personally do. I compare my problems to those that certain fictional characters have gone through. It helps when I'm dealing with something tough or upsetting. I've never been a music person (auditory processing issues), so I can't really give an opinion on the lyrics thing, but I don't see why he couldn't use them to cope too.

I did some research on sensory stimulation and I'm thinking I might make him sensitive to touch. I think this might be a good angle to take from a bullying perspective; it makes the situation of being pushed or shoved one that would cause him stress and anxiety, a reason for his classmates to pick on him. I've read that some reactions to over stimulation might be withdrawal, vomiting, lashing out, running away, getting tired, panic attacks, engaging in a comforting ritual/routine, headaches, trying to focus on one thing at a time. Of course, I won't get him to do ALL of those things. To be honest, I will probably get him to do whatever suits the story at the time; for example, if he is being picked on in the playground and I need him to get out of there for some reason, then he might just run away. Would it be fair to assume that this is a consistent thing? That he would do this pretty much every time he found himself in that situation? Is this behaviour likely to be this ritualistic? If he is a 'runner', as it were, is it unrealistic to say that he would lash out instead of run away the next time he found himself in the same or a similar situation? With the reactions I listed above, are any of them likely to clash?

I can't give much feedback here because I am not sensitive to that kind of touch. I have also never met an autistic person in real life who has those kinds of touch issues. It does often seem to be used in books though, so I would be careful here and try not to overdo it or fall into a stereotype. I hope someone who does have this issue will answer to give you some ideas.

One thing to note is that most of us have more than one sensory issue. My main sensory issues are sound (I have a hard time with loud and/or high-pitched sounds, as well as filtering out background noise), smell (certain smells really bother me and make me want to get out of that area), and touch related to clothing (tags bother me, seams in socks, certain materials, I can't wear jewelry for long at all, etc.)

For me, a sensory overload feels like I just can't take it anymore or I will lose it, it is painful and exhausting like a pressure in my head to hold it together. If possible, I will leave the area and/or do something to alleviate the problem (put in ear plugs, remove jewelry, etc.) If that's not possible, I will try to hold on until I can fix the problem, but I might have a meltdown. A meltdown is slightly more likely for me if I'm dealing with social exhaustion in addition to sensory overload or other problems. Leading up to that point, I become kind of quiet and barely respond to questions because I'm focusing on staying calm and trying to distract myself from the issue with my imagination. My meltdowns usually involve crying and often yelling, and they can be embarrassing after the fact (I am usually too upset during one to care what I'm doing).

As far as changing your character's response to bullying and sensory issues depending on the location and exact situation, I think that is okay and realistic. If he's able to get away, why not? If he can't, then he has to deal with it another way. Not sure about lashing out though.

- I've thought about the situations he might find himself in whilst he is being bullied, and considered many of the things you guys have told me. As you might have read above, I have thought of the ways he might react to stressful situations (since the bullying and the sensitivity to touch seem to be going hand in hand at the moment) but I've thought of a couple of others things, too. I thought that, whereas I need to avoid making him analyse the things his bullies have said and done, I need to focus on his lack of understanding of why it's happening. He can't understand that they don't understand him. He can't understand why the way he is makes him a target. For the most part, he will be invisible to his classmates (as most of you actually said you felt/were invisible) but to a certain group, he is going to be a target.

This sounds good to me.

He might have only heard half of what was said to him; he might take a long time to process what someone said. He might not have been able to process the faces of those who are picking on him; he might focus on certain parts of their face without really putting it together. I understand that certain elements of what I've said kind of cross over into different areas of difficulty coping with sensory stimulation, so it would be interesting to know your thoughts here.


I'm not sure about all this. I have an auditory processing problem, but it mostly comes into play with things like understanding song lyrics and understanding speech when there's a lot of background noise (I used to like watching TV with the captions on, for example). I never really had a problem understanding things in typical classroom settings, but I guess someone with a more severe processing issue might. One thing I do often do is say "huh?" but then seconds later understand what the person said and then say "oh, never mind".

As far as not processing faces, I think you could mean prosopagnosia which is a possible comorbid. I'm not sure if you'd want to go there or not. He may also just not pay much attention to faces in many cases. I am bad about that and I tend to watch people's mouths rather than look at their eyes and face, so I sometimes don't recognize people out of context. I always recognize people I know well, and I doubt I would fail to recognize a bully once I'd been picked on by them more than once.

- On a slightly different note, I felt the bully would be better being a girl. This actually highlights a separate issue - that girls can be bullies too. Bullies are often characterised and stereotyped as big, strong boys who punch their victims about a bit. But in my experience as a teacher - and my own experience at school!! - it's the girls who often have the long lasting effect. I also thought of making her a year younger than the autistic character. I'd love to know your thoughts on this.

I think those are both good ideas, but as has been pointed out, bullies are often in groups. Making a younger girl the "boss" bully of a group might work well.

- I want/need to give him emotions and not keep him too serious. Since I know he's going to have a tough time, it's easy to make him really sad, depressed and serious all the time. I need to make him laugh and get him happy once in a while!! Oh and he can't be a robot, not that I was planning on making him so. ;)

Good!

- Comorbidities - I hadn't thought of these at all until it was suggested. Would the sensory problems count or are there likely to be more? The reason I ask is because I don't want to give him a disability or issue unnecessarily. I just want to be true / accurate. And, of course, the more I give him, the more likely I am to get it wrong, since I don't have any myself (that I know of!!)

Sensory issues go along with the diagnosis rather than being a comorbidity. You could give him some, but I don't think it's necessary and like you said, it would make inaccuracies more likely. It's something to think about though.

I hope this helps, it's a bit more rushed than I would have liked but I wanted to reply tonight!



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03 Aug 2014, 9:56 pm

The idea of a female bully is interesting, but I think it would be hard to pull off in this situation. Most females bully by making verbal attacks, spreading rumours behind peoples' backs, and generally trying to one-up everyone else in the popularity contest that is high school. Being uninterested in my peers meant that if anyone ever spread rumours about me (not that they did, that I'm aware of), I can't say I would have especially cared. As for verbal attacks, boys generally aren't as sensitive about the same things girls are, so attacks on clothing, social status, boyfriends/girlfriends, etc. would have little effect on a male. Also, girls tend to tease by making "left handed compliments" or "jokes" about other people that seem nice or funny on the surface, but when you analyze it, they're actually unkind. An autistic person is more likely to be confused rather than hurt by such bullying, as they may miss the subtle underpinnings that make the comments hurtful. Not to mention, girls frequently bully because they're threatened or annoyed by another girl's behaviour, or are just trying to use the person as a stepping stool to boost their own popularity. Boys run in different circles, and are not likely to be seen as a means of protecting or gaining power, so there would be little reason for a girl to bully a boy, and vice versa. Just a few ideas to keep in mind.


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04 Aug 2014, 11:19 am

Michael Raven is a case where it did happen--severe bullying perpetrated by girls--and yes, multiple girls; usually there are multiple perpetrators.

You have to be specific in Google or you just get some random famous Michael Raven:
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Pietus
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04 Aug 2014, 9:14 pm

I think a girl bullying your main character is a good idea. StarTekker made some interesting points, but it could be perfect. Girls often hang out in groups and cliques, so you could have good scenes where the central antagonist says something, and the rest all laugh and giggle. Maybe they call him names. The Aspie/Autie doesn't understand why they're laughing, or possibly what the names even mean. He's just standing there, totally lost in a world of social complication.



ClaireBridgeman
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06 Aug 2014, 3:20 am

I decided to download The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Night-Time and was wondering what your thoughts were, if any of you have read it... I don't know, it just seems to me that every single line Haddon writes has this mission to make Christopher appear as "Aspergic" or autistic as possible. I read a few reviews and some of the more negative ones talk about him as a character that has nothing, no personality beyond his condition. Interestingly, most of the negative reviews come from those with Asperger's or autism, slating the book for being unrealistic.

Having said that, in many ways fictional characters are meant to be larger than life, exaggerated etc. in order to engage readers or just be more interesting in general. Films, TV shows and even songs do it, too.

It's not really what I'm doing, mind. I've started to write my novel, starting with my character who has autism (undiagnosed, I decided) and he is absolutely nothing like Christopher. I deliberately started writing before I read Curious Incident because I didn't want to subconsciously copy Haddon.



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06 Aug 2014, 11:46 am

ClaireBridgeman wrote:
I decided to download The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Night-Time and was wondering what your thoughts were, if any of you have read it... I don't know, it just seems to me that every single line Haddon writes has this mission to make Christopher appear as "Aspergic" or autistic as possible. I read a few reviews and some of the more negative ones talk about him as a character that has nothing, no personality beyond his condition. Interestingly, most of the negative reviews come from those with Asperger's or autism, slating the book for being unrealistic.

Having said that, in many ways fictional characters are meant to be larger than life, exaggerated etc. in order to engage readers or just be more interesting in general. Films, TV shows and even songs do it, too.

It's not really what I'm doing, mind. I've started to write my novel, starting with my character who has autism (undiagnosed, I decided) and he is absolutely nothing like Christopher. I deliberately started writing before I read Curious Incident because I didn't want to subconsciously copy Haddon.


I think the Curious Incident might be a good example of what not to do. I read it a long time ago, so my memory isn't completely fresh, but I pretty much agree with your assessment and the negative reviews. I personally feel like we have enough exaggerated examples of ASD in all forms of media and so we could use some more realistic ones.



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06 Aug 2014, 12:04 pm

StarTrekker wrote:
The idea of a female bully is interesting, but I think it would be hard to pull off in this situation. Most females bully by making verbal attacks, spreading rumours behind peoples' backs, and generally trying to one-up everyone else in the popularity contest that is high school. Being uninterested in my peers meant that if anyone ever spread rumours about me (not that they did, that I'm aware of), I can't say I would have especially cared. As for verbal attacks, boys generally aren't as sensitive about the same things girls are, so attacks on clothing, social status, boyfriends/girlfriends, etc. would have little effect on a male. Also, girls tend to tease by making "left handed compliments" or "jokes" about other people that seem nice or funny on the surface, but when you analyze it, they're actually unkind. An autistic person is more likely to be confused rather than hurt by such bullying, as they may miss the subtle underpinnings that make the comments hurtful. Not to mention, girls frequently bully because they're threatened or annoyed by another girl's behaviour, or are just trying to use the person as a stepping stool to boost their own popularity. Boys run in different circles, and are not likely to be seen as a means of protecting or gaining power, so there would be little reason for a girl to bully a boy, and vice versa. Just a few ideas to keep in mind.


Well, i got bullied alot by girls and it was alot more physical. Yeah, i got alot of punches on my back, only leading me to turn around and ask them why they did it with no response. One time i got kicked in the crotch from behind during a school event. I walked to this populair girl and just asked why did you kick me, only to get a punch in my face and getting a bruise. I never had the guts to fight back, since they were all populair girls and alot of strong guys followed them because they only wanted to bang them. I also received alot of comments like "No woman will ever want to touch you" and how ugly / hairy i am. How abnormal my 'gait' was during gymnatics and if i could walk/'act'normally / look at them in the eye. I was considered a loser.

I think the comment someone else posted above me is quite right. It would be ALOT more realistic if the character does not have any special talent but only holds a special interest and talks about it all the time while sucking at it, driving other people crazy.



vickygleitz
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06 Aug 2014, 12:26 pm

PLEASE give the protagonist a personality. PLEASE make him am awesome person. BTW, uneven skills would probably be good an help the readers find him interesting. I mean, many of us suck at the simplest tasks but find other things that most people think are impossible a breeze. Y haven't you read my pm to you?



olympiadis
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06 Aug 2014, 1:11 pm

I was absolutely bullied and abused both mentally and physically by females (kids and adult) when I was a kid, and as an adult.



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06 Aug 2014, 2:33 pm

ClaireBridgeman wrote:
. . .
My main character is a boy about to start high school. He loved his primary school and he isn't too fond of change, so he isn't looking forward to secondary school.
. . .

As context for my responses, I am a female who was mostly home schooled, but who really hated primary school while attending it. I attended high school for all four years, all at the same school. I took mostly advanced placement classes, so even though my graduating class had 573 students, most of my classes were with the same 60 or 70 students.
ClaireBridgeman wrote:
Were you bullied at high school? Can you tell me about how you reacted to it?

No. I was not.

I went to a good school, which did NOT have roaming bullies going around picking on random kids sitting alone, and that's what I normally did -- sat alone. I never made any honest attempts at forming friendships in high school; I only had any kind of relationships with my peers at all because my mom insisted that it was important and because I knew that I had to be nice to nice people; I had learned by high school how badly my lack of desire to talk and how quickly I would end conversations hurt people, even though I didn't understand it, and so I responded nicely when people spoke to me -- which encouraged conversation, of course, and so I had what I call "classroom friends" (which is like having "school friends," except that I mostly spent breaks as alone as I could get). I went to a few birthday parties and, near the end of senior year, I went out in groups a few times with some classroom friends, but I found it really stressful and exhausting when I did. Basically, I didn't spend enough time around other kids for them to get fed up enough with me to become mean.

Also, I'm reasonably attractive (even though I was fat in high school and did not wear makeup, do much with my hair other than brush it, or care much how my clothes looked as long as they were comfortable). Looking ok probably protected me from bullying. (I'm 27 now, and I still don't wear makeup or do much with my hair other than brush it or care much how my clothes look as long as they're comfortable, btw. I cared and wore makeup for a while in junior high (7th and 8th grade), but that was because my mom pushed it on me. :geek:)
ClaireBridgeman wrote:
If you had to write a diary about what happened at the time, what would you have written?

I kept a diary on and off in high school, and it's overflowing with depression, obsession and loneliness.

Now you are probably thinking, "But Amethyst, you just said that you never tried to make friends; if you were so lonely, why didn't you try to make friends?" -- This is a good question. The answer is that I only ever wanted a boyfriend; I specifically wanted a romantic partner and I didn't even understand the friendship side of it. I was too shy and intolerant of physical contact to start anything with a guy, though, so I filled diary pages with obsessive longing instead. I couldn't even tough someone's hand without panicking in those days. :geek:
ClaireBridgeman wrote:
Have you contemplated suicide? (I know this is very personal so feel free to totally not answer this one.) Can you tell me more about what you went through?

Yes. Obsessively.
ClaireBridgeman wrote:
I have read that some people on the autistic spectrum have very detailed knowledge on niche interests. I wonder if you have any input on what kind of interest I could give to my main character?

Anything. I suggest you choose something YOU like. :geek:
ClaireBridgeman wrote:
I don't want to be completely stereotypical and give my main character a talent in maths, so I was thinking of making him an exceptionally talented artist. I wonder what your thoughts are on this?

Totally reasonable; we tend to think with our senses.
ClaireBridgeman wrote:
And really, what general help can you give me with the way in which he should communicate? I'm thinking I need to avoid making him use sarcasm and figurative language - would that be an accurate reflection of how many or most of those on the autistic spectrum communicate?

In high school, a fellow student gave me the nickname "Sarc," which stood for "Sarcasm." I was sarcastic MUCH more than I was serious. I'm pretty sure that learned sarcasm from my dad and that I adopted it as part of my personality because of how hard it is for me to hold serious conversations orally; they must be in writing and I have to be alone while I write, or I just can't do it -- I know now that I suffer from selective mutism and that this was the problem all along, but I didn't know what that was or even that I'd been labeled as autistic (or even what autism was) back in high school.
ClaireBridgeman wrote:
Really, anything you can tell me that will help me make this kid a believable character and avoid hitting too many cliches or coming across like an incredibly stupid person who has no idea about autism, that would be great. I really want to be sensitive to the condition.

Spend some time lurking here on WP, learning through osmosis. :geek:
ClaireBridgeman wrote:
Thank you!

You're welcome! :)