What is the ADHD- AS overlap?

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Can anyone tell me what these two diagnosis share in common? And where they differ?
If you know a diagram, chart, drawed illustration etc- pleas give me a link

This is how I understand the similarities and differences.

ADHD and ASD both tend to have problems with executive function - such as managing tasks (e.g. starting, switching between, finishing). The AQ Test, for example, includes 10 questions about executive functions (as well as questions about other facets of ASD).

ADHD and ASD also tend to have sensory sensitivity - about half of people with ADHD and the vast majority of people with ASD have some form of unusual sensory sensitivity.

ADHD can have social problems (e.g. alienate friends) because of their impulsive behaviour, while ASD tend to have social problems because of difficulty "reading" other people and expressing emotions in non-NT ways (problems with verbal and non-verbal communication). Of course, other factors affect ASD social interaction too - sensory sensitivity, difficulties with emotional regulation, being overwhelmed by the quantity of information in social interaction.

ADHD tend not to have the repetitive and restrictive behaviours and interests (RRBI) that people with ASD have (as far as I am aware).

I have read that the majority of people with AS (or maybe ASD) would also meet the criteria for ADHD. Under DSM-IV you were not supposed to diagnose ADHD if the person has ASD. In DSM5 you can have both diagnoses. So I think there is a considerable overlap between ADHD and ASD, but ASD is (at least partial) ADHD plus other characteristics: impaired verbal and non-verbal communication and RRBI.

At the core of ADHD is difficulty managing impulses and attention, rather than difficulties with social communication and RRBI. There are more people with ADHD than with ASD - but most people with ASD have subclinical or clinical levels of ADHD.

I'd just add with ADD ADHD, whatever

(Well this acutually talking about me really, it's all a bit different for person I think).

is that your brain is going all over the place. Continuely thinking of things, the only way that it stays focused is by thinking about things that it sparks it's interested. Then once that happens there is then a hyperfocus on that interest and you get really obsorbed into it. If you need to do something that you are not interested in, it is really hard because you can't stay focused.

So a special interest with ADD, ADHD is more about staying focussed. AS a special interest maybe more just a person is really interested in that. I think that is a difference there.

See you might think my grammar is complete garbage, and it makes me look a bit unintelligent and a mess. Which I am a mess. But it's just that I don't find grammar that interesting so I've never been bothered to learn it. You might think I'm lazy for bad grammar, maybe a bit, but it is really hard to learn something I'm not interested in because of my bad focus.

That's the curse I have.

But on the other side of things I have a gift, I am lucky because I'm really creative and can think about things really well because my brain is going all over the place with ideas, so I can think logically and problem solve because of my ideas. When I do find something I'm interested in I can learn it really well and do it really well at it.

Thus concludes an insight into workings of the mind of MR_BOGAN.

Both replies were fantastic. As an individual with Aspergers and ADHD-PI ( I'm usually not hyperactive), I would like to add to this discussion with a few personal experiences.

With Aspergers/ASD, I tend to focus intensely on one or two subjects. The poor executive functioning from both causes me to research or hang around on the Internet for way too long, and then the ADHD kicks in, when I finally pull myself away from the screen, and makes me unable to concentrate on the task before me.

Another typical scenario. I usually go into sensory overload only when my brain is already overstimulated. For example, I have these trains of thought that go on and on and on. If during this time period I encounter a distressing sensory environment (usually crowds and the like) then bam, I zone out and maybe shut down. For some reason I've never really had a meltdown.

The same zoning out can be applied to social situations. I don't know how or if you experience this, but at some point during a prolonged conversation, I tend to suddenly feel overwhelmed and cannot look people in the eye. I become less verbal, can't focus on the interaction and might start stimming. Otherwise I appear almost completely normal.

So yes, I would agree to what one-A-N said, ASD is ADHD plus social difficulties. But for now, it's my executive dysfunction that's causing the most distress.

Thanks for your experience MR BOGAN ! It makes sense:)

jamieevren1210 : i can really relate to everything you write about! I have the same thing with shutdowns, and maby once had a so called meltdown. but it just coud be "system overload" with sensory issues

thanks guyes! really like the answers

Both of them fidget and for us it's stimming and for them it's them being restless and fidgety. They may both rock back and forth or pace.

Research studies have shown that people with ASD + ADHD have additive effects of both, which cause lower adaptive functioning skills than people with ASD only or ADHD only.

There is overlap between ASD and ADHD at behavioral, cognitive, neuro, genetic levels, but more distinct than overlapping at cognitive/neuro level based on studies so far.

People with ASD and people with ADHD may both have abnormalities in attention, but the specific cognitive patterns are usually distinct and as different from each other as both from NT.

Overlap based on behavioral traits would probably overestimate ASD-ADHD overlap, as behavioral traits can be caused by different cognitive/neuro traits.

For eggsample, social problems observed in both ASD and ADHD likely have different causes, with differences in social cognition in ASD and attentional issues in ADHD.

Also, children with ASD only don't generally have the cognitive traits of ADHD, e.g. inhibition issues, while children with ADHD don't generally have the cognitive traits of ASD, e.g. locally-oriented perception.

But there seems to be great overlap at this point due to our greater knowledge of ASD and ADHD at behavioral level than other levels.

As we know more about other levels, the overlap will probably decrease, and we will know more about what is the cause of a behavioral trait and how to support the person with ASD or ADHD or ASD+ADHD based on the specific cognitive/neuro cause in the brain.

The 75% figure, I don't know where it comes from or how accurate it is, but I have seen recent study with 36% estimate in adults based on behavioral definitions of DSM, with greatest overlap in PDD-NOS group, which is not prototypical autism.

So far, researchers are saying both shared and distinct traits in ASD and ADHD, and the groups are usually studies like this now: NT group vs. ASD only group vs. ADHD only group vs. ASD+ADHD group.

when i avoid eye contact, its because it overstimulates me. it feels like i look right at a bright sun. if i force myself to eyecontact, even though ive rather not, i feel a sudden discomfort, and cant seem to manage the persons bodylanguage, verbal language, gesticulation and eyemovement at the same time. its just to freaki`n much for me. I tend to drift of in thoughts and shut down pretty fast. lats say, maby afther 5minutes.

I feel distracted by eyes, and face expressions, and im a much better listener if i look elsewere in the room.

Would you say that this is a ADHD thing, or more ASD ?

I know both ADHD and ASD often experience troubles with eyecontact. But does the differend groups of people have different experiences with it? (the avoidance of eyecontact)

so if i get it right...there are common symtoms ( seen bahaviour) in the two diagnosis. BUT the causes may differ?
Like say , when i am in a social situation i tend to shutdown. Its just to much going on AND very often the topic of the talk is boring me. Im more of a intelectual kind of girl. Im not into chitchat or smalltalk. I like to learn new things. facts. And i like to talk about my special interests.

Would you guyes say this is more ADHD or AS ?

Your fear of eye contact is associated with both ASD and social anxiety disorder.

It is considered a kind of hypersensitivty to social stimuli, and elevated physiological responses have been found in people with ASD, and elevated neural responses in people with social anxiety disorder.

The social tendencies that you mentioned are common in ASD, but also in NTs who are more intellectual and not interested in social chitchat.

I've met a teenage boy with ADHD, and he was so obsessed with films that I literally have never heard him talking about anything else. He was so extroverted and hyper and wouldn't stop being in the spotlight that you just couldn't get away from his fascination with films. He even wore me out, and I know I talk about my special interests a great deal, but he actually did more than I ever did to anyone!

I am starting to think I might have ADHD instead of AS, or be a person with ADHD with just a few AS traits, though I wasn't exactly bouncing off the walls as a kid. But I do have trouble with focusing on reading. I never read books. Today I had an hour to kill but went into the library because the only other option was to go around clothes shops and I find that boring. But I could not sit and read books in the library for an hour, so I booked a computer so that I could just surf the web. I know internet searching involves reading, but it's in a more comfortable context.

My social difficulties seem to just be shyness a lot of the time. I don't have trouble expressing or feeling my own or other people's emotions, and I can read body language and other non-verbal cues pretty well (I always have done). I know I can be a little odd in some ways when interacting which can make me socially awkward I suppose, but I don't feel like I am socially awkward in an Aspie type of way.

I'd rather have ADHD than AS. I have told one person I have ADHD and I felt good about it. But telling anyone about having AS is just so daunting for me, I cannot do it. AS has too many silly stereotypes that people throw at you, and it seems where I come from people are afraid of Autistic people for some reason. A few years ago I even got asked by someone if being on the Autistic spectrum meant I was Schizophrenic.