Does Behaviour Modification Make People Disingenuous?

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I received behaviour modification from my mother. She was always forceful about teaching me to pass, like she was teaching me a survival skill. However, I have become so conditioned to monitoring the other person and preparing appropriate responses that I have no idea how I actually feel about things anymore... and more than that, a lot of the time I don't feel anything. I have retreated so far from my natural feelings and responses that human interaction seems like an elaborate and fairly worthless game. And my own true feelings have been marginalized in this effort to pass to the extent where nothing touches me deeply. I feel like the world is a roll playing game with other people nothing more than players to be optimized.

Anyone else feel this way? I really believe this is a result of behavioural conditioning because when I was a child I was extremely open and genuine (and obnoxious and inappropriate - hence the modification.) I know I get along better socially in the world because of these modified skills, but at what cost to myself and my spirit?

I have described this as part of my feeling 'two consciousnesses', where the first is the public projection that you describe, and the second my real self, which is almost subconscious but not quite so because it's active at times. It causes thinking straight to be incredibly arduous, because I literally delude myself unintentionally. It can get so bad that I will say or write something and then realize a few hours later that my thoughts are exactly the opposite, only for that to change again to some other shade of grey.

I get my own feelings so lost and twisted that I have a sense of detachment, where I feel that I can in the moment explain myself, but it's not really myself, and then later I realize this, but when I'm realizing it I'm still not 'myself'. It's as if I'm an open source computer program where multiple people create separate revisions, and have attempted to merge them without considering possibility of conflicts/errors.

Truthfully,

Every kid growing up undergoes "behavioral modification" to some extent.

My mother did a lot of "behavioral modification."

I don't believe it's made me disingenuous. Instead, it's made me careful about what I say to certain people--in a practical sense.

We have to have "social rules" in order to survive as a species. I don' t care what "theorist " says we don't.

I understand this, androbot. It's a puzzle.

You can't know what you would have been if things had been entirely different while you grew into who you are, but you know that there was something precious, important and happy that got suppressed.

Can you find it?

I think Tony Attwood's comments starting at 4:00 in this video are related to this too: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5vYQ5gDtbTw

I had a dream about digging out a shinning sphere of energy form under earth and rock. It was my true self, my heart of limitless energy. But it was like the alien anomaly in "Sphere" -- too much to handle.

I don't know if it was a good dream or a bad dream or just a sort of subconscious metaphor conveying an emotional but neutral truth.

I wish you well in seeking and learning.

I think sometimes we take it all too far.

There are times in my life when it's all about "showing the correct behavior," and that is all that matters. Being not-autism.

Those times, if they have to last very long, leave an empty shell of a person that feels nothing, loves no one, and does not desire to live.

There are times in my life when it's, "Whatever, f**k it, I'm going to sit here and stim because I can. f**k it, f**k you, f**k this."

Those times CAN'T last very long. Because I obviously can't go out like that with kids. And dishes have to get washed, grass has to be mowed, meals have to be cooked, kids have to be taught to function, people need the rest of me.

There are times in the middle. "I am going to say what's true when it matters, and be what's real with the people that matter. But there are all these other people too, people who won't bother to look or think, people who need the show to feel safe."

Those are the best times, the times that WORK.

The problem, of course, is when you do things like make friends, or get married, or work a lot of hours, and admit the people who need the show and need it to be perfect into the places that are supposed to be the safe places where you can stop putting on a show, the places where it's supposed to be OK to be real, to not run everything through "Is it OK, or is it autism?"

"Autism" could be more than "okay" in certain circumstances.

Things were invented because of autism, not despite it.

May different philosophies were postulated because of autism, not despite it.

Be that as it may, even autism advocates like Temple Grandin KNOW that they have to adapt to the NT world to at least some extent.

Just like you have to "put on a show" to raise your kids to be successful.

This is very true, kraftiekortie.

And at work you have to adopt a certain professional persona and that isn't being fake, it's playing a role. That's what they pay you for! The parental analogy is very good.

The problem is if you are playing a role all the time in your personal life. It's easy to do when you have been hurt repeatedly when you let guard down.

But I don't think it makes sense to try and reject everything you do to make others more comfortable. That would be more acting like a jerk, rather than acting with sincerity.

Thank you for that video. It was helpful.



This really hits home for me. For as long as I can remember I have been trying to hide my despicable self. I guess I better start working on getting the mask off. Or maybe I really am abhorrent to society. Right now I would be equally content to die as to be accepted. I just don't have any energy left.

I think this is very true and well put, kraftie. No one can or should be exactly who they are in all situations.

"Behavior modification" crosses the line from okay to not okay when they tell you to decieve, or to sacrifice something you can't do without emotionally or whatever. It isn't a sacrifice otherwise, true, but in that case NO sacrifice is okay. I mean this literally.

Yes, lying can make your life easier, but if you have to lie... what kind of a life is that?

I am so glad I didn't recieve any of that crap, though if it had been available at the time and if I had been diagnosed at the time my gullible mother might have... I don't know... but I did enough bloody behavioral modification on myself... shame, embarrassment, more!

Behavior modification is worse then telling you to deceive. They want to "recover" you by ridding you of your "wrong" Autistic traits and replace them with "correct" behaviors. True it is not as bad as the old days of mostly aversion therapy and shock treatment (with one notable exception) it is mostly positive reinforcement these days. But the goal and the judgement behind it is exactly the same. One thing to remember is we are not talking about a couple of sessions, the recommended amount of ABA is 40 hours a week. http://autism.about.com/od/alllaboutaba/f/40hours.htm. The autistic kid in these programs is a prisoner and like prisoners you have pretty much have to give in. They are also kids so they are going to believe being told by an authority there naturally autistic behaviors are wrong. Because of these factors the behaviors do change so as far as the world is concerned the program is successful. ABA is the considered the most effective treatment today. The shame of it is when the inevitable complete meltdown occurs to massive amount of people it will be considered further proof autism is evil.

I would say compared with most here my amount of acceptance and letting myself be myself over the years is better the 90+ percent of the people on the forum and still I have depersonalization issues, At times I can't tell what is a added natural skill and what is acting and that is not a good thing, it frightens me a bit.

It is important for Autistic's to know NT's act and put on masks and cause themselves harm. Individual circumstances differ be it NT or autistic. We should not let the previous stated truths cover up the truth that in general there is no equivalence.

Last edited by ASPartOfMe on 11 Nov 2014, 4:35 am, edited 3 times in total.

It is hard to spend one's life being told that you are intrinsically "wrong." How is that not supposed to tear at one's self esteem. For every action has to be put through a mental screening to determine it's suitability. I am so conditioned to do this that I've lost myself. I don't even know how I feel about things because my own judgment has been marginalized. I feel like a robot.

That you realize this is happening and why it is happening is an important first step. I think feeling angry about it and using that anger in a constructive way is probably the way to go. Constantly remind yourself that you don't and never deserved this. The problem has been 44 years in the making so it can't be solved in a week For certain there will be missteps. Good luck to you and all of us really.

I second this and add that the core pattern of you is still there and will break through in various ways. You may find it in your sense of humor (though if you are currently depressed this may be suppressed) you may find it a few things that reliably engage you and stimulate you.

If you know how to build a fire, I would suggest an analogy with an ember that you can feed oxygen and fuel and nurse into a blaze. Under all that dead armor there can be a capacity for great joy, particularly down the line of special interests.

It's called an identity. There is a space between you and your identity. Maybe it's been stretched beyond what would be normal for you. And as always, the identity doesn't always reflect the person. I think this mimicry behavior is caused by this.

I think I know what you guys are saying. And sometimes I do think there's an ember.

The last intake appointment I went to I asked if I could talk to someone about PTSD. She looked startled and said, "Oh, did you suffer a traumatic event." Very concernedly. I responded that the years I spent undiagnosed, trying to pretend everything was fine have left me confused and lacking in trust. She said "oh, okay." and I ended up with an OCD specialist. But at least I got to see someone. He said I was extremely high functioning and he might not suspect autism unless he was looking for it. He said it like this was a good thing. Like I no longer had it because he could not perceive it. But he doesn't know the cost.


It does feel that way.