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Autism and Finger Length

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Fnord
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15 Nov 2021, 9:16 am

DuckHairback wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Please understand that "Correlation Does Not Imply Causation" is a basic scientific principle.
I wish it did. Everything would be so much simpler.
No, everything would be much more complex -- even chaotic -- as physical principles changed constantly.



kraftiekortie
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15 Nov 2021, 9:24 am

Many of my features "correlate" with someone who would remain a virgin throughout life.

That I am not a virgin, and obtained loving experiences at close to the "normal" age----means that the "causation" didn't manifest itself.



IsabellaLinton
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15 Nov 2021, 10:31 am

cbd wrote:
What's more common in my finding is the facial feature ratio . It has held true for every single Aspie I am aware of . The edge of the mouth and centre of pupils align exact . Compared to Neuro typical who tend not to have this ratio .

I think this indicates generally a wider mouth shape .. but not always as it is an overal ratio .. if you are Autistic and have close together eyes , your mouth won't be as wide as someone who's eyes are wider apart hence having a wider mouth


That ratio is considered normal. It's taught in art school.

Image


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15 Nov 2021, 11:04 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
Many of my features "correlate" with someone who would remain a virgin throughout life.

LOL.

Teasing: Which features? The glasses? (profile pic)
Seriously: Glad you had some good experiences. Age has definitely made me more grateful for past experiences, even those that were rough at the time.

Fondly,
Your fellow four eyes



mohsart
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15 Nov 2021, 11:10 am

IsabellaLinton wrote:
That ratio is considered normal. It's taught in art school.

Yup. I was taught it in 8th grade.
Fun fact is that when the proportions seem to differ from that norm, it is usually an illusion.
Hairstyle, facial hair, makeup, or just that the person tilts his/her head slightly up or down can make it seem like the eyes are more narrow, the forehead lower, and so on.

/Mats


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15 Nov 2021, 11:12 am

mohsart wrote:
IsabellaLinton wrote:
That ratio is considered normal. It's taught in art school.

Yup. I was taught it in 8th grade.
Fun fact is that when the proportions seem to differ from that norm, it is usually an illusion.
Hairstyle, facial hair, makeup, or just that the person tilts his/her head slightly up or down can make it seem like the eyes are more narrow, the forehead lower, and so on.

/Mats


Yup.

Eyes are 1/5 the breadth of the face. The nose is the centre 5th. Then 1/5 on either side of the eyes.

It's all mathematics.


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Fnord
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15 Nov 2021, 11:16 am

Not in Anime and Manga!

Image



kraftiekortie
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15 Nov 2021, 11:21 am

I believe Anime and Manga tend to use "exaggerated" features for dramatic effect.



mohsart
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15 Nov 2021, 11:28 am

Depends on what kind of Manga/Anime you read/watch
Image
Image
Image

/Mats


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Fnord
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15 Nov 2021, 11:31 am

My first intro to the genre was buying an autographed first edition of this:

Image

The details are kinda lost as this resolution, but as you can see, "big eyes, small mouth" lives up to its name.



cbd
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15 Nov 2021, 2:01 pm

Joe90 wrote:
cbd wrote:
What's more common in my finding is the facial feature ratio . It has held true for every single Aspie I am aware of . The edge of the mouth and centre of pupils align exact . Compared to Neuro typical who tend not to have this ratio .

I think this indicates generally a wider mouth shape .. but not always as it is an overal ratio .. if you are Autistic and have close together eyes , your mouth won't be as wide as someone who's eyes are wider apart hence having a wider mouth


Nothing's that precise.

Unless you got a ruler and measured the face of every Aspie you know, there's no real evidence that it's that precisely accurate. Autism doesn't have distinct facial feaures like downs syndrome does. It's just your imagination.


I strongly disagree . If you can pick Austic people out and identify them as ASD , with enough examples you will see it is true . To me its as distinctive as Downs Syndrome .. so far I haven't come across contrary to this belief . If I had pictures of everybody's faces . I guarantee I would pick 98% Autistics out of 100 faces .

I'm open to other people's opinions , but genetics is something I have a close eye on



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15 Nov 2021, 2:05 pm

IsabellaLinton wrote:
cbd wrote:
What's more common in my finding is the facial feature ratio . It has held true for every single Aspie I am aware of . The edge of the mouth and centre of pupils align exact . Compared to Neuro typical who tend not to have this ratio .

I think this indicates generally a wider mouth shape .. but not always as it is an overal ratio .. if you are Autistic and have close together eyes , your mouth won't be as wide as someone who's eyes are wider apart hence having a wider mouth


That ratio is considered normal. It's taught in art school.

Image


This. Thank you IsabellaLinton.
I suppose some Aspies love to believe that autism has different facial features but it DOESN'T. If the differences were as distinct as downs syndrome then autism would be diagnosed at birth.

It's a bit like saying ''only Aspies have two eyes''. Daft.


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15 Nov 2021, 2:53 pm

I can kind of see it in people's eyes, because of our lack of eye contact. There's a vacancy in our gaze. It's not that we look stupid but we tend to have a faraway look in our eyes. It's like we're living in our minds and not fully engaged with whatever we're looking at visually. In photos autistic people either seem to have their eyes downcast, not engaged, or else they're staring really hard and looking fake.

There's also a bit of reservation in our eyes / countenance, as if we want to retreat or vanish.

Then of course flat affect, awkward smiles, and awkward movement like we're built out of steel.

Hands tend to be held in tight fists, up close to the body.

This is totally speculative. Please no haters. I know that not everyone is like this, and everyone is different. I'm just saying if I had to identify people based on photos / real life, that's what I personally would look for. I don't think it's so much "facial features" as it's a way of carrying ourselves and seeming uncomfortable in our own skin.


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15 Nov 2021, 3:04 pm

I wonder, do I look autistic? (My profile pic is me, albeit a younger version.)
And if so, how come I only got diagnosed at age 52?
I call BS on the whole idea, especially when facts about the face that are true for 99% of the population is stated to be signs of autism. It's simply not true.

/Mats


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15 Nov 2021, 3:05 pm

There is no "look" to autism.  It is diagnosed by behavior.



kraftiekortie
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15 Nov 2021, 4:30 pm

I used to believe that I look "ret*d" or whatever. or "autistic." In retrospect, though, I don't believe that is true.

I used to think I had a "ret*d" voice, too. In retrospect, I don't believe this is true, either.

I believe a person's bodily movements can "indicate" autism more than a person's face.

The exception would be if a person has some sort of chromosomal disorder, accompanying the autism, which renders the person's face "unusual" in some fashion. Some of these disorders bear distinctive "looks."

It should be noted that people with Angelman's Syndrome, a situation where a person is severely disabled, but very happy, do not have a distinctive face, per se. They look like "normal" people.