Do you think ugly guys have no right to want average girls?

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Let me elaborate. While doing a hobby i was thinking. How many people believe that unattractive or ugly men have no right or are hypocrites for only wanting average-looking or attractive women and shunning ugly women? Is that a clear question? This is most noticeable when one unattractive man asks out an unattractive woman just to get shot down for not being attractive. Or when an average or attractive woman brings on the whole "back off, your out of your league". Do many people believe in "leagues"? F.e. should an obese man only seek obese women? Or do you believe in the whole Hitch movie theory. That anyone can sweep anyone off their feet if they have the right broom.

A woman's idea of attractive usually emphasizes status and age over actual physical appearance. Not to say that women can't be shallow, it is just money over beauty. Also, in case you haven't noticed, there are many more ugly men out there than women.

Not to mention height and unit size.

"Right" is not the appropriate word. Every person has the right to want whatever they want to want.

"Expectation" works better, as in "Ugly men should have no expectations when it comes to dating average or attractive women".

Although you'd be surprised at how many "ugly" men are even married to attractive women.

Maybe it's because there really are women who are not at all concerned with how a man looks, but are rather attracted to men who treat them well, and not like objects to be owned or prizes to be won!

(... hint ... hint ...)

Last edited by Fnord on 30 Apr 2013, 3:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Actually, statistically speaking, both genders favor looks over personality.

While that may be the way to bet, that is not always how it goes.

Tbh, I partly blame men on this.

Too many rapists and drunk types that hump anything that moves on friday night caused the male gender's popularity to strongly decrease in the last 50 years.

Last edited by Uprising on 30 Apr 2013, 3:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I wouldn't say either group favors looks over personality, but your looks are important if you are to ever get a chance for them to know your personality.

It can work the other way too, extremely good looking people may not meet the person who would be most compatable for them because that person is too hung up on the league thing to approach them.

Everybody has the right to their own feelings. Anybody can want whatever they want. Is it likely to happen? An ugly man who shuns women who are similar to him in ugliness may be choosing to be alone forever unless he can convince a more attractive (than him) woman to choose him. Like Fnord I think that "no expectation" is a better choice of words than "no right". Particularly since nobody has a literal right to have anybody else. .



Perhaps those women have decided they'd rather not go out with anyone rather than go out with someone they don't think is handsome. Or perhaps looks weren't the reason they said "no". Or any number of reasons.



I do think leagues are very real but I don't think they are confined to looks. I have noticed that when people get married, what they almost never get married outside of is their class. The whole concept of leagues is just a variation on classes and groups. Some women will reject you if you are not visibly a member of their group. An academic could be shot down hitting on a biker chick regardless of how either of good looking or ugly either of them is just because they are not in each other's groups.




I do not believe in the Hitch movie theory that anyone can sweep anyone else off their feet given the right broom. But I also don't believe that people should only attempt to pair up with mirrors of themselves.

There is no "should". There is no formula. There is just finding the person with whom you are compatible. Attempting to find a foolproof algorithm will fail.

Ratae, I don't quite understand why you make so many threads concentrating on people's appearances. Especially when you yourself are a good-looking man based on your photo. I do think it is other issues that you should be working on than your appearance, if you feel you have a problem with attracting a potential partner.

I will tell you what I believe- men and women are attracted to completely opposite things. I will elaborate:

Women are attracted by being emotionally stimulated- whether that is through humor, playful teasing, seduction, flirting, drama, etc and so forth. The way to a woman's heart is through her emotions. Also women like and are attracted to strong, confident men, who know what they want in life, and aren't afraid to be honest and transparent with them. They also look for men who can financially and emotionally support them, particularly in the cases of "baby mamas", as they are known, or women who are single of varying ages who have kids, and need financial and social support.

There are always exceptions to rules- you will have women who are only attracted to a guy because of his good lucks, money, or other things. But they are generally a minority. Mostly, it is about emotional support, emotional stimulation (positively- in the sense of showing how much you love/care for a girl, showing love through time spent with her, physical touching (non-sexual), etc).

Men, on the other hand, are initially attracted to a girl/woman because of her physical appearance, and how beautiful or attractive she is physically. There are some theories as to why guys do this, but the main theory is this- that when a man sees an attractive woman, subconsciously, he is sexually attracted to her because she has good "genes", and has the necessary assets to perform the act of child birthing and raising children (ex. being well endowed, wide hips, slender frame, etc), which would pass his genes, and her best genes off to the next generation. Men have a conscious and subconscious need to mate and produce offspring, we are wired that way.

So, in essence, men and women are attracted to two different things. Men are attracted to physical beauty, women are attracted to confidence, emotion stimulation, and emotional/financial stability. Women typically are a lot more compromising than men are, which gives us somewhat of an advantage, if used properly.

If a woman rejects you, it could be for a number of reasons- she's married, she's dating someone, she had a bad day, someone close to her died, she's embittered about men, she's stressed, etc and so forth. There are also those instances where she thinks she is hot s**t, and deserves only the best looking guys, but if she is like that, she isn't worth your time or energy, move on!

No, in regards to your question, it isn't unreasonable to go after average to moderately attractive to gorgeous girls, even if you think you're unattractive. It is all in the way you present yourself, and whether you stimulate her emotions in a positive way. If so, she'll like you, and she will be receptive for a friendship, or potentially dating down the road.

If you think you are unattractive, there are ways to fix that! Just in the same way that women wear makeup to hide their flaws and imperfections, men can do things to "boost" their appearance. I would suggest looking at buying clothes that are practical, and popular (like Affliction style shirts). I would highly recommend buying a pair of nice casual shoes, like a pair of Sketcher's Cool Cats or Tom Cats for example. A little cologne, a nice haircut, and stylish clothes can bring out the best look in anyone

I go on who is showing interest in me and then see if I can make myself like them. With some people I can't force it, there's no spark there, with others, personality will make up for a shortfall in looks and with others still the looks are good but then often the personality won't be or they aren't available long term. I'll only pursue a person who has shown interest in me first though, as just going on who I fancied regardless of whether they'd shown interest or not would be foolhardy in my opinion. I can guarantee that most people I fancy won't fancy me back as they will generally have a wider field to play from.

A lot of men seem to make a beeline for the best looking woman in the room - this seems to me a very risky strategy unless you are already a proven great success with women. Obviously if you really like a person there's no harm in trying but I like to protect my ego hence only go after someone after some kind of a green light.

I believe in leagues and think most people know or should know where they are placed in the attractiveness league, purely from
the feedback they receive from others. If you don't know your league place you are likely to keep getting shot down by people who think you aren't in their league. I insitinctively knew I wasn't highly placed in any league so I always let other people show interest in me first - hence I didn't risk my ego. it's different for men though as they are generally expected to make the first move, but a woman will show a man whether she lieks him or not initially by being friendly towards him ie that's a good initial sign. Unfriendliness is not a good sign and indicates the person isn't open to being approached/asked out.

Then after friendliness there's flirting - another good sign. All the signs are there or not there and it's the man's job to interpret them. I've seen men being overly friendly to attractive women who have no interest in them at all but it's as if the man can't see it/doesn't want to accept it - it's enough for them that they fancy the woman and by the 'natural order of the world', just because they fancy the woman she must fancy them back. These men are either blind to feedback or idiots!

They have the right to want whatever they want, but they also have the right to look and not touch.

Victory!

sure, they can like whoever they want.

They didn't need your permission